Wow you're back to hating it, huh? Aw, sad. I like when Boppy is happy!!
I do agree that it was all resolved pretty tidily for Adama & Co., eh? I also loved the Gaeta/Baltar scene (although I still don't get whether it was for reals because how on Earth was Gaeta not restrained/in the brig for that convo? I mean Adama isn't that naive to let the leader of the rebellion just swan around untethered smoking cigarillos with Baltar in nicely appointed quarters, is he?)
Lee in the scene with the grenade?? ::DIES:: So hot and awesome. I haven't loved Lee like that in a long frakkin' time. Captain Apollo is indeed still in there somewhere.
Now let me defend my girl for a bit: Kara/Anders. Ouch. How shortlived was the Kara/Lee teamwork? Sheesh. As soon as Sam showed up, it was over. And then of COURSE he got melodramatically shot and bled all over her and she had to be All About Sam and abandon Lee again. There's only two ways this will end: 1) he dies the martyr's death I predicted and Kara never gets over it or 2) he recovers slowly and
( ... )
I still don't get whether it was for reals because how on Earth was Gaeta not restrained/in the brig for that convo? Yeah... I thought at first it was a flashback. Now could it be a dream? I guess the show makes so little sense though it could actually have happened
( ... )
I thought at first it was a flashback. Now could it be a dream? I guess the show makes so little sense though it could actually have happened. The writer's interview with Mo Ryan at the Chiago Tribune says it was supposed to be tricksy on purpose. Apparently it was real and in Gaeta's quarters (an RDM idea to make it tricksy. eh.)
the writing, which very clearly has wussed out on Kara making a clear decision or addressing any of the complex emotions between her and Anders. Ah yes. I think next week will be the end of the Kara/Sam romantic stuff. Just my spec.
Lee made it obvious he was there for Kara if she wanted him (in the brig scene). Ever since then she hasn't acted on it.Really? Hmm I didn't get that at all from the brig scene. I thought it was a "let me give you some confidence/kiss you goodbye so I can go play at destiny too." I wish they'd kept the extended bit with Aurora, that was a much bigger commitment between them I think and then I would've read it as Lee extending a promise of sorts to Kara. (But then the Lee/Dee
( ... )
then I would've read it as Lee extending a promise of sorts to Kara. I read it that way from the very beginning. But then Lee was still in character back then and I always felt in tune with him and understood him at an instinctive level. I certainly wasn't alone in reading it as Lee saying 'I respect that you're still married, but if/when you want me, I am yours'. I loved it. It's the last L/K anything I have loved. I'll end my personal canon there, I suspect because everything after that stings.
And yes, you see how the Lee/Dee made no sense? That's why I was so ragey about the stupid contrived writing. It made no character sense. And yet, that's where you run smack bang into the wall of 'give up, the writers will do what they want'. There's no character integrity at all.
f/how they resolve this total dictatorship they've worked their way into. Honestly? I don't think the writers see a problem with it.
he dies the martyr's death I predicted and Kara never gets over it No! She'll get over him. She loved Lee first. History books are gonna write about them, Bop. Yes.
it's ok to kill people without trial as long as you're the good guys. Sigh. Yes. I don't know who's good or bad anymore. Last night I was ragey and taking frakking names! Now I don't know. I like some of those people. It's all very bizarre.
After that, my only hope for liking anything else on this show is Lee realising that his father is a dick and there's no democracy and just taking charge himself and sorting shit out. What's the chances? Pfft.I don't know. What was that bit in Revelations about? About childen and parents? Though if the kids were going to take over, why not in this episode? And you're right. At least Gaeta gave Adama a farce of a trial. Gaius got a trial. My boy got a bullet, oh, don't even get me started
( ... )
Sorry, DB, it's a dealbreaker for me: Kara had to choose Lee while Sam was still alive. She didn't.
I think Gaeta's death is easier for me to process in some ways because I already hated Adama and all he stands for. It is harder for you because you love some of those people very much. Poor sweetie!
if the kids were going to take over, why not in this episode? Why not 5 episodes ago when Roslin was on the basestar? She should have died then, Lee should have remained president, and Kara should have deposed Adama for being an alcoholic lunatic. Just my personal opin there, obvy!
At least Gaeta gave Adama a farce of a trial. Gaius got a trial. My boy got a bullet, oh, don't even get me started. I know. That actually made me end the whole episode in total rage after having remained at a general level of 'meh' through the rest of it. It was predictable but it wasn't actively appalling until that final bit. But the fact that there was no trial just makes a farce of the whole show, as far as i'm concerned. You see... I have rage, just in
( ... )
And then of COURSE he got melodramatically shot and bled all over her and she had to be All About Sam and abandon Lee again. There's only two ways this will end: 1) he dies the martyr's death I predicted and Kara never gets over it or 2) he recovers slowly and they get back together and work through things. Either way, there goes my Kara again... Makes a farce of the kiss and Kara/Lee team stuff last week. She just wished he was Sam, let's face it.I think you're overreacting here Bop
( ... )
Oh, I can see I've caused some confusion. My issue is not with Kara's compassion for a dying husband, but with the contrived writing that sees not only Lee toying with Dee again, but also Kara realising her True Love for Sam just before he (I'm assuming) dies. Yes, the two of them have been treated equally by the writers. But I find both instances of writing absolutely ridiculously contrived and MASSIVE copouts on the part of the writers. Oh, how convenient that Kara doesn't actually have to address any of the complex issues in her relationship with Sam (he's a Cylon, he lied to her, she doesn't know who SHE is). I am angry because I predicted this would happen and it renders any Lee/Kara anything from now on a complete joke to me. I'm angry at the writers, not at Kara.
I have to admit I did miss the moment of 'pure understanding' that you spoke of. It felt more like Lee realising he couldn't count on Kara to me, but completely understanding why because she needed to be with her husband.
You might not like it but you better accept
( ... )
Lee toying with Dee again, but also Kara realising her True Love for Sam just before he (I'm assuming) dies. Yes, the two of them have been treated equally by the writers. But I find both instances of writing absolutely ridiculously contrived and MASSIVE copouts on the part of the writers.You see, Lee just having a drink with Dee I had no problem with, it made sense, since Kara wasn’t there. His long lingering kiss seemed very odd though which was definitely the fault of bad writing. With Sam getting shot in the middle of a mutiny and Kara having to stay with him there’s no oddness or contrived writing to me, it all feels very real and in character imo. I didn’t feel any vibes of Big True Love between them at all in this episode, so those are just your assumptions based on what exactly? - I bet they’re based on previous experience with L/K but they’ve changed a lot Bop. They’ve grown up. I believe that Kara won’t end up with a huge guilt complex over Anders getting shot or dying; a lot of people had died, it’s stronger than her and
( ... )
I must thank you for taking the time to write these comments. I am actually very moved. Very few people care enough to argue with me about BSG these days, and I appreciate you doing so when you think I'm overreacting. I probably am. I guess I need someone to slap me sometimes. I'm just so fed up and disappointed with the way the show cops out on the big issues and on the ships as well.
Lee just having a drink with Dee I had no problem with, I wouldn't have had so much of a problem with it if it hadn't been right after they found destroyed!Earth. There were so many big issues right then! I found it absurd that ANYone's reaction was to go for a semi-romantic drink.
With Sam getting shot in the middle of a mutiny and Kara having to stay with him there’s no oddness or contrived writing to me,You don't feel like they're trying to balance the scales? Lee got to have his Dee flirtation and then he died, now here's the other alternaship onscreen with the spouse endangered... bit coincidental? no
( ... )
Sorry you didn't like the ep, bop! I really did, despite the K/S stuff (my opinions about this are very similar to those of m_a_r_i_k_s and daybreak777). I really hope the show can redeem itself in your eyes by the end--it's holding its own with me at the moment
( ... )
Though Gaeta for the most part had very good points in his argument against Adama, I felt that was a bit unfair. Adama came back as soon as he had a chance of getting them off that planet. And he was completely against the fleet settling there in the first place, as well!Yes, one thing which I have found very well written is the way that Gaeta's arguments are largely extremely sound and fair but they veer into hyperbole around some particularly emotional issues. And that highlights how Adama's actions can appear in a different light to someone who isn't unquestioningly on his side. I find that very believable and interesting, while agreeing that it's not the whole truth. That was why, for me, I was desperate for a dialogue to be opened between the mutineers and Adama/Roslin. For there to be some explanation from A/R of how things had come about, some compassion... and for the mutineers to get a chance to voice their fears and anger and then come to a place where they needed to move forward together. HA! Instead we got this OTT
( ... )
in having NO dialogue at all between the authorities and those concerned about a Cylon Alliance, by simply saying 'you're wrong', they have lost my sympathy forever. Just a personal thing, I guess.No, I do see what you are saying. I was thinking this evening as I was driving home just about how much actually *talking* to the people would have helped. But Laura and Bill are still stuck in the way things used to be, much as they would deny this. Before the Colonies were destroyed, there was an immense distance between the president and the admiral of the fleet from the people (as there is here in our modern world)...and this was okay; anything less wouldn't have made sense then, really. But now, as Lee has said, they are a gang. The rules have changed, but these two haven't. I guess I both admire them for sticking to their guns and doing what they feel is right even when it's unpopular and even when others don't approve of how they're getting it done (leadership is hard, and BSG has done a great job of demonstrating just how hard, I
( ... )
how much actually *talking* to the people would have helped. I honestly do believe it would have made an immense difference. And maybe I'm naive, but I expected the mutiny to result in some dialogue. I expected there to be some horrible consequences, and probably for Gaeta to lose his life, but also for it to be a wake-up call for Adama or Roslin. Or if not for them, then for Lee to step in and realise that if he didn't take over, then things would really get out of control. I guess I'm just really disappointed that there was no sign of it causing any kind of change in approach for any of the authorities.
I guess I both admire them for sticking to their guns and doing what they feel is right even when it's unpopular and even when others don't approve of how they're getting it done I felt like that for a long time, but now there are two things which have caused me to lose faith in them. The first is that I don't really believe that the Cylon alliance IS in the humans' best interests--it still hasn't been clearly explained to me, let
( ... )
Comments 39
I do agree that it was all resolved pretty tidily for Adama & Co., eh? I also loved the Gaeta/Baltar scene (although I still don't get whether it was for reals because how on Earth was Gaeta not restrained/in the brig for that convo? I mean Adama isn't that naive to let the leader of the rebellion just swan around untethered smoking cigarillos with Baltar in nicely appointed quarters, is he?)
Lee in the scene with the grenade?? ::DIES:: So hot and awesome. I haven't loved Lee like that in a long frakkin' time. Captain Apollo is indeed still in there somewhere.
Now let me defend my girl for a bit:
Kara/Anders. Ouch. How shortlived was the Kara/Lee teamwork? Sheesh. As soon as Sam showed up, it was over. And then of COURSE he got melodramatically shot and bled all over her and she had to be All About Sam and abandon Lee again. There's only two ways this will end: 1) he dies the martyr's death I predicted and Kara never gets over it or 2) he recovers slowly and ( ... )
Reply
Reply
The writer's interview with Mo Ryan at the Chiago Tribune says it was supposed to be tricksy on purpose. Apparently it was real and in Gaeta's quarters (an RDM idea to make it tricksy. eh.)
the writing, which very clearly has wussed out on Kara making a clear decision or addressing any of the complex emotions between her and Anders.
Ah yes. I think next week will be the end of the Kara/Sam romantic stuff. Just my spec.
Lee made it obvious he was there for Kara if she wanted him (in the brig scene). Ever since then she hasn't acted on it.Really? Hmm I didn't get that at all from the brig scene. I thought it was a "let me give you some confidence/kiss you goodbye so I can go play at destiny too." I wish they'd kept the extended bit with Aurora, that was a much bigger commitment between them I think and then I would've read it as Lee extending a promise of sorts to Kara. (But then the Lee/Dee ( ... )
Reply
I read it that way from the very beginning. But then Lee was still in character back then and I always felt in tune with him and understood him at an instinctive level. I certainly wasn't alone in reading it as Lee saying 'I respect that you're still married, but if/when you want me, I am yours'. I loved it. It's the last L/K anything I have loved. I'll end my personal canon there, I suspect because everything after that stings.
And yes, you see how the Lee/Dee made no sense? That's why I was so ragey about the stupid contrived writing. It made no character sense. And yet, that's where you run smack bang into the wall of 'give up, the writers will do what they want'. There's no character integrity at all.
f/how they resolve this total dictatorship they've worked their way into.
Honestly? I don't think the writers see a problem with it.
Reply
No! She'll get over him. She loved Lee first. History books are gonna write about them, Bop. Yes.
it's ok to kill people without trial as long as you're the good guys.
Sigh. Yes. I don't know who's good or bad anymore. Last night I was ragey and taking frakking names! Now I don't know. I like some of those people. It's all very bizarre.
After that, my only hope for liking anything else on this show is Lee realising that his father is a dick and there's no democracy and just taking charge himself and sorting shit out. What's the chances? Pfft.I don't know. What was that bit in Revelations about? About childen and parents? Though if the kids were going to take over, why not in this episode? And you're right. At least Gaeta gave Adama a farce of a trial. Gaius got a trial. My boy got a bullet, oh, don't even get me started ( ... )
Reply
I think Gaeta's death is easier for me to process in some ways because I already hated Adama and all he stands for. It is harder for you because you love some of those people very much. Poor sweetie!
if the kids were going to take over, why not in this episode?
Why not 5 episodes ago when Roslin was on the basestar? She should have died then, Lee should have remained president, and Kara should have deposed Adama for being an alcoholic lunatic. Just my personal opin there, obvy!
At least Gaeta gave Adama a farce of a trial. Gaius got a trial. My boy got a bullet, oh, don't even get me started. I know. That actually made me end the whole episode in total rage after having remained at a general level of 'meh' through the rest of it. It was predictable but it wasn't actively appalling until that final bit. But the fact that there was no trial just makes a farce of the whole show, as far as i'm concerned. You see... I have rage, just in ( ... )
Reply
(The comment has been removed)
I would have been more moved by the death of the Quorum had they not always been so absurd in their Greek-Chorus-ness.
And yeah, um, it's going to be a damn empty meeting.
Reply
Reply
Reply
I have to admit I did miss the moment of 'pure understanding' that you spoke of. It felt more like Lee realising he couldn't count on Kara to me, but completely understanding why because she needed to be with her husband.
You might not like it but you better accept ( ... )
Reply
Reply
Lee just having a drink with Dee I had no problem with,
I wouldn't have had so much of a problem with it if it hadn't been right after they found destroyed!Earth. There were so many big issues right then! I found it absurd that ANYone's reaction was to go for a semi-romantic drink.
With Sam getting shot in the middle of a mutiny and Kara having to stay with him there’s no oddness or contrived writing to me,You don't feel like they're trying to balance the scales? Lee got to have his Dee flirtation and then he died, now here's the other alternaship onscreen with the spouse endangered... bit coincidental? no ( ... )
Reply
Reply
Reply
Reply
I honestly do believe it would have made an immense difference. And maybe I'm naive, but I expected the mutiny to result in some dialogue. I expected there to be some horrible consequences, and probably for Gaeta to lose his life, but also for it to be a wake-up call for Adama or Roslin. Or if not for them, then for Lee to step in and realise that if he didn't take over, then things would really get out of control. I guess I'm just really disappointed that there was no sign of it causing any kind of change in approach for any of the authorities.
I guess I both admire them for sticking to their guns and doing what they feel is right even when it's unpopular and even when others don't approve of how they're getting it done
I felt like that for a long time, but now there are two things which have caused me to lose faith in them. The first is that I don't really believe that the Cylon alliance IS in the humans' best interests--it still hasn't been clearly explained to me, let ( ... )
Reply
Leave a comment