Book Club #1 - Leader of the Pack
Welcome to spnroundtable's first Book Club meeting. Pull up a chair, get comfy, get chatty, and have a good time.
The first story is Leader of the Pack by astolat [Dean/Sam, adult, 14,904 words]
I want this to be fun and interesting for everyone, so I'm going to start with the rules, because they're the basis of keeping it fun. There aren't many, so please read them CAREFULLY before joining in.
(1) Keep the discussion about the story, or aspects of the show relating to the story. NOT about the author or the rights and wrongs of wincest or any other tangent.
(2) Disagreement is fine - we'll all have different opinions. But please be polite with each other. "I don't agree with you about… because…" or "In my opinion…" are great. A blanket "You're wrong," or "You're an idiot," are NOT okay. I will delete comments or freeze threads if I spot any unpleasantness. Play nice.
(3) All anonymous comments are screened. I will NOT unscreen anonymous comments if there is no name on them, no matter what the content of the comment.
(4) Critique is welcome, squee is welcome, heavy meta is welcome, questions are welcome. Dig into the story, share what you love and what you didn't. Chat with each other about it, jump into threads that interest you. But always remember rules #1 and 2 - keep it about the story, not the author, and be polite.
A huge thank you to everyone who left comments on the link post. Incidentally, if you have any questions about the Book Club, the link post is the best place to ask.
Some thoughts and questions raised by innie_darling:
I like that it's clear that Dean went to the crossroads himself, without waiting to be tracked down. I know I've written that scenario myself, and I believe others have too. Does that seem more in character than fighting to the very end? How does Sam's absence/presence affect this? Does it also make sense that Dean tried to make sure Sam couldn't be there?
The description of Dean accepting his soul back is wonderfully light-hearted. Was that abrupt shift from the darkness before supposed to mimic the shift from gen to Wincest (Dean makes it clear that kissing Sam is new to him)?
Bela's initial offer is vague enough that I was expecting Dean to pay some random guy to give her the cunnilingus. Was this negotiation something that you felt was integral to the story?
I really enjoyed that Dean told Sam that Sam's level of demonic powers was something only Sam could control/decide.
I'd be interested to hear what people thought about Sam using his powers in the sex scene - is that something readers feel is necessary to show that Sam is not (and his powers are not) wholly bad?
And I'd also be interested to know the thought process behind having Sam fuck Dean, rather than the other way around. Is that something that the story's own logic dictates? Or is it simply the way the author sees the relationship going, in any circumstances?
Thoughts about the pacing from littledrop:
I have such mixed feelings about the pace of this story. I started out thinking the resolution of Dean's deal happened way too fast, but I absolutely loved where the story ended up. There was so much packed into such a short space. I don't know, mixed feelings indeed.
Some squee from arlad:
Oh, I *love* this story!
The first thing that got to me was this description of what Dean feels like when Sam gives him his soul back: something was pouring into him: like he was an empty cup filling up with cool cool water, so much it was splashing up over the sides and running wet and clean and sweet over his fingers, down his wrist on a hot summer day, laughing while they washed the car, Sam grinning at him soaking-wet on the other side, a cold beer and the radio blasting. I looove that the style is sometimes sparse, and sometimes incredibly poetic, but always just right.
Also, the characterization is *perfect*, for Sam, Dean, Bobby, hell, even Bela in the phone call! (though, dude, she is a sexual deviant in this. damn.)
And, man, the fact that she manages to make me want to PET Hellhounds... well, that's just amazing. I love how the core of this is that Dean will always, always, always love every single bit of Sam, even if Sam's weird or bitchy, or the half demonic owner of hellhounds.
Characterisation thoughts and questions from riverbella:
I love this story so much. It is funny and a bit cracked and with a smidgen of dark thrown in the mix, too. One thing that intrigued me was Dean's gradually warming to the hounds. I remember when I was reading it thinking "yes, this seems so in character," and then stepping outside myself to wonder why I felt that way. Given Dean's prejudice against evil creatures, what was it about the hounds that made him cut them a break? Was it because they answered to Sam? Or did it have something to do with Dean sympathizing with them because they had been cut adrift from their "natural" role? Anybody got an opinion?
amy_star_'s reaction:
You don't usually see stories about Sam saving Dean from hell, turning more demonic, and involving hellhounds and think the word "cuddly." But that's the first thing I think of when I read this. I love this story to bits, even though I'm not usually a Wincest fan, and it's all because of the brilliant characterization. Her Dean feels so right, so perfect, that I want to show this to anyone writing him as an example of what to do. Every single character feels fully fleshed out and perfect in this, from the small bits of Bobby to the great view of the inside of Dean's head, to miserable, slightly demonic Sam to the hellhounds themselves. I knew this story would end up in my reread file as soon as Dean caved in and begun buying treats, and decided it was MADE OF WIN when the "dogs" ate the coleslaw.
stormcloude has questions and some problems regarding the hounds:
I'd like to know how everyone else pictured the hounds. I think the image I had in my head was a little unrealistic with the rest of the story, because I was picturing them as wolfhounds, which there's no way six of them would fit in the back of the Impala or on a king-size bed. And Dean wouldn't be able to keep up with them when they're running down the spirits, yet to me, that's the only kind of dog they could be. No way they're beagles or bassets-- maybe bloodhounds, but I don't see those as vicious enough.
Also how do the hounds interact with the real world? Mostly people can't see or touch them, yet they can eat physical food. That was a little sticking point for me.
Now it's your turn - feel free to discuss any of the points mentioned above, or start with anything else that interested you about the story.
The first story is Leader of the Pack by astolat [Dean/Sam, adult, 14,904 words]
I want this to be fun and interesting for everyone, so I'm going to start with the rules, because they're the basis of keeping it fun. There aren't many, so please read them CAREFULLY before joining in.
(1) Keep the discussion about the story, or aspects of the show relating to the story. NOT about the author or the rights and wrongs of wincest or any other tangent.
(2) Disagreement is fine - we'll all have different opinions. But please be polite with each other. "I don't agree with you about… because…" or "In my opinion…" are great. A blanket "You're wrong," or "You're an idiot," are NOT okay. I will delete comments or freeze threads if I spot any unpleasantness. Play nice.
(3) All anonymous comments are screened. I will NOT unscreen anonymous comments if there is no name on them, no matter what the content of the comment.
(4) Critique is welcome, squee is welcome, heavy meta is welcome, questions are welcome. Dig into the story, share what you love and what you didn't. Chat with each other about it, jump into threads that interest you. But always remember rules #1 and 2 - keep it about the story, not the author, and be polite.
A huge thank you to everyone who left comments on the link post. Incidentally, if you have any questions about the Book Club, the link post is the best place to ask.
Some thoughts and questions raised by innie_darling:
I like that it's clear that Dean went to the crossroads himself, without waiting to be tracked down. I know I've written that scenario myself, and I believe others have too. Does that seem more in character than fighting to the very end? How does Sam's absence/presence affect this? Does it also make sense that Dean tried to make sure Sam couldn't be there?
The description of Dean accepting his soul back is wonderfully light-hearted. Was that abrupt shift from the darkness before supposed to mimic the shift from gen to Wincest (Dean makes it clear that kissing Sam is new to him)?
Bela's initial offer is vague enough that I was expecting Dean to pay some random guy to give her the cunnilingus. Was this negotiation something that you felt was integral to the story?
I really enjoyed that Dean told Sam that Sam's level of demonic powers was something only Sam could control/decide.
I'd be interested to hear what people thought about Sam using his powers in the sex scene - is that something readers feel is necessary to show that Sam is not (and his powers are not) wholly bad?
And I'd also be interested to know the thought process behind having Sam fuck Dean, rather than the other way around. Is that something that the story's own logic dictates? Or is it simply the way the author sees the relationship going, in any circumstances?
Thoughts about the pacing from littledrop:
I have such mixed feelings about the pace of this story. I started out thinking the resolution of Dean's deal happened way too fast, but I absolutely loved where the story ended up. There was so much packed into such a short space. I don't know, mixed feelings indeed.
Some squee from arlad:
Oh, I *love* this story!
The first thing that got to me was this description of what Dean feels like when Sam gives him his soul back: something was pouring into him: like he was an empty cup filling up with cool cool water, so much it was splashing up over the sides and running wet and clean and sweet over his fingers, down his wrist on a hot summer day, laughing while they washed the car, Sam grinning at him soaking-wet on the other side, a cold beer and the radio blasting. I looove that the style is sometimes sparse, and sometimes incredibly poetic, but always just right.
Also, the characterization is *perfect*, for Sam, Dean, Bobby, hell, even Bela in the phone call! (though, dude, she is a sexual deviant in this. damn.)
And, man, the fact that she manages to make me want to PET Hellhounds... well, that's just amazing. I love how the core of this is that Dean will always, always, always love every single bit of Sam, even if Sam's weird or bitchy, or the half demonic owner of hellhounds.
Characterisation thoughts and questions from riverbella:
I love this story so much. It is funny and a bit cracked and with a smidgen of dark thrown in the mix, too. One thing that intrigued me was Dean's gradually warming to the hounds. I remember when I was reading it thinking "yes, this seems so in character," and then stepping outside myself to wonder why I felt that way. Given Dean's prejudice against evil creatures, what was it about the hounds that made him cut them a break? Was it because they answered to Sam? Or did it have something to do with Dean sympathizing with them because they had been cut adrift from their "natural" role? Anybody got an opinion?
amy_star_'s reaction:
You don't usually see stories about Sam saving Dean from hell, turning more demonic, and involving hellhounds and think the word "cuddly." But that's the first thing I think of when I read this. I love this story to bits, even though I'm not usually a Wincest fan, and it's all because of the brilliant characterization. Her Dean feels so right, so perfect, that I want to show this to anyone writing him as an example of what to do. Every single character feels fully fleshed out and perfect in this, from the small bits of Bobby to the great view of the inside of Dean's head, to miserable, slightly demonic Sam to the hellhounds themselves. I knew this story would end up in my reread file as soon as Dean caved in and begun buying treats, and decided it was MADE OF WIN when the "dogs" ate the coleslaw.
stormcloude has questions and some problems regarding the hounds:
I'd like to know how everyone else pictured the hounds. I think the image I had in my head was a little unrealistic with the rest of the story, because I was picturing them as wolfhounds, which there's no way six of them would fit in the back of the Impala or on a king-size bed. And Dean wouldn't be able to keep up with them when they're running down the spirits, yet to me, that's the only kind of dog they could be. No way they're beagles or bassets-- maybe bloodhounds, but I don't see those as vicious enough.
Also how do the hounds interact with the real world? Mostly people can't see or touch them, yet they can eat physical food. That was a little sticking point for me.
Now it's your turn - feel free to discuss any of the points mentioned above, or start with anything else that interested you about the story.