Glastonbury 2010: I love Snoop Dogg the artist - but despise him as a man

[lilitu93]

Many of his songs are appallingly sexist. So why is feminist Julie Bindel such a fan of Snoop Dogg's music - and what did she make of his set

Comments

[102bb]

Julie Bindel, please be so kind as to shut the fuck up.

When I first heard Snoop's songs I hated the fact that so many were peppered with the "n" word, as well as the obligatory "bitch", "ho" and "motherfucker" - but I chose to ignore the lyrics.

Omg, Julie, SHUT UP. I don't even care about ~analyzing this shit. I'm just glad this white woman can look past the use of the n-word to enjoy Snoop Dogg's music. I'm also glad she has given us all permission to enjoy an art form primarily dominated by black people. THANK YOU, JULIE.

Oops, looks like she still hates Snoop Dogg. I'm so conflicted. I hope this white woman tells me what to do next.

[102bb]

I find it hilarious that she mentions right away that white people are sexist, too!! However, she devotes her time and energy to making sure we all know how bad "gangsta rap" is.

I listen to hip-hop. I love it to the very core of my being. I've listened to Three 6 Mafia since I can remember. I love Kanye. I love Jay-Z. I love Ice Cube. I like some of the raunchiest, angriest hip-hop out there, and I'm not going to fucking apologize for it. There is sexism and misogyny in most music, and I'm not going to boycott an art form that has served as a means of expression for black people for decades because of that. There are problems within hip-hop and they often reflect a deeper issue in the black community, and we'll deal with it on our own, JULIE. Thank you.

[pocochina]

I think there is a discussion to be had about how white young men REALLY seem to love misogynist hip-hop (which is not all hip-hop) EVEN MORE than misogynist white dude music. Really, I don't think that cultural phenomenon is because hip-hop is awesome (THOUGH IT IS, obvs), but that some young white men a) want to excuse their raging misogyny by b) scapegoating it onto black men and therefore c) excusing their racist ideas about black folks, particularly black men. That is an interesting discussion about capitalizing art and music, particularly politicized art and music, for the consumption of modern masculinity and construction of mainstream (read: systemically racist) culture. That, I think, would be worth looking at? But "Snoop Dogg sometimes uses naughty words" isn't much of a revelation, IMO.

i'm sorry. i have a lot of feelings on this issue

[102bb]

I can pretty much guarantee you that if a white feminist writes something on how problematic music is, she will focus on HIP-HOP.
You are being irresponsible when you talk about how toxic hip-hop is and how much Snoop Dogg or whoever hates women. We aren't going to turn on our brothers, no matter how hard you try, and don't think we don't see what you're doing. Stop trying to create a rift between black women and black men, people. Stop. You spew this fucking bullshit in an attempt to what? To unite us women against bad music? You're only hurting black women. You're only further ostracizing the black women who, for whatever reason, have chosen to remain part of the movement. STOP.

Re: i'm sorry. i have a lot of feelings on this issue

[seasontoseason]

There are some problems with this article but I don't think that the author is necessarily trying to tell others to stop listening to hip hop, or to "turn their backs" on anyone. She's telling us about her mixed feelings, and the decision she came to. She's also presented us with the thoughts of other women on the subject, and she didn't paint their opposing opinions or their love of hip hop as bad or ridiculous. she certainly didn't instruct black women particularly to stop liking or supporting hiphop

Re: i'm sorry. i have a lot of feelings on this issue

[102bb]

The very fact that she chose to write this piece on a black artist and a primarily black art form speaks volumes. You can keep looking for her to admit that she was motivated to write this piece because she's a big racist before you acknowledge how insensitive and culturally ignorant she is, but I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you. She, much like other white feminists, will continue to tear down hip-hop under the guise of caring about women and how they feel, similar to the way white people attack ebonics in the hope of protecting language. She, much like other white feminists, will continue to address how interactions between the black community make them feel, as if anyone should care. What what they won't do, however, is admit that they are so quick to attack rappers because they are racist. Stop taking this article at face value. The way she talks about hip-hop, her word choices, are incredibly reflective of the way she views the entire genre. She likes it even though it's evil and that Snoop Dogg "hates all women." To discuss

Re: i'm sorry. i have a lot of feelings on this issue

[seasontoseason]

fair enough.

I don't disagree with the bulk of that, only the idea that there is no way in which hip hop is part of mainstream (read: white and black [and everything else besides]) culture and, as an extension of that, the idea that a white person can't or shouldn't analyze hip hop.
Still, I'm not claiming that Bindel is the person to do it, nor am I claiming she did a very good job.

[freebacon]

Why don't we talk about all the misogyny in rock music too.

I'm looking at you Nickleback :|

[boomstick]

No, don't look at Nickleback. If we ignore them maybe they'll go away!

[freebacon]

I AM LOOKING AT THEM.

AND.

I AM JUDGING THEM.

/judgejudgejudgejudgejudge :|

[gretchystretchy]

Ew, Nickelback.

(Do they even count as "rock" or "music?")

[ombredelarue]

I like Serge Gainsbourg and Michel Houellebecq. It's like I'll forgive misogny if the writers are eloquent and French :/

[lilitu93]

I don't know Houellebecq, but I do love Gainsbourg, and I also like Nick Cave, who hasn't exactly avoided writing misogynistic lyrics himself.

[lilitu93]

That's one of his songs that goes too far for me too. And it doesn't help that Charlotte Gainsbourg inherited her singing 'talent' from her mother, not her father (though I like Jane Birkin's singing even if it's technically not that proficient). Which is really shallow of me to be as bothered by that as the content, I know.

[fabnana]

This writer is ridiculous. The sheer fact that she brought up that in England, rap's largest demographic is white people, in a country that is 90 PERCENT WHITE, is laughable. I think England's discourse surrounding its individual problems with racism are far less developed and nuanced than in the US. There's not much of an anti-racism community online, even with the growing threat of the BNP and the idea that a white person writing about something in the black community might be problematic, will fly over most people's heads. I used to read the Guardian for about 5 years and this kind of analysis is depressingly familiar