International Pagan Values Month--coming to Terms

[xi_o_teaz]

I've seen a few people posting about the International Pagan Values Month, including a very thought-provoking post by my good friend, sannion here. Despite my overall aversion to Philosophical discussions anymore, I feel myself somewhat drawn to this topic

Comments

[xi_o_teaz]

Some people and organizations are working toward this, but it is difficult to do when so many people only seem to be united in their rejection (no matter how vocal or apathetic it may manifest) of main stream religions, beliefs, values, culture, and practices.

Unfortunately, too few Pagans move past their rejection (and Identity of "Rebel") to find what they actually do believe in, and why.

[catsidhe]

So, the defining characteristics of a pagan are

* individualism
* active spirituality
* gnosis

As opposed to most major religions which emphasise communality, passive spirituality, and faith.

You probably already know that ‘pagan’ was used by the early Christians to describe non-Christians, as a term borrowed fromt the Roman legionnaires, for whom paganus meant ‘civilian’, which was jargon from the original meaning of ‘rustic, dweller in the countryside as opposed to someone who lives in a city, hick’. ‘Heathen’ is the Old English translation of pagan, meaning literally ‘someone who dwells in heath-land’, but with the same meaning as pagan in a religious context. (In the same way they translated ευαγγελιον into gõd-spell ‘good message’ > ‘gospel’.)

[xi_o_teaz]

So, the defining characteristics of a pagan are

* individualism
* active spirituality
* gnosis

As opposed to most major religions which emphasise communality, passive spirituality, and faith.

Roughly speaking I think that these "could be" "a few" of the defining characteristics of what most "Pagans" believe is important in their own Path.

Although "Personal Responsibility" is connected to "Active Spirituality," I don't think they are the same. It might be a bit misleading, however, to assume that most major religions emphasize "Passive Spirituality." Many people work very actively and diligently at being "good" Christians, Jews, Muslims, et. al. The Devotional Way of Religious Expression (typified by Bhakti Yoga) is stereotypically one of the most common Religious Paths for the simple fact that (IMHO) it takes the least amount of time and effort away from the more immediate aspects of survival, family-rearing, etc

[catsidhe]

I think the “Good {insert religion here}” thing is about active morality. When you look at the spirituality of most Abrahamics, there is an emphasis on religious services and private religious practice as a passive act: you do what God tells you to do because God and His representatives told you that this is the way to honour Him. Even prayer is passively asking God to do something, but there is no real expectation that it will then happen. Mysterious Ways, and all that. All religions, I think, have actively spiritual branches. Gnostics, Sufi, and Qabbalists all have a more active take on the feedback between religious practice and practical effect.

Canonically, Abrahamics are supposed to rely on Faith above Gnosis for their religious inspiration. Each of them has it written in their books that it is better to believe without proof, that this is a purer form of belief. This is not universally adhered to in practice, because it's hard for even a religion to turn off everyone's brains completely, and human brains work on evidence,

[xi_o_teaz]

Good points all around. There is still much swimming around in my head as I think on this...

All religions, I think, have actively spiritual branches. Gnostics, Sufi, and Qabbalists all have a more active take on the feedback between religious practice and practical effect.

Yes. They are Western versions of Mysicism. The West--in particular--has always been particularly harsh toward Mystical approaches to God, unless done within very minuscule versions. Even then, there are countless stories of Christian Mystics who were prosecuted. You don't find this in the East nearly as often, I don't think. You find more emphasis upon Mystical approaches in general (in many ways, Buddhism focuses as much upon Mysticism as popular 20th century American Christianity focused upon Devotional practices). I'm not sure I have a point right now, but I'm still thinking on this topic...

Thanks for continuing to provide thought-provoking dialogue, something missing far too often from LJ anymore, it seems.

[eldritch22]

There's almost no difference between polytheism and monotheism; look at the typical poly pantheon typically there's only one creator god, now look at a typical monotheistic system, no shortage of angels, demons etc. Also I've met countless 'pagans' who were just as small minded and dogmatic as a fundie member of a religion. A lot of them also have no shortage of identity issues, which is why some people buy into a lot of fluffy nonsense.

[xi_o_teaz]

There's almost no difference between polytheism and monotheism; look at the typical poly pantheon typically there's only one creator god, now look at a typical monotheistic system, no shortage of angels, demons etc.

Whilst I understand your position (I often hold it myself), I don't think it is fair to say that "there's almost no difference between polytheism and monotheism." Although there are definite similarities (the Catholics' veneration of the countless Saints and their "area of influence" particularly remind me of polytheism), I think that they are played out differently in the lives and beliefs of the followers.

I'm not sure I'm agreeing or disagreeing with you, beyond the fact that--in practice and for most Intents and Purposes--there are a great many differences betwixt MonoTheism and PolyTheism.

Also I've met countless 'pagans' who were just as small minded and dogmatic as a fundie member of a religion.No argument there. The problem comes from people generalizing (more truthfully, "demonizing") the outgroup in question

[eldritch22]

"I'm not sure I'm agreeing or disagreeing with you, beyond the fact that--in practice and for most Intents and Purposes--there are a great many differences betwixt MonoTheism and PolyTheism

[xi_o_teaz]

Thanks. I wrote this as I contemplated your post here. Part of me thinks that trying to look for similarities amongst a population that is by definition a "not-JudeoChristian" population, is rather a pointless endeavor.

Part of me has already noticed some patterns that have arisen from this chaotic stew, as I have just bolded in the original post, above ;-)