I must thank you for taking the time to write these comments. I am actually very moved. Very few people care enough to argue with me about BSG these days, and I appreciate you doing so when you think I'm overreacting. I probably am. I guess I need someone to slap me sometimes. I'm just so fed up and disappointed with the way the show cops out on the big issues and on the ships as well.
Lee just having a drink with Dee I had no problem with, I wouldn't have had so much of a problem with it if it hadn't been right after they found destroyed!Earth. There were so many big issues right then! I found it absurd that ANYone's reaction was to go for a semi-romantic drink.
With Sam getting shot in the middle of a mutiny and Kara having to stay with him there’s no oddness or contrived writing to me, You don't feel like they're trying to balance the scales? Lee got to have his Dee flirtation and then he died, now here's the other alternaship onscreen with the spouse endangered... bit coincidental? no?
Like you don't see where I'm getting my perspective from, I don't really see why you feel there's space for optimism. Kara's stuck by Sam, even after she got back. She's still married to him, she sleeps with him, she stood with him when they found Earth... I think she loves him, deeply, completely. Otherwise we would have seen her avoid him.
To me it showed Kara acting like an officer in the truest sense of word staying with a wounded comrade whom she cares about and stays loyal to Ugh. I just can't agree there. Firstly, she's not staying with Sam because he's a comrade, she's staying with him because he's her husband. Secondly, as a fellow soldier, Sam has never been treated 'equally' by Kara. After he shot Gaeta did he get disciplined? no, he got to go on an away mission with her. She favours him the same way she used to favour Zak. She's not objective here at all. And that doesn't mean she's a terrible person, it's normal to feel this way, I imagine. But I can't view her actions as those of a 'good officer'.
I'm really impressed with how moved you were by this scene. I feel like I should watch it again and try to see it through your eyes. I really didn't see what you are talking about at all. I did see Lee trying to be honourable and do the right thing--and I believe he had genuine compassion for Sam, who I know he respects (foolishly!).
I wish I could still be in the raptures you're in.
I must thank you for taking the time to write these comments. I am actually very moved. Very few people care enough to argue with me about BSG these days, and I appreciate you doing so when you think I'm overreacting.
Yep, I care about you finding the show enjoyable at least to some extent. I’m very sorry you’re disappointed and I’m just sharing my positive perspective as I know that it might help slightly even if you don’t feel the way I do and don’t agree with me ;)
I’d had my highs and lows with BSG, there were moments of desperation for me similar to yours in the second half of S2 and in S3, so I understand the state of mind you're probably in. I’ll just continue to disagree with you and point you out the reasons why if you don’t mind.
There were so many big issues right then! I found it absurd that ANYone's reaction was to go for a semi-romantic drink.
I see. But the way I perceive it is that Lee was also shocked with this revelation about Earth. His dad started drinking, Roslin completely shut out the external world around her… There’s a moment when you can’t react, you can’t make further decisions or deal with those big issues at hand, you have to just come out of that state of numbness and utter disbelief and I think Lee’s coping mechanism here was this need to talk to someone close enough that had to be satiated. Dee was that someone, because there wasn’t any other person available at that moment and she’s technically his wife and they’ve come a long way together. It made sense to me up until the point when he kissed her, which was Moore’s stupid manner to reinforce the drama of her suicide.
now here's the other alternaship onscreen with the spouse endangered... bit coincidental? no?
Sure it’s not a coincidence, Lee and Kara have to deal with their spouses before they can even attempt to give each other another chance - and I’m sure this is where it’s coming. Of course it’s a trite move to make a spouse take a bullet and have Kara sit beside his bed. I’m not saying I like it. But I believe that the mortal danger Sam’s in is the only way for her to start addressing the problems that she’s been avoiding to face out of confusion and fear.
Like you don't see where I'm getting my perspective from
Oh I see it, Bop. I could focus on all the worrying aspects as well if I wanted too. But all in all, I just see this differently and I’m not trying to make you change your mind, I’m merely sharing my standpoint.
She's still married to him, she sleeps with him, she stood with him when they found Earth... I think she loves him, deeply, completely. Otherwise we would have seen her avoid him.
I disagree completely. She’s been avoiding him since her return! Yes she’s married to him, she didn’t exactly have time to ‘unmarry’ him with her visions and obsession about Earth, did she? She slept with him only because he kept pushing and that was a totally ugly… old-Kara behavior under huge stress when she was about to lose her frakking mind. But don’t turn a blind eye to the fact that she told him their marriage had been a joke, an attempt for her to escape since day one! That’s a huge admission for Kara and that’s what really matters. As for standing with him when they found Earth, Bop… this is absolutely jealous Lee talking in you! :)) Just try to come out of Lee’s perspective of hurt pride and heart and see the real picture. She didn’t CHOOSE to stand with Anders, she chose to have a quiet moment alone and come to the memorial hall and stand with Kat… or the memory of Kat and all those people she knew that gave their lives for the dream of Earth that Kara thought humans were about to see coming true. It was like a quiet prayer… a few minutes to honor their memory and their sacrifice, a very private moment… And Sam approached from behind and invaded that private space for a hundredth time because he doesn’t seem to get that Kara Thrace is done with him. Just rewatch it! The expression on her face changes when she notices him by her left side, she doesn’t look at him, her body tenses and she clenches her jaw.
Firstly, she's not staying with Sam because he's a comrade, she's staying with him because he's her husband.
She’s staying with him because he’s her husband and a fellow crewmate. All I’m saying is that she would’ve done the same thing for ANYone. Had it been Helo to get a bullet, she would’ve stayed with him all the same!
Lee just having a drink with Dee I had no problem with,
I wouldn't have had so much of a problem with it if it hadn't been right after they found destroyed!Earth. There were so many big issues right then! I found it absurd that ANYone's reaction was to go for a semi-romantic drink.
With Sam getting shot in the middle of a mutiny and Kara having to stay with him there’s no oddness or contrived writing to me,
You don't feel like they're trying to balance the scales? Lee got to have his Dee flirtation and then he died, now here's the other alternaship onscreen with the spouse endangered... bit coincidental? no?
Like you don't see where I'm getting my perspective from, I don't really see why you feel there's space for optimism. Kara's stuck by Sam, even after she got back. She's still married to him, she sleeps with him, she stood with him when they found Earth... I think she loves him, deeply, completely. Otherwise we would have seen her avoid him.
To me it showed Kara acting like an officer in the truest sense of word staying with a wounded comrade whom she cares about and stays loyal to
Ugh. I just can't agree there. Firstly, she's not staying with Sam because he's a comrade, she's staying with him because he's her husband. Secondly, as a fellow soldier, Sam has never been treated 'equally' by Kara. After he shot Gaeta did he get disciplined? no, he got to go on an away mission with her. She favours him the same way she used to favour Zak. She's not objective here at all. And that doesn't mean she's a terrible person, it's normal to feel this way, I imagine. But I can't view her actions as those of a 'good officer'.
I'm really impressed with how moved you were by this scene. I feel like I should watch it again and try to see it through your eyes. I really didn't see what you are talking about at all. I did see Lee trying to be honourable and do the right thing--and I believe he had genuine compassion for Sam, who I know he respects (foolishly!).
I wish I could still be in the raptures you're in.
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Yep, I care about you finding the show enjoyable at least to some extent. I’m very sorry you’re disappointed and I’m just sharing my positive perspective as I know that it might help slightly even if you don’t feel the way I do and don’t agree with me ;)
I’d had my highs and lows with BSG, there were moments of desperation for me similar to yours in the second half of S2 and in S3, so I understand the state of mind you're probably in. I’ll just continue to disagree with you and point you out the reasons why if you don’t mind.
There were so many big issues right then! I found it absurd that ANYone's reaction was to go for a semi-romantic drink.
I see. But the way I perceive it is that Lee was also shocked with this revelation about Earth. His dad started drinking, Roslin completely shut out the external world around her… There’s a moment when you can’t react, you can’t make further decisions or deal with those big issues at hand, you have to just come out of that state of numbness and utter disbelief and I think Lee’s coping mechanism here was this need to talk to someone close enough that had to be satiated. Dee was that someone, because there wasn’t any other person available at that moment and she’s technically his wife and they’ve come a long way together. It made sense to me up until the point when he kissed her, which was Moore’s stupid manner to reinforce the drama of her suicide.
now here's the other alternaship onscreen with the spouse endangered... bit coincidental? no?
Sure it’s not a coincidence, Lee and Kara have to deal with their spouses before they can even attempt to give each other another chance - and I’m sure this is where it’s coming. Of course it’s a trite move to make a spouse take a bullet and have Kara sit beside his bed. I’m not saying I like it. But I believe that the mortal danger Sam’s in is the only way for her to start addressing the problems that she’s been avoiding to face out of confusion and fear.
Like you don't see where I'm getting my perspective from
Oh I see it, Bop. I could focus on all the worrying aspects as well if I wanted too. But all in all, I just see this differently and I’m not trying to make you change your mind, I’m merely sharing my standpoint.
She's still married to him, she sleeps with him, she stood with him when they found Earth... I think she loves him, deeply, completely. Otherwise we would have seen her avoid him.
I disagree completely. She’s been avoiding him since her return!
Yes she’s married to him, she didn’t exactly have time to ‘unmarry’ him with her visions and obsession about Earth, did she? She slept with him only because he kept pushing and that was a totally ugly… old-Kara behavior under huge stress when she was about to lose her frakking mind. But don’t turn a blind eye to the fact that she told him their marriage had been a joke, an attempt for her to escape since day one! That’s a huge admission for Kara and that’s what really matters. As for standing with him when they found Earth, Bop… this is absolutely jealous Lee talking in you! :)) Just try to come out of Lee’s perspective of hurt pride and heart and see the real picture. She didn’t CHOOSE to stand with Anders, she chose to have a quiet moment alone and come to the memorial hall and stand with Kat… or the memory of Kat and all those people she knew that gave their lives for the dream of Earth that Kara thought humans were about to see coming true. It was like a quiet prayer… a few minutes to honor their memory and their sacrifice, a very private moment… And Sam approached from behind and invaded that private space for a hundredth time because he doesn’t seem to get that Kara Thrace is done with him. Just rewatch it! The expression on her face changes when she notices him by her left side, she doesn’t look at him, her body tenses and she clenches her jaw.
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She’s staying with him because he’s her husband and a fellow crewmate. All I’m saying is that she would’ve done the same thing for ANYone. Had it been Helo to get a bullet, she would’ve stayed with him all the same!
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