Many east coaster's would like to smack you for such a comment. The economy in the east is in a terrible state and to take another industry away from the region makes more people go on welfare. This is an issue of animal rights over the rights of humans. Would you like more people in the east on welfare and going to food banks becuase of a lack of jobs becuase all resources in the east are drained or restricted?
it's an issue thats been fought over for 20 years and won't be fixed by a few letters to editors.
At the same time, please increase funding to make up for the starvation, the lack of gainful employment suffered by Martitimers and the intense predjudice we suffer because seals are cute.
Are you a vegan, by the way? Or do seals get different treatment because they're cute? (beautiful, to use your word) If that's your reason, mind if I call you shallow?
There are hundred of people who rely on these hunts for food and money. Is a seal's life worth any less then a cows? A pig?
Side note: many of those videos you see of sealers engaging in crulty have been proven to be fake. Ask yourself this: why would anyone intentionally ruin the meat and the all important seal coat with such acts of crulty? And why capture it on film?
Wait, wait, wait. I've calmed down. Sorry about that.
But the question stands: Have you ever considered this from the perspective of the people who rely on this fishery for food and financial security? That it's no different from any other commerical fishery or ranch? Or are you just going to condemn hundreds of thousands of people as brutal killers before even attempting to look at things from their opinion? Or shall you continue to rely on organizations that seek to villianify hardworking people for their own gain?
Reply to Hardmod and uncut-diamond:emilystarr1March 15 2004, 11:46:23 UTC
Firstly, I believe the human whoring of ALL animals is wrong. Cows, cod, elephants, seals, pigs, chickens, etc. And I fight for them all to stop.
Secondly, to the ones who rely on the hunt for food and money:
A) There is better food. Try it.
B) The hunt is no longer a viable source of income, but a 'tradition'. Some traditions have to die. Even former Newfoundland Fisheries Minister John Efford (to the Newfoundland Legislature)agrees there's no market:
"Mr. Speaker, I would like to see the six million, or whatever number is out there, killed or sold, or destroyed or burned. I do not care what happens to them. The fact is that the markets are not there to sell more seals. What they (the fishermen) wanted was to have the right to go out and kill the seals. They have that right, and the more they kill the better I will love it."
Hmph. As for oil and penises and other such excuses, there are better sources. As for the cod argument, seals eat cod predators.
As for the money brought in to these communities, there are better
( ... )
Re: Reply to Hardmod and uncut-diamond:uncut_diamondMarch 15 2004, 12:33:05 UTC
"Whoring?" That's an interesting choice of word.
A) There is better food. Try it No money means no buying "better" food, better being rather subjective in this context.
Can you put a date stamp on John Efford's quote? It's at least two to three years old. Is it not possible that a market's emerged since then? Or are things such as the economy as stagnant as the tired arguments marshalled an nausem every year?
As for oil and penises and other such excuses, there are better sources. Better? I'm not the type to use aphrodiacs, but I ask you again, who are you to impose your opinions on others
( ... )
Re: Reply to Hardmod and uncut-diamond:emilystarr1March 16 2004, 21:42:15 UTC
'Whoring' is just a personal slang term I use to mean a corruption and enslavement against the being's will.
"Better" food meaning, strictly, veggies. Although also I understand that many of the sealers don't eat the seal meat at all and leave it on the floes. Not economically worth it. Is seal eaten a lot there? Is it a ton cheaper than other alternatives? (Even if it is, by the way, I still oppose the hunt.)
Can you put a date stamp on John Efford's quote? -snip- Is it not possible that a market's emerged since then? Or are things such as the economy as stagnant as the tired arguments marshalled an nausem every year?
May 4, 1998. A bigger pelt market has emerged- but that doesn't make it right. And the market will swing down again - and I don't want my family's tax dollars going to subsidies that support the hunt. But Efford's quote, though out of date, shows how the big guys in charge really feel.
Better? I'm not the type to use aphrodiacs, but I ask you again, who are you to impose your opinions on others? Well, if it was
( ... )
Re: Reply to Hardmod and uncut-diamond:autosuggestionMarch 20 2004, 17:41:26 UTC
i for the most part agree, especially with the questioning of the term "whoring," which i find really disrespectful to sex workers.
also, assuming the seal hunt was only tradition (i know it's not), why does that make it less important? this comes up quite often in questions surrounding aboriginal rights, where (white) people claim that such things should be entirely eliminated without any regard for the cultures of people who have already had to deal with racist, assiminationist etc. policies.
While I find the notion of killing adorable baby seals upsetting, so do I find the reality of many Newfoundland families, whose fortunes have already been crippled by the collapse of the fisheries.
I urge you to develop reasonable guidelines for hunting quotas, seasons and humane methods of killing (no clubs, spears or axes, for example).
Too many clueless environmentalists--and worse, those who don't care if people they don't know starve--are unable or unwilling to consider the material implications of "justice."
For the record, I am a long-term NDP supporter. And queer activist. But my roots are working class, and I have friends in Newfoundland who find the rest of Canada's ignorance about these issues perplexing at best.
The collapse of the fishing industries surely has some relation to quotas on sealing...last time I checked, seals eat cod.
On the contrary, studies and analysis of stomach contents of harp seals indicate that cod is a very small part of a harp seals diet. The largest predators of young cod are in fact, other fish species, the same species that serve as the primary prey of the harp seals. In other words, the reduction of harp seal populations is resulting in the increase of fish that prey on cod, and this of course translates into less cod. http://www.seashepherd.org
Comments 22
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Reply
it's an issue thats been fought over for 20 years and won't be fixed by a few letters to editors.
Reply
At the same time, please increase funding to make up for the starvation, the lack of gainful employment suffered by Martitimers and the intense predjudice we suffer because seals are cute.
Are you a vegan, by the way? Or do seals get different treatment because they're cute? (beautiful, to use your word) If that's your reason, mind if I call you shallow?
There are hundred of people who rely on these hunts for food and money. Is a seal's life worth any less then a cows? A pig?
Side note: many of those videos you see of sealers engaging in crulty have been proven to be fake. Ask yourself this: why would anyone intentionally ruin the meat and the all important seal coat with such acts of crulty? And why capture it on film?
Reply
But the question stands: Have you ever considered this from the perspective of the people who rely on this fishery for food and financial security? That it's no different from any other commerical fishery or ranch? Or are you just going to condemn hundreds of thousands of people as brutal killers before even attempting to look at things from their opinion? Or shall you continue to rely on organizations that seek to villianify hardworking people for their own gain?
Reply
Secondly, to the ones who rely on the hunt for food and money:
A) There is better food. Try it.
B) The hunt is no longer a viable source of income, but a 'tradition'. Some traditions have to die. Even former Newfoundland Fisheries Minister John Efford (to the Newfoundland Legislature)agrees there's no market:
"Mr. Speaker, I would like to see the six million, or whatever number is out there, killed or sold, or destroyed or burned. I do not care what happens to them. The fact is that the markets are not there to sell more seals. What they (the fishermen) wanted was to have the right to go out and kill the seals. They have that right, and the more they kill the better I will love it."
Hmph. As for oil and penises and other such excuses, there are better sources. As for the cod argument, seals eat cod predators.
As for the money brought in to these communities, there are better ( ... )
Reply
A) There is better food. Try it No money means no buying "better" food, better being rather subjective in this context.
Can you put a date stamp on John Efford's quote? It's at least two to three years old. Is it not possible that a market's emerged since then? Or are things such as the economy as stagnant as the tired arguments marshalled an nausem every year?
As for oil and penises and other such excuses, there are better sources. Better? I'm not the type to use aphrodiacs, but I ask you again, who are you to impose your opinions on others ( ... )
Reply
"Better" food meaning, strictly, veggies. Although also I understand that many of the sealers don't eat the seal meat at all and leave it on the floes. Not economically worth it. Is seal eaten a lot there? Is it a ton cheaper than other alternatives? (Even if it is, by the way, I still oppose the hunt.)
Can you put a date stamp on John Efford's quote? -snip- Is it not possible that a market's emerged since then? Or are things such as the economy as stagnant as the tired arguments marshalled an nausem every year?
May 4, 1998. A bigger pelt market has emerged- but that doesn't make it right. And the market will swing down again - and I don't want my family's tax dollars going to subsidies that support the hunt. But Efford's quote, though out of date, shows how the big guys in charge really feel.
Better? I'm not the type to use aphrodiacs, but I ask you again, who are you to impose your opinions on others? Well, if it was ( ... )
Reply
also, assuming the seal hunt was only tradition (i know it's not), why does that make it less important? this comes up quite often in questions surrounding aboriginal rights, where (white) people claim that such things should be entirely eliminated without any regard for the cultures of people who have already had to deal with racist, assiminationist etc. policies.
Reply
While I find the notion of killing adorable baby seals upsetting, so do I find the reality of many Newfoundland families, whose fortunes have already been crippled by the collapse of the fisheries.
I urge you to develop reasonable guidelines for hunting quotas, seasons and humane methods of killing (no clubs, spears or axes, for example).
Too many clueless environmentalists--and worse, those who don't care if people they don't know starve--are unable or unwilling to consider the material implications of "justice."
For the record, I am a long-term NDP supporter. And queer activist. But my roots are working class, and I have friends in Newfoundland who find the rest of Canada's ignorance about these issues perplexing at best.
Reply
Reply
On the contrary, studies and analysis of stomach contents of harp seals indicate that cod is a very small part of a harp seals diet. The largest predators of young cod are in fact, other fish species, the same species that serve as the primary prey of the harp seals. In other words, the reduction of harp seal populations is resulting in the increase of fish that prey on cod, and this of course translates into less cod. http://www.seashepherd.org
Don't forget about overfishing, as well.
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