Well what's full disclosure? "I'm playing with so-and-so" or is it a detailed description of what's going to happen/what's been negotiated. I know personally that my partners and I have set limits, so all I need to know, and generally want to know, is the "Who, where, and when" as we've already come to an agreement on the what and how.
Well I suppose "full disclosure" can mean whatever it means to the people in the relationship(s), given whatever boundaries they've set, BUT, I think if you (please take all "you" to be the general "you," not the specific "you") know you're running around on someone behind their backs and you're not telling them anything, then you're being unethical and/or cheating.
I'd ask anyone who knows they do this to think about WHY they do it. If they don't tell their partner that they're seeing/playing with someone else becuase they think their partner will be upset/mad/flip out/whatever, then it's likely "cheating."
>I have irritated one play partner when I went to their spouse and asked if >it was acceptable because they felt it was that I did not trust them to be >honest. I informed her that it wasn't an issue of trust, it was an issue of >my own sake of mind, *I* have to know, so that if all goes bad that I >performed with due diligence.
Did you tell them before you did it that you were going to ask their spouse?
>So basically, I'd prefer if a long term play partner SO knows who I am, >how to get in contact of me, and the nature of the play. For a random >light one-off, I'm far more willing to trust the play partner to be honest >and forthwright.
How do you handle it when the play partner really wants to be divorced from knowing what is going on? Do you feel that is a bad sign IE more likelyhood of drama?
Is there some optimium (for you) level of relationship you want with the play partners partner, IE someone you say hi too, vs. friend etc?
I believe I did, and she said okay, but had gotten grumpy about it. But I might be misremembering as it was a while ago.
But basically, as I've stated since, I don't play telephone. If it is possible I want to get at least express blanket permission to play from the playdate's partner. Once again, so that if it blows up, I know I didn't do anything stupid.
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Depends on why. If they are uncomfortable with it, and aren't really okay with it, then it is drama. If the idea of BDSM squicks them, but they are otherwise okay with it, there's potential for drama but less.
Optimum? I'd probably go for at least a casual acquaintance. Someone that I can meet at a party and chat with idly. If they are trying to avoid me, or I them, then that is a bad sign™.
I have irritated one play partner when I went to their spouse and asked if it was acceptable because they felt it was that I did not trust them to be honest. I informed her that it wasn't an issue of trust, it was an issue of my own sake of mind
I'd call that distrust, but in my model of poly that kind of distrust is quite healthy - it keeps everybody honest. "Just play" is one thing, but I want anyone I'm serious about to meet geekchick ASAP. I'm happy to have partners "distrust" me in that way because, just as you say, it brings peace of mind.
You got me thinking about how much I trust play partners to be honest. I'm not as careful as with someone I want to date, but I do match the care to the seriousness of the play. I can be trusting at first because I start out fairly mild and only move up once I get to know them better.
I don't think this is very sticky either. Playing with others when you are monogamous is like kissing someone else (depending on the level of play I suppose).
Remember that one time when I get wasted and tied up by another guy? Yeah, bad news. I wouldn't quite say that was cheating because the intent wasn't there at all.
Anyway, I guess its fine if you have a general policy of openness, but I think that needs to be worked out between partners. There can be a "don't ask, don't tell" policy as long as it's SPOKEN policy and both people are aware.
Basically anything is fine as long as both partners consent, otherwise, no, it's cheating. Cheating does come in levels though. Sorta like grades of murder...
I'm poly and kinky, I try to be completely honest about everything and if I think something might be a sticking point, I ask. I love honesty and I'm also terrible at concealing things so for me, the best policy.
that's got a lot of shades of gray, but here's my take on it:
first and most importantly, i don't get involved in anything i perceive as cheating. period. i don't cheat, i don't help other people cheat. if there's no poly arrangement clearly stated, i don't get involved because somebody's going to get hurt. doesn't matter if it's just a kiss or as far along as getting ass-fucked: cheating is cheating is cheating, and beyond a friendly hug, somebody in a relationship with NO poly agreement is hands-off.
the only possible exception to that is situations like passing the cloven orange at beltaine, where both partners are aware of and involved in the game (or have given the other partner permission to participate, even if they're not). that kind of turns into the equivalent of a one-night kissing-poly agreement, you know?
IF, however, there's a poly agreement in place and i know what it is (and hopefully know both partners, or know people who know both partners and can verify that this is, in fact, the arrangement) i will get
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It makes me feel all ooogy.
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I'd ask anyone who knows they do this to think about WHY they do it. If they don't tell their partner that they're seeing/playing with someone else becuase they think their partner will be upset/mad/flip out/whatever, then it's likely "cheating."
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>I have irritated one play partner when I went to their spouse and asked if >it was acceptable because they felt it was that I did not trust them to be >honest. I informed her that it wasn't an issue of trust, it was an issue of >my own sake of mind, *I* have to know, so that if all goes bad that I >performed with due diligence.
Did you tell them before you did it that you were going to ask their spouse?
>So basically, I'd prefer if a long term play partner SO knows who I am, >how to get in contact of me, and the nature of the play. For a random >light one-off, I'm far more willing to trust the play partner to be honest >and forthwright.
How do you handle it when the play partner really wants to be divorced from knowing what is going on? Do you feel that is a bad sign IE more likelyhood of drama?
Is there some optimium (for you) level of relationship you want with the play partners partner, IE someone you say hi too, vs. friend etc?
Reply
But basically, as I've stated since, I don't play telephone. If it is possible I want to get at least express blanket permission to play from the playdate's partner. Once again, so that if it blows up, I know I didn't do anything stupid.
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Depends on why. If they are uncomfortable with it, and aren't really okay with it, then it is drama. If the idea of BDSM squicks them, but they are otherwise okay with it, there's potential for drama but less.
Optimum? I'd probably go for at least a casual acquaintance. Someone that I can meet at a party and chat with idly. If they are trying to avoid me, or I them, then that is a bad sign™.
Reply
I'd call that distrust, but in my model of poly that kind of distrust is quite healthy - it keeps everybody honest. "Just play" is one thing, but I want anyone I'm serious about to meet geekchick ASAP. I'm happy to have partners "distrust" me in that way because, just as you say, it brings peace of mind.
You got me thinking about how much I trust play partners to be honest. I'm not as careful as with someone I want to date, but I do match the care to the seriousness of the play. I can be trusting at first because I start out fairly mild and only move up once I get to know them better.
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Remember that one time when I get wasted and tied up by another guy? Yeah, bad news. I wouldn't quite say that was cheating because the intent wasn't there at all.
Anyway, I guess its fine if you have a general policy of openness, but I think that needs to be worked out between partners. There can be a "don't ask, don't tell" policy as long as it's SPOKEN policy and both people are aware.
Basically anything is fine as long as both partners consent, otherwise, no, it's cheating. Cheating does come in levels though. Sorta like grades of murder...
Reply
Reply
first and most importantly, i don't get involved in anything i perceive as cheating. period. i don't cheat, i don't help other people cheat. if there's no poly arrangement clearly stated, i don't get involved because somebody's going to get hurt. doesn't matter if it's just a kiss or as far along as getting ass-fucked: cheating is cheating is cheating, and beyond a friendly hug, somebody in a relationship with NO poly agreement is hands-off.
the only possible exception to that is situations like passing the cloven orange at beltaine, where both partners are aware of and involved in the game (or have given the other partner permission to participate, even if they're not). that kind of turns into the equivalent of a one-night kissing-poly agreement, you know?
IF, however, there's a poly agreement in place and i know what it is (and hopefully know both partners, or know people who know both partners and can verify that this is, in fact, the arrangement) i will get ( ... )
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