Comments | verasteine: Thoughts: What I Say Is True (And That Means You Should Believe It)

verasteine

Thoughts: What I Say Is True (And That Means You Should Believe It)

Feb 10, 2011 15:12

[Trigger warning for discussion of sexual assault.]

So, choice.

I've been following, off and on, the abortion debates that are going on in the United States. Like most American things, I kind of watch these things with a bemused distance, because the alternative is endless frustration with a system that's not even mine. And most of the time, I ( Read more... )

rl ate me, thoughts 3:equality, thoughts 5:politics, rl, frustration is for the frustrated, politics, touchy-feely stuff, thoughts, feminism: women are ppl too, me and my opinions

Comments 20

eumelia February 10 2011, 14:48:52 UTC

The whole abortion debate in the the States is sick. The whole way sex crimes are frames is sick everywhere.

Despite how far we've come in the West when it comes to women's rights, we're still considered second class citizens when it comes to the autonomy of our bodies and if that isn't basic human rights, I don't know what is.

In Israel a woman between the ages of 19-45 has to lie to committee made out of a GP doctor, a social worker and another doctor of different qualification in order to get an abortion - because under and over those ages the committee will automatically stamp an approval and over between that age bracket the only way to get an automatic approval is through rape, incest and a danger to the mother's health (mental and physical). Despite the fact that more often than not the committee will approve the requested the abortions, the fact that they exist is utterly fucked up.

verasteine February 10 2011, 14:59:49 UTC

Those committees are made worse by the fact that they're impersonal; how can three people who don't even know you decide about your life and health like that? God, that's awful.

Bodily autonomy would be a nice dream. What would also be a nice dream is knowing that a male doctor will believe me when I tell him my symptoms (don't get me started on that little can of worms.) In medical and justice cases, male privilege shows by far the most.

marita_c February 10 2011, 15:28:01 UTC

Argh, THIS.

When I was still living in Israel I had an orthodox Jewish GP who decided that my (very first!) UTI was "just stress" because he couldn't bring himself to ask a teenage girl if she's sexually active.

Thankfully he's not the rule, but at the time that was hardly comforting.

verasteine February 10 2011, 15:31:10 UTC

Oh, man. That's... Wow. That could potentially be really dangerous, if a doctor is unwilling to ask the important questions. And I can imagine that's not really reassuring either. It's tough enough to take stuff like that to a male doctor. To get fobbed off is even worse.

(This in opposition to the physiotherapist who refused to believe I hadn't been drunk and sprained my muscles due to alcohol-induced sleep. Oh, yes.)

Thread 6

eumelia February 10 2011, 14:50:06 UTC

Also, I remember the incident you wrote about last year.

*hugs* again.

verasteine February 10 2011, 15:00:11 UTC

*hugs*

I'm over it, now. But it took a long, long time. Thank you.

madder_rose February 10 2011, 14:55:59 UTC

This is all shit. And basically it implies that women are less able-minded than men. "Wait a while and see how you feel" really means "You're obviously not in the right state of mind, wait a bit and get your wits about you". It's my body. It's mine to decide what to do with. Teleen said it well: If I don't get to choose what I do with my body, then it's not my body, it's someone else's which means I am not fit to decide for myself. ARGH.

I hate that the assaulted person is always the one who has to prove the other person was the one who did the bad thing. Stealing is bad, hitting is bad, murder is bad, but when it comes to sexual assault old prejudices are revealed: women lie, women want it, women are just out to get men. I understand why we have these rules, but sometimes I hate it and think it's shit.

I'm sorry you had to feel that you were the one on the offense, not the person who assaulted you.

verasteine February 10 2011, 15:02:09 UTC

The worst bit about it is that it's men who are telling women that. Not people deciding that people don't know what they want, but men telling women. And yes, women are "too emotional". Ugh. My body, my choice. If not, that's not freedom. End of.

I understand the rules, too. And that's the worst bit of it. At the same time, mostly, the police was fantastic. But it were the things the law required of them, like the waiting period and the stupid questions, that were so negative.

thrace_adams February 10 2011, 19:38:26 UTC

I can't even pretend to understand why they couldn't take your report, why you had to wait that just doesn't even make sense to me.

It frustrates me and angers the hell out of me that gov'ts think women aren't able to make a decision that involves their body. Regardless of what that decision is.

verasteine February 10 2011, 19:50:32 UTC

The legal situation I was in is complicated and hard to explain, but it comes down to the idea that if you don't report a serious offence immediately, you must have your reasons, and you should think about it before you can make an official complaint. Because I chose my own safety over calling the police straightaway, they weren't able to take my complaint over the phone because only qualified vice officers can take serious vice reports. It's a bit messy, but comes down to I should have called the police as soon as it happened.

Your icon is very demonstrative, btw. Nice. :)

thrace_adams February 10 2011, 19:57:06 UTC

Well I still think that's shitty. I mean, you're supposed to report as soon as possible, I understand that, but then to make you wait even longer when you do? How does that make sense? The longer you wait, the more details you lose.

*sigh*

verasteine February 10 2011, 19:58:52 UTC

It is shitty. I get why they enacted the law, but it's unnecessarily difficult for complainants (or at least, I experienced it that way.) And the funniest thing is, they did take my statement straightaway, exactly because they didn't want to lose any details...

mysterypoet66 February 10 2011, 22:20:46 UTC

We have a Supreme Court Justice, (Scalia,) who doesn't think the 14th amendment (equal protection) of our constitution applies to women and LGBTQI citizens, and a Senate that wants to grant those protections to fetuses.

They want to give hospitals the right to refuse abortion care to save a woman's life.
They want to specify, "Forcible," rape and incest only under age 18.
I cannot explain how much rage I have. I'm literally shaking as I type this, because I know how much we look like fools to most of the rest of the world. For as much as ANY abrogation of the right to medical care, or, as you frame it (truly,) the right to be BELIEVED, is insane, we have raised turning a fetus into an object of fetish into an art form in the US. I expect them to start recommending chastity belts for women again, because that's what really bothers them. They cannot stand that a woman is entitled to full sexual agency and the protection thereof.

verasteine February 10 2011, 22:34:31 UTC

I've seen what's going on over there (even over here they teach Scalia in law school) and what the current debates are about. And yes, from my position it looks a bit... absurd.

we have raised turning a fetus into an object of fetish into an art form in the US is a good description of how it comes across, yes. I couldn't imagine that over here, yet over there it seems... normal? It's not that we have full equal rights here (that was my point, rather) but it is, I think, a bit better. Long ways to go, though, on both sides of the Atlantic.

mysterypoet66 February 10 2011, 23:27:24 UTC

I didn't know how much of the detail was making it into news for you. I know European media is a bit better than US at covering international events, but. . . There are people in the US, who don't know this stuff, (don't even get me started on that.)
There is a hugely long way to go. Women's rights are human rights, LGBTQI rights, are human rights, Children's rights, are human rights. The sooner all governments understand and implement fully equal HUMAN RIGHTS, the better off we will all be.
I am, btw - incredibly glad I never pursued my ambition to be a lawyer. I'm pretty sure my head would have imploded by now, from the sheer number of constitutional violations that occur in legislation.

verasteine February 11 2011, 10:07:49 UTC

I follow this US website for this type of news. Doesn't get everything, but keeps me well informed. As for internal US events, we basically get only the highlights, really, and these aren't it.

I graduated from law school, and I'm very happy I never pursued that any further, either. Human rights need to be respected and rarely are, and it's an uphill fight.