Those three examples you use are exactly the things that make me beam and love over this pairing. (That and how hurt Ichigo looked when he saved Orihime and she was afraid of him. I know people point to that as an example of why this pairing fails, but it's an example of why this pairing could be. Also, give the fucking girl a break, the last time she was this close to a Hollow mask her brother tried to eat her, okay?)
This was really fun to write, and I hated leaving that out, but this already wandered away from an anti rant to a pro rant. It was like -- the Ichigo/Orihime part just cheered me right out of my rant mode. XD
♥ And yes. Shut up about how the inner hollow scared her. That shows that she is human, and it would have made her far too perfect -- and boring -- if she had just smiled at him lovingly.
Plus, creepy.
Orihime doesn't need to be okay with the hollow. Ichigo is not okay with the hollow. If he met a girl who was wholly supportive of his psychotic subpersonality, I think it would be a bad thing. It would be very Miang-of-Xenogears.
I...I... I love you. *is bowled over by the intelligence and rationality of all arguments involved*
I was never a fan of Ichigo/Orihime until her midnight confession in the anime... Granted, I was never a huge romantic Ichigo/Rukia shipper either. (But my pairing is completely not-going-to-happen; I'm only holding onto it out of nostalgia at when the series was young enough for me to give me hope. I am speaking, of course, about Ichigo/Tatsuki. *shot*)
♥♥ And I'm right there with you. Her confession with Rangiku was what bowled me over and made me go, Whoa. Before then I honestly saw it only as a childish crush. But th, that scene.... ♥
These guys think that canon is on their side. At their most polite, they are of the condescending opinion that the idea of Ichigo/Orihime occurring in canon is hilarious and that anyone who thinks so is cute, in a retarded puppy dog kind of way. Not at all sure if you're referring to me but I'm sorry if that's the impression you get. I'm most often attacked for my "tone" instead of for my arguments and sometimes addressed as the Mz Thinks She's Da Shit. I'm really a nice person with strong opinions, and one of those happens to be that I don't think IchiOri has a snowball's chance in hell... well, maybe if Kubo works on it for a few years but it would take a lot to convince me. I can't speak for other IchiRuki shippers--I'm a multi-shipper, actually but I get attacked by anonymous petulant 13 year olds for things I write whereas more vehement IchiRuki shippers get into personal battles with people they actually engage , I suppose
( ... )
I win at "too long for LJ", so this is broken up even more than yours.
I am also a person with strong opinions; and I like to think of myself as nice. So we have that in common!
It was not expressly addressed to you. It was sparked off by your most recent post, but these are all thoughts I've had for at least the last year now. I completely disagree with you about the snowball's chance, obviously -- I rather think in the reverse. But these are things we both already know. ;)
(I suppose I am also a multishipper? It seems weird to say, because it seems weird to me that there could be any other type -- but yes, I like het pairings, and slash pairings, and femmeslash pairings. I am terribly fond of Ichigo/Orihime, but my major 'ship for this fandom is probably Aizen/Gin, and I'm very sad that there isn't more threesome with Tousen in there. I find Ulquiorra/Orihime interesting, I liked Ishida/Orihime at first, I like Renji/Rukia and Gin/Rangiku and Gin/Kira if it's evil. I like Rukia/Orihime a lot. Ummmm... Ichigo/Chad is adorable. And
( ... )
As for the "Japanese fascination with incest" -- a.) I guarantee you will find a lot of incest porn in American video shops, b.) most of the incest I've seen in recent years has been excited fic by Americans, and c.) I don't think KT's going to go there, because there is canonical implied horror for Orihime; remember, the manga established that her brother took her away from an abusive family.
3. I have two problems with this -- the first is that, as I said above, I think that Orihime's feelings have evolved out of the blind girlish crush that almost never gets reciprocated in real life; the second is that, as I said above, I think that regardless of what happens "in real life," Ichigo obviously reciprocates her feelings. It hardly matters whether cats are usually purple if you're staring right at a purple cat
( ... )
Ooooh, oooh oooh~ (waves masters thesis at Li) Another theme found throughout fairy tales is the lack of a mother, often due to death. (Enter EVIL STEPMOTHER...or fail caretaker. *shrugs*)
Ichigo: no mum (died) Ishida: no mum (died) Chad: no mum (died) Orihime: no mum (???) Rukia: uhuh Renji: yep, yep
4. The Ichigo charging at Ulquiorra out of crazy passion at the mere mention of Orihime's name is a scene IchiOri shippers read in only one way--Ichigo secretly loves her. Because I haven't seen any evidence before that he does and I HAVE seen evidence that Ichigo is a hothead and Ulquiorra was teasing, teasing the boy's goat here, I think Ichigo reacted very much in character. It was actually very much OUT of character for him to walk away from the fight previously, and this was to go towards Rukia. The scene that convinced me of IchiRuki (I was not convinced until 270) was Ichigo's turning around for Rukia and not engaging Ulquiorra in a fight until Ulqui just egged him on. The way I saw it, he essentially abandoned the mission for Rukia. He didn't ask Ulquiorra how Orihime was (she couldn've been tortured at this time for all he know) or where she was. He wanted to get past him to go to his destination (Rukia).
My posit: Ichigo is head-over-heels for Orihime. He just doesn't know it yet. This is the most lucid argument
( ... )
4. I suppose I would be shot if I said I didn't think there was really another way of interpreting it?
If you ask me, it's rather silly to say that heading off to save Rukia's life rather than responding to an offhanded comment ("So stubborn. Is it really okay for you to leave without killing me?") would have been out of character for Ichigo. I feel like, to make a statement like that is to forget that Ichigo is not an idiot. He isn't even really hotheaded. I mean, I know that the typical shounen hero is -- but Ichigo has shown himself to be capable of tremendous pragmatism.
Let's go back to the Soul Society arc and the example with Yoruichi again. It is true that Ichigo does attempt to just go through Byakuya in order to get to Rukia, ignoring Yoruichi's objections -- but that's because he was considerably cockier at that point, and he really thought he could beat him. He obviously, obviously wasn't taking Byakuya seriously. His attempt to attack the other man and finish their fight was not suicidal -- just misinformed. And when
( ... )
Now, let's contrast these examples with similar actions taken by Ichigo in reaction to Orihime.
Ichigo has been thoughtless ever since Orihime's kidnapping. He freaked out when he heard about it, and started screaming at Yamamoto, furious denials that she was dead, desperation, sweat all over his face. He left the vizard, abandoning his training in the middle, even though he knew he could only hold his hollow mask for eleven seconds. He tried to go alone, on what he must have known was a suicide mission, because by this point Ichigo is no longer cocky, no longer thinks he can handle whatever anyone throws at him -- he's had the crap beaten out of him by Grimmjow, and he's denied Renji's attempted reassurance. ("You're still alive, so you won." "Heh. Don't patronize me. This... wasn't a win.") Ichigo knows he isn't invincible, and he does these things anyway.
Then we have the scene with Ulquiorra, and his totally irrational (and uncharacteristic) leaping at the other man's throat. Remember: Ichigo thinks at this point that
( ... )
I appreciate all of your friendliness, and while I'm pretty sure, from what I've read of your posts, that you have a very thick skin, I apologize if it seems like I've responded to that by attempting to bite your head off, or anything. It was definitely my aim to be less a sweet, ditzy Ichigo/Orihime 'shipper, so if I've succeeded there, I'll be pleased -- but I don't want to snap teeth at anyone.
Basically: If you feel I have attacked you in any way, or otherwise been unpleasant, I will totally understand if I never hear from you again. :x And I've enjoyed this whole conversation.
(The "thick skin" comment was not meant to be goading -- just because you've got one doesn't mean you'll actively want to spend time around abrasive people.)
Comments 46
Word to everything.
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♥ And yes. Shut up about how the inner hollow scared her. That shows that she is human, and it would have made her far too perfect -- and boring -- if she had just smiled at him lovingly.
Plus, creepy.
Orihime doesn't need to be okay with the hollow. Ichigo is not okay with the hollow. If he met a girl who was wholly supportive of his psychotic subpersonality, I think it would be a bad thing. It would be very Miang-of-Xenogears.
Reply
I was never a fan of Ichigo/Orihime until her midnight confession in the anime... Granted, I was never a huge romantic Ichigo/Rukia shipper either. (But my pairing is completely not-going-to-happen; I'm only holding onto it out of nostalgia at when the series was young enough for me to give me hope. I am speaking, of course, about Ichigo/Tatsuki. *shot*)
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♥♥ And I'm right there with you. Her confession with Rangiku was what bowled me over and made me go, Whoa. Before then I honestly saw it only as a childish crush. But th, that scene.... ♥
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but gogo luffs Li~
((what is this secret fandom?? crazy girl...))
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((Oh no. Not telling~))
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((u so crazy. is it a fandom gogo knows? c'mon...a hint??))
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These guys think that canon is on their side. At their most polite, they are of the condescending opinion that the idea of Ichigo/Orihime occurring in canon is hilarious and that anyone who thinks so is cute, in a retarded puppy dog kind of way. Not at all sure if you're referring to me but I'm sorry if that's the impression you get. I'm most often attacked for my "tone" instead of for my arguments and sometimes addressed as the Mz Thinks She's Da Shit. I'm really a nice person with strong opinions, and one of those happens to be that I don't think IchiOri has a snowball's chance in hell... well, maybe if Kubo works on it for a few years but it would take a lot to convince me. I can't speak for other IchiRuki shippers--I'm a multi-shipper, actually but I get attacked by anonymous petulant 13 year olds for things I write whereas more vehement IchiRuki shippers get into personal battles with people they actually engage , I suppose ( ... )
Reply
I am also a person with strong opinions; and I like to think of myself as nice. So we have that in common!
It was not expressly addressed to you. It was sparked off by your most recent post, but these are all thoughts I've had for at least the last year now. I completely disagree with you about the snowball's chance, obviously -- I rather think in the reverse. But these are things we both already know. ;)
(I suppose I am also a multishipper? It seems weird to say, because it seems weird to me that there could be any other type -- but yes, I like het pairings, and slash pairings, and femmeslash pairings. I am terribly fond of Ichigo/Orihime, but my major 'ship for this fandom is probably Aizen/Gin, and I'm very sad that there isn't more threesome with Tousen in there. I find Ulquiorra/Orihime interesting, I liked Ishida/Orihime at first, I like Renji/Rukia and Gin/Rangiku and Gin/Kira if it's evil. I like Rukia/Orihime a lot. Ummmm... Ichigo/Chad is adorable. And ( ... )
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3. I have two problems with this -- the first is that, as I said above, I think that Orihime's feelings have evolved out of the blind girlish crush that almost never gets reciprocated in real life; the second is that, as I said above, I think that regardless of what happens "in real life," Ichigo obviously reciprocates her feelings. It hardly matters whether cats are usually purple if you're staring right at a purple cat ( ... )
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Ichigo: no mum (died)
Ishida: no mum (died)
Chad: no mum (died)
Orihime: no mum (???)
Rukia: uhuh
Renji: yep, yep
Anyway, was just butting in to agree w. you~
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4. The Ichigo charging at Ulquiorra out of crazy passion at the mere mention of Orihime's name is a scene IchiOri shippers read in only one way--Ichigo secretly loves her. Because I haven't seen any evidence before that he does and I HAVE seen evidence that Ichigo is a hothead and Ulquiorra was teasing, teasing the boy's goat here, I think Ichigo reacted very much in character. It was actually very much OUT of character for him to walk away from the fight previously, and this was to go towards Rukia. The scene that convinced me of IchiRuki (I was not convinced until 270) was Ichigo's turning around for Rukia and not engaging Ulquiorra in a fight until Ulqui just egged him on. The way I saw it, he essentially abandoned the mission for Rukia. He didn't ask Ulquiorra how Orihime was (she couldn've been tortured at this time for all he know) or where she was. He wanted to get past him to go to his destination (Rukia).
My posit: Ichigo is head-over-heels for Orihime. He just doesn't know it yet. This is the most lucid argument ( ... )
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If you ask me, it's rather silly to say that heading off to save Rukia's life rather than responding to an offhanded comment ("So stubborn. Is it really okay for you to leave without killing me?") would have been out of character for Ichigo. I feel like, to make a statement like that is to forget that Ichigo is not an idiot. He isn't even really hotheaded. I mean, I know that the typical shounen hero is -- but Ichigo has shown himself to be capable of tremendous pragmatism.
Let's go back to the Soul Society arc and the example with Yoruichi again. It is true that Ichigo does attempt to just go through Byakuya in order to get to Rukia, ignoring Yoruichi's objections -- but that's because he was considerably cockier at that point, and he really thought he could beat him. He obviously, obviously wasn't taking Byakuya seriously. His attempt to attack the other man and finish their fight was not suicidal -- just misinformed. And when ( ... )
Reply
Ichigo has been thoughtless ever since Orihime's kidnapping. He freaked out when he heard about it, and started screaming at Yamamoto, furious denials that she was dead, desperation, sweat all over his face. He left the vizard, abandoning his training in the middle, even though he knew he could only hold his hollow mask for eleven seconds. He tried to go alone, on what he must have known was a suicide mission, because by this point Ichigo is no longer cocky, no longer thinks he can handle whatever anyone throws at him -- he's had the crap beaten out of him by Grimmjow, and he's denied Renji's attempted reassurance. ("You're still alive, so you won." "Heh. Don't patronize me. This... wasn't a win.") Ichigo knows he isn't invincible, and he does these things anyway.
Then we have the scene with Ulquiorra, and his totally irrational (and uncharacteristic) leaping at the other man's throat. Remember: Ichigo thinks at this point that ( ... )
Reply
I appreciate all of your friendliness, and while I'm pretty sure, from what I've read of your posts, that you have a very thick skin, I apologize if it seems like I've responded to that by attempting to bite your head off, or anything. It was definitely my aim to be less a sweet, ditzy Ichigo/Orihime 'shipper, so if I've succeeded there, I'll be pleased -- but I don't want to snap teeth at anyone.
Basically: If you feel I have attacked you in any way, or otherwise been unpleasant, I will totally understand if I never hear from you again. :x And I've enjoyed this whole conversation.
(The "thick skin" comment was not meant to be goading -- just because you've got one doesn't mean you'll actively want to spend time around abrasive people.)
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