I just can't get over the fact that you can't use rape as a metaphor for something else without dealing with the fact that it's rape, and the show... doesn't seem to get that.
I don't understand this sentence. What do you believe they're using rape as a metaphor for in the show?
Because I don't get that vibe. I feel that the Dollhouse itself (and thus the staff and clients) is meant to representative of a dehumanizing/abusive viewpoint, but the instances of rape don't feel as though they're meant to represent anything else to me.
It feels to me like they're using rape as a metaphor to explore identity issues, and the dolls' fractured identities, rather than dealing with rape qua rape.
Ah, whereas I feel like they are also exploring identity issues, but never backing away from the creepy/ickiness of what the Dollhouse does. Especially, for instance, in the Paul/November(/Mellie or Annabeth, etc) scene, it seemed to me that both the show and Paul were fully aware that it was rape.
But yeah, if that's not something you get out of the show, I can see how it would really bother you on a fundamental level.
I feel like they get it occasionally, but that is mostly overshadowed by things like wanting us to empathize with Topher, or acknowledging that they can't ever let the dolls progress, because then the concept is screwed.
It's just a very weird disconnect for me to watch sometimes.
Note: I stopped watching Dollhouse after the first episode (I have a very low tolerance for a lot of things, even if it's Joss), so I have no idea what you're talking about.
Nonetheless, jumping right in, I am of the analytic opinion that in creative works, you can't use rape as a metaphor for other things and still have anyone think you consider women people. You can use other things as metaphors for rape, but in our culture, first we have to deal with the fact that women aren't actually objects. Then we can start making complicated arguments about things. (Man-hating feminists unite!)
I had to leave a comment just to use the icon. :-)
For me, I feel like Joss and the writers (sans Fox) get and are trying to portray just how creepy the Dollhouse - and the dehumanizing of individuals - is. But I totally respect you and others who just find it skeevy. I'd much rather have folks of your opinion that the other. Those who find nothing disturbing in the concept worry me.
Which leads me to the fact that Dollhouse may end up having the divisive, messed up fandom to trump all others. I say that because in the limited amount of fic I've read, there are those who get the creepiness that is always present in all things Dollhouse and there are those who don't get it at all and are writing fic that skeeves me out. Very much the spectrum of responses seen in "Man on the Street".
See, I think on the one hand, Joss and the writers are aware, but I think they're not *as aware* of how it comes off. Like, sure, this place is dehumanizing and creepy, but now we want you to sympathize with the guy who does the mindwiping because he's lonely! Uh, no.
Yeah, I was so skeeved by this ep, more so than usual (and I find this show pretty skeevy). Honestly, I think the premise--the existence of a Dollhouse, the agent trying to take it apart, etc.--would work much better as a film. It's hard to continue addressing the "this is rape and murder" angle week after week, so I think the show doesn't, most of the time. And the whole Paul/Mellie thing? *shudders*
(Are we supposed to believe that people get their lives back after five years? We've seen this offered to at least two people now, but do we have any evidence one way or the other?)
This last Dollhouse was just awful. I was just bored and then Paul Ballard does what he does and I'm like, um, no, ugh, I guess they going with he's only human or some such lameness but it makes hard to root for him. And rooting for the Doll's is hard because we rarely/or never see who they really are.
Also after finally enjoying a few episodes for them to kill off Reed's Dominic, then come back after a week off with this boring and troublesome episode. Just ick.
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I don't understand this sentence. What do you believe they're using rape as a metaphor for in the show?
Because I don't get that vibe. I feel that the Dollhouse itself (and thus the staff and clients) is meant to representative of a dehumanizing/abusive viewpoint, but the instances of rape don't feel as though they're meant to represent anything else to me.
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But yeah, if that's not something you get out of the show, I can see how it would really bother you on a fundamental level.
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It's just a very weird disconnect for me to watch sometimes.
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Nonetheless, jumping right in, I am of the analytic opinion that in creative works, you can't use rape as a metaphor for other things and still have anyone think you consider women people. You can use other things as metaphors for rape, but in our culture, first we have to deal with the fact that women aren't actually objects. Then we can start making complicated arguments about things. (Man-hating feminists unite!)
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For me, I feel like Joss and the writers (sans Fox) get and are trying to portray just how creepy the Dollhouse - and the dehumanizing of individuals - is. But I totally respect you and others who just find it skeevy. I'd much rather have folks of your opinion that the other. Those who find nothing disturbing in the concept worry me.
Which leads me to the fact that Dollhouse may end up having the divisive, messed up fandom to trump all others. I say that because in the limited amount of fic I've read, there are those who get the creepiness that is always present in all things Dollhouse and there are those who don't get it at all and are writing fic that skeeves me out. Very much the spectrum of responses seen in "Man on the Street".
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(Are we supposed to believe that people get their lives back after five years? We've seen this offered to at least two people now, but do we have any evidence one way or the other?)
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Also after finally enjoying a few episodes for them to kill off Reed's Dominic, then come back after a week off with this boring and troublesome episode. Just ick.
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