THE FIRST COMMENTelanor_xApril 16 2010, 21:16:38 UTC
The rest 2 pages of this chapter are dedicated to Bill's talk with Harry about his deal with the goblin (Bill understood that much & guessed it wasn't for free), which can be summed up in 2 words: "Don't cheat."
A couple of interesting to me moments:Bill says that he has goblin friends, "as far as there can be friendship between wizards and goblins", which in RL means not much. Too long history of distrust and presently continuing conflicts? Or inherent, irreconcilable differences between different species, partly because of goblins' hard nature? You decide
( ... )
Re: THE FIRST COMMENTsunnyskywalkerApril 16 2010, 21:49:26 UTC
The goblin ownership/banking thing really does not sound as murky and complicated as the characters make it out to be. Do the goblins tell the wizards to give the objects back at the leaser's death or not? If so, then wizards are in violation of contract, and that's that. They can decide not to buy tiaras etc. from goblins if they don't like the terms. If they don't know those are the terms... well, then why don't they? Obviously wizard bank employees know, so can't be that secret, and keeping it secret wouldn't make much sense if goblins really wanted their stuff back. (And did Gryffindor steal it the sword or not? Are we just supposed to assume Griphook made it up because he's an angry goblin while Gryffindor has a talking hat as a character witness
( ... )
Re: THE FIRST COMMENTelanor_xApril 18 2010, 11:05:24 UTC
Do the goblins tell the wizards to give the objects back at the leaser's death or not? If so, then wizards are in violation of contract, and that's that.
Imagine you buy an object from a goblin that unknowing of the craft's secrets wizards would never be able to create. May be there (almost) isn't a wizard market for it at all, since not many buy this specific thing, like the sword, and those who do prefer to go to goblins. Even if the maker would agree to sell, not lend, the thing, what about his relatives with different views? What about other goblins, like Griphook, who doesn't seem to be related to Ragnuk the First, yet voices disapproval at the sight of both tiara & the sword? Wizards just seemingly decided to ignore goblins on this matter, as long as they can.
Of course, wizards know about goblins' terms! I think they even study it at History of Magic together with Goblin Rebellions.
I also don't understand why it isn't an option to try just telling GriphookYes, I wanted to write about it in my recap too. That's what I would
( ... )
Ron wonders whether DD wanted them to interpret the symbol in time, proving being "worthy" to get the Hallows, which sadly makes sense in this universe, but is the opposite of what DD wanted.
What exactly *did* DD want?
We know that Dumbledore's plan was for the Elder Wand to lose its power:
"Aren't you listening? Snape never beat Dumbledore! Dumbledore's death was planned between them! Dumbledore intended to die, undefeated, the wand's last true master! If all had gone as planned, the wand's power would have died with him, because it had never been won from him!"
Or maybe it was for Snape to get the wand:
"If you planned your death with Snape, you meant him to end up with the Elder Wand, didn’t you?"
"I admit that was my intention," said Dumbledore, "but it did not work as I intended, did it?"
"No," said Harry. "That bit didn't work out."Is there anything that clearly shows what Dumbledore's original plan was? In any case, it certainly wasn't for *Harry* to gain ownership of the wand
( ... )
Planning for Severus to get the wand with its power would have been the most idiotic plan ever, because Voldemort could have become Master of the Elder Wand completely by chance, without even knowing it, simply by demanding that Severus surrender his wand (even his regular one) to him at any time over the course of the year. Which would have been even more likely if Severus were to carry and use Dumbledore's wand. Did Severus know not to do so? He wasn't told to keep the wand out of Voldemort's reach in any way.
The whole backbone of Deathly Hallows - that Dumbledore had set up a 'plan' for the Trio, with clues in Hermione's book of fairy tales about the Deathly Hallows - is a fatal error, since he had no time to change his will before he was killed by Snape on the tower. His plan was to die undefeated (or grant it to Snape); Snape killed him; end of story. So the trail of clues that Harry followed like a pet poodle in DH couldn't have been set up by Dumbledore in the first place; Dumbledore had no time to write a new will after
( ... )
You've laid out the absurdity of the "quest" really well. I would only add a few things:
1) At the time Dumbledore left his clue, he already possessed two of the three objects and Harry possessed the third. He could have just left Harry the damn wand in the first place and Harry would have had all three items by the sixth chapter of DH.
2) Dumbledore had to leave that clue for Hermione to find because Harry was too stupid to realize it was a clue, had he even bothered to open the book that his beloved mentor left him. (Other books from Dumbledore that he never bothered to open: All the ones about Horcruxes and how to destroy them.)
3) Harry lost the stone before he got the wand and before the wand could have possibly recognized him as its "master." Therefore, he never was the Master of Death.
He could have just left Harry the damn wand in the first place and Harry would have had all three items by the sixth chapter of DH.
Harry wouldn't have been the 'master' of that wand, though (crazy though that sounds).
Other books from Dumbledore that he never bothered to open: All the ones about Horcruxes and how to destroy them.
Harry never even thought to acquire those books in the first place, or muse that they might exist! It was Hermione who - *cough*unbelievable*cough* - thought to poke her wand out of her dormitory window and say 'accio books to solve all of our problems please'.
Harry lost the stone before he got the wand and before the wand could have possibly recognized him as its "master." Therefore, he never was the Master of Death.
Mary Sue fanficurbanman1984April 17 2010, 11:40:49 UTC
>>HP FIC:
(Voldemort and the main heroine)
[Mary-Sue] -What have we been talking about on the whole?
[V] - About my Salazar Slytherin's sword.
- Decide for yourself: whose sword it is yours or in the end Slytherin's.
- Slytherin's.
- Well, then it doesn't belong to you, but to the Slytherin's House. Do I explain clearly?
- Yes… I mean, no!
-So yes or no?
- It's my sword, I am Slytherin's heir!- Voldemort slowly started getting hysterical.
- Did he write in his will, that he passes down his sword to you?
-No!
-And how do you know that you are descended from Slytherin at all?
-I am the only Parselmouth in the world!...
-Stop! Harry and I freely speak Parseltongue too. It isn't a proof.
-Aaaaaa! Give the sword! <<
Deathly Hallows was such a mess that it resembled fragments of middle-of-the-range fanfictions, copied and pasted straight from fanfiction.net and then hurriedly pieced together.
Comments 12
A couple of interesting to me moments:Bill says that he has goblin friends, "as far as there can be friendship between wizards and goblins", which in RL means not much. Too long history of distrust and presently continuing conflicts? Or inherent, irreconcilable differences between different species, partly because of goblins' hard nature? You decide ( ... )
Reply
Reply
Imagine you buy an object from a goblin that unknowing of the craft's secrets wizards would never be able to create. May be there (almost) isn't a wizard market for it at all, since not many buy this specific thing, like the sword, and those who do prefer to go to goblins. Even if the maker would agree to sell, not lend, the thing, what about his relatives with different views? What about other goblins, like Griphook, who doesn't seem to be related to Ragnuk the First, yet voices disapproval at the sight of both tiara & the sword? Wizards just seemingly decided to ignore goblins on this matter, as long as they can.
Of course, wizards know about goblins' terms! I think they even study it at History of Magic together with Goblin Rebellions.
I also don't understand why it isn't an option to try just telling GriphookYes, I wanted to write about it in my recap too. That's what I would ( ... )
Reply
What exactly *did* DD want?
We know that Dumbledore's plan was for the Elder Wand to lose its power:
"Aren't you listening? Snape never beat Dumbledore! Dumbledore's death was planned between them! Dumbledore intended to die, undefeated, the wand's last true master! If all had gone as planned, the wand's power would have died with him, because it had never been won from him!"
Or maybe it was for Snape to get the wand:
"If you planned your death with Snape, you meant him to end up with the Elder Wand, didn’t you?"
"I admit that was my intention," said Dumbledore, "but it did not work as I intended, did it?"
"No," said Harry. "That bit didn't work out."Is there anything that clearly shows what Dumbledore's original plan was? In any case, it certainly wasn't for *Harry* to gain ownership of the wand ( ... )
Reply
The whole backbone of Deathly Hallows - that Dumbledore had set up a 'plan' for the Trio, with clues in Hermione's book of fairy tales about the Deathly Hallows - is a fatal error, since he had no time to change his will before he was killed by Snape on the tower. His plan was to die undefeated (or grant it to Snape); Snape killed him; end of story. So the trail of clues that Harry followed like a pet poodle in DH couldn't have been set up by Dumbledore in the first place; Dumbledore had no time to write a new will after ( ... )
Reply
1) At the time Dumbledore left his clue, he already possessed two of the three objects and Harry possessed the third. He could have just left Harry the damn wand in the first place and Harry would have had all three items by the sixth chapter of DH.
2) Dumbledore had to leave that clue for Hermione to find because Harry was too stupid to realize it was a clue, had he even bothered to open the book that his beloved mentor left him. (Other books from Dumbledore that he never bothered to open: All the ones about Horcruxes and how to destroy them.)
3) Harry lost the stone before he got the wand and before the wand could have possibly recognized him as its "master." Therefore, he never was the Master of Death.
Reply
Harry wouldn't have been the 'master' of that wand, though (crazy though that sounds).
Other books from Dumbledore that he never bothered to open: All the ones about Horcruxes and how to destroy them.
Harry never even thought to acquire those books in the first place, or muse that they might exist! It was Hermione who - *cough*unbelievable*cough* - thought to poke her wand out of her dormitory window and say 'accio books to solve all of our problems please'.
Harry lost the stone before he got the wand and before the wand could have possibly recognized him as its "master." Therefore, he never was the Master of Death.
Nice one!!!! I love it!!
Reply
(Voldemort and the main heroine)
[Mary-Sue] -What have we been talking about on the whole?
[V] - About my Salazar Slytherin's sword.
- Decide for yourself: whose sword it is yours or in the end Slytherin's.
- Slytherin's.
- Well, then it doesn't belong to you, but to the Slytherin's House. Do I explain clearly?
- Yes… I mean, no!
-So yes or no?
- It's my sword, I am Slytherin's heir!- Voldemort slowly started getting hysterical.
- Did he write in his will, that he passes down his sword to you?
-No!
-And how do you know that you are descended from Slytherin at all?
-I am the only Parselmouth in the world!...
-Stop! Harry and I freely speak Parseltongue too. It isn't a proof.
-Aaaaaa! Give the sword! <<
Deathly Hallows was such a mess that it resembled fragments of middle-of-the-range fanfictions, copied and pasted straight from fanfiction.net and then hurriedly pieced together.
Reply
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