(Untitled)

[doverz]

Bill Gates and Randi Weingarten

by Daniel Lyons

Can the billionaire philanthropist and the president of the American Federation of Teachers find common ground-and fix our nation’s education system?

Our schools are lagging behind the rest of the world. Why is that? How did we fall so far behind?

Gates: Well, it’s the big issue. A lot of other

Comments

[very_vogue]

I work in urban public education, and until poverty is eliminated in this country you won't see a change in education.

It's not all about yelling at teachers and telling them how horrible they are, Bill.

[entropius]

My mother works in urban public education (where "urban" is a euphemism for "poor black inner city"), and I worked at her school too for a while and volunteered there for longer.

The students' socioeconomic background was a little of a problem, but a far worse problem was horrible teachers (and administration). For whatever reason, that school had a terrible principal and a majority of the teachers are also bad. I'd go in to tutor some kid in math who was hopelessly lost in (say) pre-algebra, and straighten him out in five minutes, since it turns out that the kid's intelligence and skills were fine; he'd just been taught nonsense and was all confused because of bad instruction

[thelilyqueen]

Well, think for a minute or two longer about why those teachers and administrators are most likely there.

Since school funding is tied to property taxes, do you think the school can afford to hire top teachers? Unless they're virtual saints they're in areas where the pay and benefits are better, the administration's more sensible, there's money for really fun and innovative teaching materials, and less time is spent playing social worker and/or parent instead of teaching. Poverty reduces a school's ability to attract and retain great people.

Please don't think this comment condones bad teachers. I just think saying 'well, the teachers stink and they're the direct problem' ignores why they're there and not at Kids of Doctors and Lawyers High.

[entropius]

AFAIK teachers' salaries are set by the city, so they make the same as teachers at Doctors' and Lawyers' High, as you put it. (This city is one of the wealthier ones in the state, but it is diverse enough that there is a poor section.) Also, Alabama has some rules where a percentage of the property tax revenue from regions with higher revenue is sent to the areas with lower revenue, in an attempt to equalize funding.

There is also money for teaching materials -- at this middle school there is stuff, nice stuff, all over the place paid for by federal aid to poor schools. They have more material support than my high school (mostly middle class, diverse racial mix) by far. (They have more and nicer computers than my university department, actually -- last semester I had to teach a uni computational physics class with a bunch of old computers that crashed all the time.)

But, while the place isn't lacking in material resources, the rest of your comment is spot on. Cultural poverty -- the climate of an administration and a teaching staff

[devil_ad_vocate]

I have no problem with teachers being evaluated. But until we get over the attitude of "If you can't do, teach", and that sort of asshatery, our teachers will always be held in low esteem. We expect them to educate, discipline, socialize, and correct parental incompetence in more than twenty kids - and then bitch at them.

I think most teachers deserve a hell of a lot more respect than most CEOs get.

Getting rid of state education administrators that espouse bullshit like 'creationism' would be a start.

[doverz]

Definitely. Evaluating teachers is perfectly fine and it works for other countries. But until we change the structures that make teaching, parenting, and learning difficult, the changes won't really do anything.

[emofordino]

this this this this this!

AND the budgets for the school districts are based on test scores. so what are the curriculums aimed to teach? HOW TO PASS TESTS SO SCHOOLS CAN GET MORE MONEY.

my entire four years of high school classes were spent being taught how to pass the OGT (ohio graduation test). this knowledge did absolutely nothing to prepare me for life after high school.

[doverz]

Word. I think it's ridiculous that No Child Left Behind set up a system where a school has to get everyone at proficient or advanced by like 2016 or else they lose their funding. That's completely impossible and hurts schools.

[entropius]

I think NCLB was written by people with no knowledge of statistics -- or people from Lake Woebegone.

It's also a system that encourages a disproportionate focus on the slow kids. The more intelligent students aren't encouraged to excel; the people in gifted education call it "No Child Gets Ahead Either".

[snarksnarklaugh]

I really get sick of these kinds of stereotyping articles. News flash not all American schools are horrible and please stop blaming the teachers alone. Parents should really need to start taking more responsiblity as well as the students. What kind of schools did Bill Gates go to? American.

Americans strength use to be mostly exspansive resources and cheap immigrant labor.Kicking other countries asses and making them buy from the U.S. and nobody else only lasted so long.Inventing things is about the only thing America has still got going for us. Now with globilization there are going to be a more serious gap between people who are creative/inventive/business owning/etc types and everyone who either is unemployed or has to compete with people in second/third world economies.

Comparing American schools to other American schools is hard, but to compare American schools to other countries schools is just stupid. IMHO.

[doverz]

Parents definitely need to be more involved in their kids' education, but it's kind of hard to do that when you have to work a two low-wage jobs just to make sure your kids have food on the table. Structural conditions have to change that make it easier on parents to make a living so they can be more involved in their kids' education. Otherwise, nothing is really going to change.

I agree on everything else.

[konichiwacobra]

this.

my mom has worked two jobs for pretty much my entire life and when she started I was her only child. Luckily, I never had issues with grades or behavior. If I did, I'm sure she would've tried, but it would've been extremely difficult for her to take time off of one job, come to the school and then make it back in time for the other one. Then, she's got to make up those hours somewhere because you need every cent of both paychecks.

School is important, but so is paying rent, paying utilities, and buying food.

[kyra_neko_rei]

I had a conversation with some relatives once in which they were comparing "real American" (read: white and been-here-a-few-generations) culture with "immigrant culture" (catch-all for ethnic populations who haven't picked up enough Americanness to turn their skin white, apparently), and whichever-relative-it-was was talking about how all the white kids' parents came to school on parent day, attended all their kids' plays and concerts and talent shows, and generally "took an interest in their kids' education."

I attempted to explain how not everybody has the ability to take the day off work to come see the kid trot across the stage in costume, and not everybody can afford to give up those hours of pay . . . it was mostly like talking to a very skeptical lamppost that could huff and roll its eyes and spout Fox News talking points back.

[grace_om]

As long as this society in general seems to regard education as something "elitist" that should be sneered at by "real" people, and regards teachers as freeloaders off the "public tit" who are unworthy of any respect...we are pretty much doomed.

[hinoema]

Exactly.

[entropius]

Even if you believe in small government that doesn't make sense. "Freeloaders off the public tit" -- well, we have some of that in the US, and it should be discouraged.

But teachers? At least the good ones are working people who get up in the morning and go do a job, a hard job, and get paid (often not enough) for it. That's not freeloading.

wtf?

[kyra_neko_rei]

The sort of people who make the biggest fuss about freeloaders tend to have the least basis in fact for making that judgment.

If you don't have an upper-middle-class salary, you're obviously lazy and don't deserve what you ARE getting. If you worked harder, your employers would notice what an asset you are and pay you more.

Or something like that; I'm gonna stop before I hurl.