History not repeating itself
I was reading a discussion on a list about...well, at least what I made it about...was what kids in Snape's class are supposed to "learn" from his bad behavior. Snape seems monstrous to Neville because Neville is young and insecure, but Neville conquers Snape with his Riddikulus spell, making him look silly, and that's what he has to do in his
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I hope Marigold comes home soon!
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I hope Marigold comes home soon too!
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Poor Snape. He has all this unresolved anger towards James which he unleashes on Harry since James had to go and die and place himself beyond reach. And poor Harry forced to act as a substitute to a father he never really knew.
Sins of the father. Harry and Draco should commiserate over inheriting their fathers' enemies.
What makes them not evenly matched is that spell and who does that come from--Snape!How wonderfully symbolic! Harry's problem is that he's fighting with Draco, and he throws a spell that Snape made up for James. There's a lot more hate there.
Oh! I love this idea. *fangirls*
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LOL! Yes--and yet when Draco ever gets treated badly by one of his father's enemies it's usually assumed he deserves it for being just like his damn father anyway!
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...look what happened to the S/J animosity. "Don't let this happen to you"...It hasn't, really, and Snape's a big reason behind that...Snape has also played a big part, sucking the energy out of that relationship [H vs. D] by being himself.
Which sort of gives the lie to Dumbledore's suggestion that Snape hasn't dealt with this particular issue, doesn't it?
Severus does at times seem to be placing himself between Harry and Draco - a most abrasive buffer! ;) It makes sense that he sees the pattern repeating itself, and endeavors to stop it even if it causes him short-term difficulty & angst; it's preferable to the long-term problems that could arise if he doesn't act, and Harry & Draco become Severus & James redux ( ... )
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I'm not sure just how wrong JKR would allow Dumbledore to be.
Severus does at times seem to be placing himself between Harry and Draco - a most abrasive buffer!
But is Snape knowingly doing this? Or is it merely a happenstance of his own emotional issues? (heh...that Harry POV does get in the way) Either way Snape is a wonderful character.
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I suspect at this juncture it's a matter of individual interpretation; looking at HPB via the pensieve memories, and how Dumbledore dealt - or DIDN'T deal - with Tom Riddle, one can only decide Dumbledore's (in)fallibility as best one can until Book 7.
But is Snape knowingly doing this? Or is it merely a happenstance of his own emotional issues?
Personally I suspect he IS aware and consciously working to change things, yet his conscious intent may be superfluous to requirements in the larger scheme of things. As long as the changes indeed happen and affect the big picture, whatever personal effects this has on Severus may well be considered negligible to the overall story arc.
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Yes, I tend to see it that way too. I think it's clear that Snape *is* trying to change things in his own way. When he jumps on Harry in class the first day, he's making sure that *this* James will have a different experience. Ditto on siding with Draco. It's more interesting because he's not literally dealing with another version of himself, so it's not quite that he's just siding with a younger version of Snape against James. That's what makes his actions have unforseen consequences, but those can still be good ones.
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Yeah, definitely. I think that's maybe why it was important for Harry to see Draco's wand start to go down. If he hadn't seen that he would probably be seeing no difference between Snape and Malfoy at this point. Malfoy would just be Mini-Snape.
Snape may be screwed, by this train of thought. Sorry, Severus.
Poor Snape! But I think you're right on those two different versions of Snape's story versus Harry's story. I hope Snape gets some respect by the end there, though!
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I think this is also because we don't see the S/J rivalry very much at all, and I almost feel as if the Snape/Sirius hatred feels much more intense that way because you have all that interaction. True the hatred S/J lives on in Harry, but because Harry isn't James and didn't really know James, one can almost forget at times that that’s the real motivating factor behind Snape's hatred and see it almost as purely directed at Harry.
And Snape/Sirius feels more like the example Dumbledore should have used, in some ways, if you're talking about not growing up/growing out of a rivalry. Both of them felt very immature, and one almost wonders how each managed to go through a war and seemingly not grow beyond petty rivalry at all ( ... )
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Good point--ITA. S/J is just whatever someone projects onto it. I suspect people want to make it more simple than it is as well--people were very quick to decide after the Pensive that Harry "was" Snape and Draco was "was" James, and there were parallels there that had never been seen before, but it still wasn't quite that simple. Sirius/Snape seems more like it because we see both of them go at it. As you described, the original pair is sort of mixed up and recombined in different ways--and who knows what Snape may also be relating them to at different times? Does he see himself in Harry at all? Or does he see just his Shadow self so he has to reject Harry? Does Malfoy somehow remind him of something he admires or wants to be? Where does Lucius fit into this? It's a mystery!
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I like this point a lot. I think this is exactly the reason they won't follow in their predecessors' footsteps. They've been there, in some sense. That's a big part of where the sympathy stems from, IMO. I think they're both smarter than the older generation in that sense, and they'll be able to see past the flaws in each other, and past the House and legacy divides to what really counts. I certainly hope, anyway.
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