Comments | nnoinel: The Validity of NnoiNel / A NnoiNel Manifesto Mark 2

allelujah in nnoinel

The Validity of NnoiNel / A NnoiNel Manifesto Mark 2

Feb 05, 2011 12:15

NnoiNel Manifesto Mark 2
by femmelujah

Largely a response to several doubts, and aging nearly 3 years, I have made some addendums to my opinions and felt some things about NNoiNel needed to be restated as well as redone.

( And so it begins..again! )

nnoinel, manifesto

Comments 29

(The comment has been removed)

allelujah February 5 2011, 18:49:37 UTC

I'm glad I could do something for you in nnoinel! If you ever want to do an AU fic trade, feel free to send me something sometime haha.

Thanks for reading. I can be very long winded and I'm always glad for feedback

Writing this as I read... hinodeh February 5 2011, 18:22:54 UTC

Actually, there's a better way to prove that Nnoitra didn't want to kill Neliel when he attacked her ( ... )

Re: Writing this as I read... allelujah February 5 2011, 18:46:31 UTC

That's honestly what I was trying to say. What my main point was that he didn't want to kill her in general as opposed to killing her in that instance. He didn't want to kill her in that instance and that doesn't even need to be proved- he dressed her in rags and threw her down to the base of Las Noches but did not kill her, so that particular instance doesn't really need proof imo

Re: Writing this as I read... hinodeh February 5 2011, 19:12:02 UTC

Ah, I just think that it was better to stress that he said that he expected to meet and fight here again. Since I actually saw the claim in the past that he attacked her so that he would never see her again, which was just patently wrong.

Re: Writing this as I read... allelujah February 5 2011, 19:16:11 UTC

Oh wow. That's a little...ridiculous. I might amend it with a note that you put that in. Thanks a ton!

hinodeh February 5 2011, 18:29:27 UTC

To be fair, I think that it's also possible that Nnoitra always taunts baby!Nel in a way he never does adult!Neliel because of this: http://www.mangareader.net/94-766-13/bleach/chapter-312.html

In this flashback, adult!Neliel tells him that he behaves like a child. So it very well could be that he reacts the way he does towards baby!Nel because Neliel has become in this instance what she accused him of being. Nevertheless, I agree that he's not happy about Neliel being in that form.

allelujah February 5 2011, 18:44:04 UTC

I don't really think so. She says it once but then he never brings it up. Notice how he refers to her calling him a beast? He is more worried about the way she refused to acknowledge him as a fighter. Otherwise he would have mocked her about her age or appearance, but instead it was him mocking her about how he beat her. It would have been clever had he mocked her age, but it doesn't feel that way.

hinodeh February 5 2011, 19:07:14 UTC

Ah, okay, you're right, I concede. That does make sense.

hinodeh February 5 2011, 18:36:31 UTC

Ah, I never saw it like that before, but you make some good points about how essentially Nnoitra does no longer try to kill Neliel very hard. Yeah, it does seem like he has come to enjoy fighting her, no matter the result, and even though he'd never admit it, he would be unhappy if it ever ended for good.

Thanks for that.

allelujah February 5 2011, 18:48:14 UTC

I also think that Nnoitra wouldn't mind it ending- but only if it resulted in Nel being the victor in an ultimate sense. If he made her angry enough to kill him, she'd have to acknowledge him. If he beat her, she'd have to concede to him and he would gain her acknowledgement. Nnoitra is seeking death, but not in a sense of winning in a battle. He wanted to lose and die gloriously- and Nel was never willing to give him that.

hinodeh February 5 2011, 19:10:33 UTC

I agree. I think what he despised the most was this limbo where he wasn't winning either way. Though, your observations about their reunion made me think that maybe that changed towards the end and he did come to enjoy the walk, instead of its destination. But he never realized it and likely wouldn#t admit it, anyway, if he ever did.

hinodeh February 5 2011, 19:06:06 UTC

Nnoitra's sexism: I personally understand why people think that he's sexist, what I do disagree with, though, is people casting sexism as the central conflict between Nnoitra and Neliel. It's not. In fact, he only ever says it once to Tesla but never to Neliel ( ... )

allelujah February 5 2011, 19:10:49 UTC

I completely agree. As always, you make for fun discussions hinodeh <3 And yeah, I really agree with your end point there. They can exist without each other but as we can see from Nnoitra, it annoys them. He obviously spent all that time doing small things to 'improve' himself and 'get stronger' when the only person criticizing him for it that we know of is a woman who's opinion he 'doesn't care about'. xD

hinodeh February 5 2011, 19:26:08 UTC

Thank you!

Well yeah, I understand why he was so annoyed. Here he had found the (in his POV) perfect way to deal with this miserable, depressing life: battleholism and no mercy, and along comes Neliel, who strives to be good, noble and protective, and also happens to be stronger than him. Her existence alone chanllenged his whole worldview and philosophy.

And Neliel was suddnly confronted with this crude, violent, cruel and suicidal guy who kept challenging her so that she would either kill him or so that he could win. There was no way she would prove this guy's view on life true, so she refused to validate his world view.