Christ, I can't believe I'm getting into this.

[acari]

This is a response to miladyhawke's post: What We Say We Stand For - Viggo/Orli & Domlijah Rant - What the Shit is this!? . I'm posting it here because it got way too fucking long.

Comments

[miladyhawke]

Appreciated your consideration for my journal. Not really necessary, but I'm kinda glad you brought it over here just because I wouldn't like to see people jump on you, though I'd like to think that wouldn't happen since you're being reasonable.

Anyhow, you have some good points in here (esp. because some V/O shippers were originally causing problems), and more and more my general impression is becoming that alot of the mess has to do with misunderstandings and miscommunications.

Some general points for discussion:
Why is it always the one addressing the issue that gets called a shit stirrer? Nobody would feel the need to speak up if everything was alright.There absolutely are bad apples out there, so you're right that everything isn't alright, but the problem people had with the OP is that she wasn't (until much later) talking about the few. You're right that she didn't create the larger issues, but I said that her post was making it worse by blaming all V/O believers. She said that ALL V/O believers are self-hating, psychotic

[missiedith]

Ok, I'm asking you because of all the opposition to the OP yours seems to be the most reasonable and direct response, and I'm asking you here because it feels a helluva lot safer than anywhere else. From where I'm sitting the other respondents just seem to have jumped on an idea of what it was about. Misunderstanding and miscommunication abounds, as you mentioned. Whilst I don't fundamentally agree with your position, I can certainly respect your behaviour and the points you have made. I'm not sure I could have conducted myself as admirably were I challenged on various of my viewpoints.

The problem I have is that I don't understand this belief issue. Your reply here has clarified the point for me even further, I'm not sure whether you realise the extent to which this word keeps appearing. For me, this is what it all boils down to, and I wrote a little about this on my blog. Why do you think people do it? Where does V/O belief come from? You said that you "personally believe that the things that drive their beliefs come from the most

[miladyhawke]

OMG, I think I love you. I'm ridiculously delighted that somebody actually wants to get a take on what V/O believers think about themselves, what they think predisposes them to this belief (aside from the conspiracy evidence). And I would love to do it; I can tell already that it's going to be fun and make me happy, reminding me why I love the pairings I do. And yep, belief is a key word. I'm not a true believer, but like the UFO poster behind Fox Mulder's desk says, I want to believe.

I'd love to come over, but it's almost three in the morning where I am now, and I need to go to bed. If you don't mind, I could come over tomorrow evening after work.

Btw, you're a sweetheart; I can't see anybody anywhere jumping on you. It is still a scary issue to get involved with though.

[missiedith]

Go sleep. I know well the perils of developing odd sleep patterns. Looking forward to reading when you're fresh and rested.

And re being jumped? Don't you believe it. I've been involved with a couple of different altercations upon one particular ViggOrli BNF's journal, and it was without doubt the worst experiences I've had online. I actually promised both the general ViggOrli community and myself that I would never get involved with that circle ever again in an attempt at peace and coexistence. This seems like enough of a fandom-wide discussion that I can hopefully be excused for expressing my views, however.

[nessa_t]

Don't mean to barge in uninvited, but I'm just so boggled by the animosity that resulted from Stewardess's commentary. I didn't actually think that people would take offence to one person's opinion, but there you go.

Still, I just want to say that I think you've stated a valid case and I agree with you and stewardess.

Thank you for voicing out what your opinions.

[acari]

Public post, yo. Comment away.

I agreed with Stewardess' post how it originally appeared. The postscript I don't completely subscribe to; the matter is more complicated, I think. It was added after I left my comment there. Still not sure what to do about that. *shrugs* Hence this posts and me trying to talk about it with people.

But yeah, it was one post, just one.

[nessa_t]

Hell yeah. I commented on the first part of her post as well and I generally disagreed with her at some points and we both agree to disagree so it was all cool

[acari]

Yeah, from what I gathered it was the postscript that rubbed people the wrong way. To a degree I can understand it, poorly worded overgeneralisation. She threw too many issues into the same pot and in the end people did only focus on the "viggorli believer = self-loathing woman hater", which is a shame since it was a really smart post otherwise.

Well, I'm a Viggorli girl at heart, have always been; 's just that my belief is pastede on yay! or something. *laughs*

People are just so damn emotional and up in arms right now.

re Carefully Kissed

The reason I banned her from CK is because a lot of writers there are Viggorli true believers and they pour a lot of love into their work. I did not feel that she should have the right to witness it. Was that fair, probably not. But I don't regret the decision, nor will I reverse it and I will not debate it with anyone.
Eruberueth in this thread.