Debate question & other.

[vvalkyri]

1) Resolved: That in a committed relationship one has responsibility /to one’s mate/ to take care of oneself as best as one can, in order to lessen the risk one’s mate will be left alone due to an otherwise preventable death.(Obviously people still get hit by buses, and the debate resolution as written above attempts to differentiate between the

Comments

[jdquintette]

. Then again, this is well known in the culture - people not taking risks b/c of small kids at home or what have you.

Only tangentally related to this, but I do have a friend who moved back to Canada when his wife got pregnant. They felt that since he was a freelance trumpet player and she worked contract jobs with no bennies that it was tantamount to child abuse to remain in this country if they couldn't provide their future child with health insurance.

[vvalkyri]

I can't fault them at all ;=/

[dcseain]

I think they did the right thing.

[vvalkyri]

Do you see a difference between, say, "stop $riskyactivityfrombeforemarriage" and "please don't start"*?

Or a difference between seeing $riskyactivity as a calculated risk vs, say, "your doc says if you don't do Y your chances of having another heart attack go up 3fold. You're not the only person affected by your having another heart attack"

(Interestingly, I see each of these as different, And there's yet another different situation, where the mate is already known nto have X health problem/history)

*positing motorcycle as $risky_activity

[vvalkyri]

Hm. I suppose with that last I could counter that in your case you are making those changes or not with a thought toward perceived risk - you don't consider the research conclusive, as opposed to agreeing that behavior X increases risk of health problem Y, but not changing behavior.

(and sure, I know all of this is a very muddy slippery slope, the same one leaving pregnant women freaking out about the pasteurized blue cheese dressing in the fridge or risking (!) random strangers telling them how awful they are if they take a sip of wine. Alcohol, for example, raises my already relatively high lifetime calculated risk of breast cancer. Am I disrespecting my mate if I have a second beer with dinner?)

[vvalkyri]

second part?

Hm. It's probably clearer to have written it from the other perspective, though more messy to write as a general discussion point: "I am reluctant to marry Z, because he engages in habits generally considered health-destructive."

(As opposed to "Z has X health problem, which more likely than not will kill him" -- in the latter case, Z is at least doing what Z can manage to forestall this outcome.)

Do you mean more that there's a problem if the only reason I bother with, say, heart health, is b/c my dying of a heart attack would upset my spouse? I wasn't really going for that angle, no.

[vvalkyri]

what about someone who doesn't do drugs but has no idea of hir bp/cholesterol? or never washes apples?

(that latter is me. oops.)

(I'm hoping people don't assume I have a conclusion I'm arguing toward)

[emeraldliz]

Entitlement always leads to disappointment.

I expect my partners to be true to themselves and honest to me about it. That's it. If they do X, I decide whether that's an acceptable risk, or compatible with my truth of self.

I want them to choose for themselves what they want. It might not always mean we can stay in a relationship, but no compromise of truth of self, ever. No matter how healthier or sweet or "nicer" we may want to judge it to be.

[vvalkyri]

[remember, I'm playing in thought experiments. and unfortunately i think i muddied the question by mentioning Dad and the helicopter]

Another way of putting it (which you've essentially pointed to here) is "is it reasonable to disqualify a potential mate for seeming to not take good care of himself"

(my original 'resolved' extrapolated from there to worry that the mate would therefore die earlier, e.g. from untreated heart disease)

[emeraldliz]

It's reasonable to disqualify a potential mate because they are wearing a purple polo shirt. So yeah :)

[selki]

I didn't break up with someone over what seemed self-destructive behavior, but I was *relieved* when we did break up.

Re your higher-up comment "Am I disrespecting my mate if I have a second beer with dinner?)" above, I'd be bothered if it turned out a partner had been regularly raising their cancer risk around me and I hadn't known about it. I would have wanted to have known, not to dictate of course, but to decide for myself if it bothered me.

[shadeofnight]

I think a few comments about kids do not fit into the first comment, as that is totally different

[vvalkyri]

Interesting. I may have muddied the waters a lot by mentioning Dad and the helicopter.

My thought experiment was more along the lines of the potential mate who won't control his diabetes or than the potential mate who wants to try swimming with sharks.

[shadeofnight]

From who's perspective?

Would I date someone that did not control their diabetes, or am I expected to control my diabetes for my partner.

That is what is getting lost on your message.

One is, I expect from my mate X.

The other is, for my Mate I feel I should do X (or not do X).

I can not tell what you are worried about, or trying to figure out.

Might need some clarification.

From your comment, it sounds like what you want to know is:

What actives do you expect from your mate else they are not "date"-able on a long term bases. Which is really different that the statement made in post.

[vvalkyri]

This post is for playing around with what ifs and thought experiments. It is not trying to send a message