Re: THE FIRST COMMENTsunnyskywalkerApril 16 2010, 21:49:26 UTC
The goblin ownership/banking thing really does not sound as murky and complicated as the characters make it out to be. Do the goblins tell the wizards to give the objects back at the leaser's death or not? If so, then wizards are in violation of contract, and that's that. They can decide not to buy tiaras etc. from goblins if they don't like the terms. If they don't know those are the terms... well, then why don't they? Obviously wizard bank employees know, so can't be that secret, and keeping it secret wouldn't make much sense if goblins really wanted their stuff back. (And did Gryffindor steal it the sword or not? Are we just supposed to assume Griphook made it up because he's an angry goblin while Gryffindor has a talking hat as a character witness?)
I also don't understand why it isn't an option to try just telling Griphook, "Look, we need the sword to destroy Voldemort, who's ultimately responsible for you being stuck in that basement for months so you probably don't like him either, so can we keep borrowing it until he's done for and then it's yours forever? We will write it in magically indelible ink on indestructible paper and sign it with witnesses, including any of your goblin friends if you can get ahold of them."
I read Lupin as someone dealing with a chronic illness and clinical depression who slips into major depressive episodes later in the series, so I'm pretty irritated that all his problems got dismissed with "Go home like the teenager says and act like there's no risk or any good reason to insist on helping save the world and then everything will be fine (honest!) until whoops, you die so we don't have to figure out what to do with you." It's a lot like Snape's arc, really.
Re: THE FIRST COMMENTelanor_xApril 18 2010, 11:05:24 UTC
Do the goblins tell the wizards to give the objects back at the leaser's death or not? If so, then wizards are in violation of contract, and that's that.
Imagine you buy an object from a goblin that unknowing of the craft's secrets wizards would never be able to create. May be there (almost) isn't a wizard market for it at all, since not many buy this specific thing, like the sword, and those who do prefer to go to goblins. Even if the maker would agree to sell, not lend, the thing, what about his relatives with different views? What about other goblins, like Griphook, who doesn't seem to be related to Ragnuk the First, yet voices disapproval at the sight of both tiara & the sword? Wizards just seemingly decided to ignore goblins on this matter, as long as they can.
Of course, wizards know about goblins' terms! I think they even study it at History of Magic together with Goblin Rebellions.
I also don't understand why it isn't an option to try just telling Griphook Yes, I wanted to write about it in my recap too. That's what I would've done first and if he refused, proceeded with Harry's plan. The end result couldn't be worse than Harry's.
RE: Lupin. JKR sort of created a new "clean", wonderful world at the end of the series by killing all major characters harmed by the war off. The Marauders and Snape needed healing (or jail in Peter's case). Some wounds can't ever be completely healed, like Sirius's imo. Probably only by taking all old veterans out of sight could the 100% happy ending JKR wanted be presented.
I also don't understand why it isn't an option to try just telling Griphook, "Look, we need the sword to destroy Voldemort, who's ultimately responsible for you being stuck in that basement for months so you probably don't like him either, so can we keep borrowing it until he's done for and then it's yours forever? We will write it in magically indelible ink on indestructible paper and sign it with witnesses, including any of your goblin friends if you can get ahold of them."
I read Lupin as someone dealing with a chronic illness and clinical depression who slips into major depressive episodes later in the series, so I'm pretty irritated that all his problems got dismissed with "Go home like the teenager says and act like there's no risk or any good reason to insist on helping save the world and then everything will be fine (honest!) until whoops, you die so we don't have to figure out what to do with you." It's a lot like Snape's arc, really.
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Imagine you buy an object from a goblin that unknowing of the craft's secrets wizards would never be able to create. May be there (almost) isn't a wizard market for it at all, since not many buy this specific thing, like the sword, and those who do prefer to go to goblins. Even if the maker would agree to sell, not lend, the thing, what about his relatives with different views? What about other goblins, like Griphook, who doesn't seem to be related to Ragnuk the First, yet voices disapproval at the sight of both tiara & the sword? Wizards just seemingly decided to ignore goblins on this matter, as long as they can.
Of course, wizards know about goblins' terms! I think they even study it at History of Magic together with Goblin Rebellions.
I also don't understand why it isn't an option to try just telling Griphook
Yes, I wanted to write about it in my recap too. That's what I would've done first and if he refused, proceeded with Harry's plan. The end result couldn't be worse than Harry's.
RE: Lupin. JKR sort of created a new "clean", wonderful world at the end of the series by killing all major characters harmed by the war off. The Marauders and Snape needed healing (or jail in Peter's case). Some wounds can't ever be completely healed, like Sirius's imo. Probably only by taking all old veterans out of sight could the 100% happy ending JKR wanted be presented.
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