Debate question & other.

[vvalkyri]

1) Resolved: That in a committed relationship one has responsibility /to one’s mate/ to take care of oneself as best as one can, in order to lessen the risk one’s mate will be left alone due to an otherwise preventable death.(Obviously people still get hit by buses, and the debate resolution as written above attempts to differentiate between the

Comments

[shadeofnight]

I think a few comments about kids do not fit into the first comment, as that is totally different

[vvalkyri]

Interesting. I may have muddied the waters a lot by mentioning Dad and the helicopter.

My thought experiment was more along the lines of the potential mate who won't control his diabetes or than the potential mate who wants to try swimming with sharks.

[shadeofnight]

From who's perspective?

Would I date someone that did not control their diabetes, or am I expected to control my diabetes for my partner.

That is what is getting lost on your message.

One is, I expect from my mate X.

The other is, for my Mate I feel I should do X (or not do X).

I can not tell what you are worried about, or trying to figure out.

Might need some clarification.

From your comment, it sounds like what you want to know is:

What actives do you expect from your mate else they are not "date"-able on a long term bases. Which is really different that the statement made in post.

[vvalkyri]

This post is for playing around with what ifs and thought experiments. It is not trying to send a message

[emeraldliz]

Fair to ask, not fair to expect. Presuming "fair" means ethical and reasonable.

If they WANT to change for me, ok. But it first and foremost must align with what they want.

[shadeofnight]

Craving bad food is almost biological, and not easy to stop. It takes great will power to do so, and that of course means losing will power in other areas.

“what you’re doing is telling me you don’t care for me?” What if she said “if you loved me you would….”?All of that is emotional blackmail. Bad form

[vvalkyri]

:half smile: and I was deliberately using known triggers in the lists of things the SO might say.

Thing is, were I she I'd probably very much feel that his actions implied a lack of regard for my well being, and not only for his own.

(but I'm also one of those people who will tell a suicidal person, "don't you dare do that to me")

[shadeofnight]

The problem is those are all selfish reasons for someone else to do what you wish for your benefit.

They do not solve the other persons problems, nor really help with the issues.

I also belief that no one should be so reliant on one other person that if they die, their own life crumbles to dust.

That is just unhealthy.

[vvalkyri]

So if you loved someone and she refused to ever wear her seatbelt you woudn't be at all upset with her?

[shadeofnight]

Upset with her? No...

But you make a bad case, because it is against the law, and I would not want a ticket.

I would be worried for her...

The rest is all in context.

Been nagging the back of my mind a while

[shadeofnight]

"don't you dare do that to me"

Short of "About time, go ahead, good riddance, what are you waiting for?" I'm hard pressed to think of a worse thing to say.

"Don't do that to me" speaks very loudly that your happiness, your convenience, and desire to avoid discomfort is far more important than whatever is bothering the person you're speaking to.

In spite of being nestled in a nimbus of genuine care that spawns the anger in that phrase, being told "your unhappiness is insignificant compared to my discomfort" and/or "you're not important" is probably not what they need/want to hear.

[selki]

I agree about what you describe as emotional blackmail. But I think “look, if you won’t do it for you, do it for me” is straightforward and can be effective (wouldn't be as effective on me if issued as a command, though).

Although not as direct, my sweetheart nudged me into making some improvements in self-care over time by explaining his worries, explaining the effects on him, and saying he wanted me around a long time. And I think that's OK.

[starfyrone]

Were Guy’s SO to tell him, “look, if you won’t do it for you, do it for me” would that be fair or not fair? Manipulative? Silly? What if she said “what you’re doing is telling me you don’t care for me?” What if she said “if you loved me you would….”?

All good examples of my first point below.
I've heard most all of those things said between friends.