Be like a duck

[saravit]

"Be like a duck. Calm on the surface, but always paddling like the dickens underneath."
- Michael CaineMany people I know, especially those I call friends, are like this. They go about accomplishing their lives with quiet grace and dignity. Their lives are rich and they do not need to put it on public display for the world to see. That is because

Comments

[allofadoodah]

Well, of the people that heard of Sven being in the hospital (three of whom are sub-chieftains) no one contacted either him or his girlfriend at least to see how another member of the household who happens to be falling ill and eventually have surgery is doing. I don't feel it is fair to call Niqui immature or say she is throwing a tantrum when only two people in the entire household called Sven or her to find out what was going on and what condition he was in. Is that not possibly an obligation for sub-chieftains to at least further inquire about a fellow household member falling ill or a clearly upset girlfriend who is also a household member? It is one thing to consider your own needs and those of your family first but another to chastise someone for feeling a general lack of interest from those you should consider a member of the extended family who choose to belong to. Being overwhelmed in such a short period of time often does not afford a person the opportunity or frame of mind to have the forethought to reach out for help.

[mobiboros]

Is that not possibly an obligation for sub-chieftains to at least further inquire about a fellow household member falling ill or a clearly upset girlfriend who is also a household member?

I'm not a sub-chief but I have to ask why you'd think they would be obligated to contact people who are ill to inquire about their health? Especially when some of them aren't even in the state/may have never met the people involved.

Also, the slipping in of "Clearly upset" is disingenuous. As was made fair clear in the other thread it wasn't clear at the time but only made clear after the fact due to the nature of the "Grapevine".

[allofadoodah]

But people believing that she was ready to fly from New York to Oregon doesn't raise any flags about the condition he might actually have been in

[mobiboros]

But people believing that she was ready to fly from New York to Oregon doesn't raise any flags about the condition he might actually have been in?

Not really. Why would it? She loves him, I'd assume even something minor she'd want to be with him just as I'd want to be with my wife even for something minor.

Three sub-chieftains were in the room in New York state when Bliss told people about Sven,

No there weren't as I recall. There were only 2.

these people knew who they were talking about and all of them were once "camp mommy".

No they weren't. Of the 3 subchiefs who were even there that night only 2 have been camp mommy.

What is the point of the title if not to give responsibility to them as representatives of Turk's interests in the group?

And? How does this obligate them to call around for information? You're basically saying they are obligated to butt into people's lives. Which is not the case.

If there is cause for concern with members of the household who are sick to the degree his girlfriend would be

[allofadoodah]

In Niqui's eyes everyone failed her and it upsets me that even I know I failed her. I have only known her for three years, other people have known her for much longer than I have. She is my closest friend and I have been good friends with Sven since we were in High School. I know how much he cares for the people in the household. So much so that it encouraged me to take an interest. Sven and Niqui are some of the most important people in my life. Lately I have been seeing many short comings that deeply bother my own ideas of what the household was about. Some of my concerns have been alleviated through conversation with other 3 Skulls. I have a lot of respect for the people in 3 Skulls and defiantly for the sub-chieftains. I don't intend to directly attack just the sub-chieftains or even just the ones who had found out about Sven. Maybe I am confused about how the house manages how involved it gets in the health and welfare of other members. I certainly am about the role sub-chieftains play. Honestly, how do you judge when it is time

[mobiboros]

Look, it comes down to this. We're all still people. Do some of carry "Rank" in the household? Yes. Have we been tasked with certain responsibilities to the household? Yes. Are we all asked to uphold the household rules and traditions? Yes Can we go to any member, even ones we aren't friends with (And yes, we're not all friends.) and ask for help? Yes

[allofadoodah]

That is all well and good, however the main issue I had with the post was Saravit's remarks calling her immature and the overall holier than tao way he came off as well as the apparent agreement along with it.

[mobiboros]

And as I said, you are entitled to your opinion on that. I took offense at you laying perceived guilt on others.

My personal feeling is that the meaning of being an "Adult" is taking responsibility for your actions.

What this means to me (And why I agreed) in context of the original post is that adults ask for help or they don't. Asking doesn't necessarily mean stating clearly "I need help" but ones words and actions indicate whether a person does.

However as a corollary an adult doesn't get in peoples faces about not helping if there was not a clear indication help was needed. They thank those who did help them and accept that maybe people didn't know the whole situation and didn't dig deeper because a situation didn't seem to outwardly merit it.

[allofadoodah]

You are entitled to draw your own conclusions on that. It still does not make what was said that set me off any more uncalled for.

[volatilefiona]

How dare any of you pass judgment on the pain another person is going through like this is some kind of contest of who had the hardest life to overcome.Isn't that what you are doing? It sounds to me as though you are passing judgement on all of us

[allofadoodah]

When the response she gets is "suck it up", not necessarily from yourself but certainly from others. That I have a problem with.

[saravit]

1

[allofadoodah]

It is very clear that you are talking about that situation so don't turn it around like that. So don't give me that crap for starters

[saravit]

First off, this situation with Niqui isn't the only time someone expressed that they weren't getting enough sympathy for whatever reason. So wise up to the fact that I qualified the behavior I was talking about and made a generalized statement. The behavior is immature, not necessarily the person displaying it

[allofadoodah]

It still does not make what you wrote which set myself and others off any more uncalled for. If it was directed solely at Niqui or in general to all those immature throwers of tantrums. I'm not saying some people are not drama queens but this was not one of those times. It was never about self-pity, she was thinking of Sven feeling so removed from the household on the whole on top of everything she has been dealing with. Being upset enough how people found out then again from the dead quiet she heard in reply she took it as an insult to Sven that there was no interest in even finding out his condition. It was also my understanding that people were more interested in talking of rumors about Rigel than finding out anything more about Sven. And the people who called her and contacted her were largely those who had no knowledge of what had happened save one which I know of and even some who have more than enough going on in their lives offered help. You came to your own conclusions based on the information you had and then offended her.

[saravit]

Well, now that it becomes obvious that you're not willing to discuss the merits and flaws of what I've written but are rather more interested in waving your dick around to impress Niqui, I see no need to further regard anything from you having to do with this subject.

Thank you for the entertainment.