I love what you have here, Rod. Preaching to the choir. People pick up a few stories on CNN on bioful, and don't realize the scope of American power use.
Economicly, I think our best cource is to mitigate the problem with exisiting techonologies to expand our fuel source and hopefuly start to conserve same said source. Meanwhile, we continue to develop the techonology necessary to move beyond it (maybe a breakthrough in clean, cheap power and battery run vehicles? Who knows.)
We are definately stuck with the infrastructure we have. Trying to switch cold-turkey would effectively destroy the entire economy. We depend on fossil fuels to move _everything_. Even the "electric" cars and trains rely on power, and that comes from fossil-fuel driven power plants.
So yes, extend with existing techs like hybrid cars. Build Nuke Plants. Sadly, they are unpopular for all of the wrong reasons. Pebble-bed reactors and a variety of other methods are SAFER and LESS hazardous than a coil or oil fueled plant, and can run for a longer time.
But we REALLY need to start looking into deploying new techs that can and will replace gas powered vehicles and power plants soonest. Waiting for a breakthrough is like keeping on with betting full pots on poker, expecting that you will get a royal flush before your money runs out. Not all too likely. Lacking that...
We're still doomed to economic collapse, just a few more years away. And that one we likely won't recover from.
The economic colapse, at our current rate of consuption, will occur in the next couple decades. If the peak oil theory is correct, our technology will roll back as cheap fuel becomes less availiable.
I agree...we need to buy ourselves from time. That means hybrid cars, coal-to-oil, nukes, biofuel blends, all of it. Anything to keep that black gold last us a bit longer. We have 300 years worth of coal...I really think that is our best alternative.
I think folks don't realize how bad a fuel crash would be. Due to the size of this country and the reliance on automotive transport, the whole economy would sieze and die. It would make the 1930's look like a skip through the tulip field.
The reason most people are against nuclear power is because the companies running the damn things can't keep them up to code.
On paper nuclear power works well, but since people are greedy and like to cut corners for profit, they'll skimp on saftey to the detriment of everyone.
That said, I'm a big proponent of the integral fast reactor design that reuses spent fuel on site and is "passively safe" in that it's impossible for them to melt down. An added bonus of their design is that they cannot produce materials that can be used in weapons.
Unfortunately again, the corporate structure of our power systems will not allow for any substantial change until those running them are dead leaving the rest of us to clean up after them. Companies have to maximize quarterly profits by law, or they can be sued by their shareholders. Good government leadership could make the enterprise a public one, with all the benefits that would entail, but few politicians do anything for the public good anymore, lest they be labeled "socialist".
Generally AgreedonomojakuMay 24 2006, 20:19:14 UTC
Faster reactor, pebble bed, there are at least 4-5 designs that can't melt down and, in a worst-case scenario, simply stop supplying power. Yes, companies are filled with people. People are, in general, lazy ignorany and stupid. Thus there will be issues.
Another band-aid would be European style cars. Very economic in their size, so less fuel to go from A to B, plus less pollution (maybe) and less congestion on roads (probably). I heartily agree that sometimes you need a big vehicle, but not when you're driving to work by yourself.
Band-aids galore...onomojakuMay 25 2006, 01:31:40 UTC
Oh, I'm all for bandaids. Smaller, more fuel-efficient cars, hybrids, etc. are all _helpful_ in the short term. Sadly, most of our politicians and pretty much all of the standard public are the idiot sorts who will, in 2-3 years after "belt tightening", forget the entire mess.
And then... Thunderdome!
You heart my brain? Kimling, when did you become a zombie? Does Mikey know yet?
Re: Band-aids galore...mithikallMay 25 2006, 16:51:07 UTC
Yeah. Our country has quite a few responsibility-dodging rat bastards. Mikey and I were talking recently, and he mentioned that no one wants to work for the future anymore; everyone wants huge changes in their lifetime or not at all. If we could just parade some of the cooler Euro cars, like the one that's half-motorcycle-half-car, I think they'd take off like rockets.
I'd survive in Thunderdome world. In fact, I really think the geeks would inherit the earth.
Heh. Who says I'm a zombie? I could be something worse. And maybe Mikey's one too. Muahahahahahaha!!!
Ah, Petrocollapse...onomojakuMay 25 2006, 16:08:51 UTC
Fun words! And Peak Oil! I didn't throw those phrases into this rant, nor did I discuss the whole 'conserve and reduce' motiff, since it was only a "stage one: the real problem" kind of rant
( ... )
Comments 31
I love what you have here, Rod. Preaching to the choir. People pick up a few stories on CNN on bioful, and don't realize the scope of American power use.
Economicly, I think our best cource is to mitigate the problem with exisiting techonologies to expand our fuel source and hopefuly start to conserve same said source. Meanwhile, we continue to develop the techonology necessary to move beyond it (maybe a breakthrough in clean, cheap power and battery run vehicles? Who knows.)
What do you think?
Reply
So yes, extend with existing techs like hybrid cars. Build Nuke Plants. Sadly, they are unpopular for all of the wrong reasons. Pebble-bed reactors and a variety of other methods are SAFER and LESS hazardous than a coil or oil fueled plant, and can run for a longer time.
But we REALLY need to start looking into deploying new techs that can and will replace gas powered vehicles and power plants soonest. Waiting for a breakthrough is like keeping on with betting full pots on poker, expecting that you will get a royal flush before your money runs out. Not all too likely. Lacking that...
We're still doomed to economic collapse, just a few more years away. And that one we likely won't recover from.
Reply
I agree...we need to buy ourselves from time. That means hybrid cars, coal-to-oil, nukes, biofuel blends, all of it. Anything to keep that black gold last us a bit longer. We have 300 years worth of coal...I really think that is our best alternative.
I think folks don't realize how bad a fuel crash would be. Due to the size of this country and the reliance on automotive transport, the whole economy would sieze and die. It would make the 1930's look like a skip through the tulip field.
Reply
On paper nuclear power works well, but since people are greedy and like to cut corners for profit, they'll skimp on saftey to the detriment of everyone.
That said, I'm a big proponent of the integral fast reactor design that reuses spent fuel on site and is "passively safe" in that it's impossible for them to melt down. An added bonus of their design is that they cannot produce materials that can be used in weapons.
Unfortunately again, the corporate structure of our power systems will not allow for any substantial change until those running them are dead leaving the rest of us to clean up after them. Companies have to maximize quarterly profits by law, or they can be sued by their shareholders. Good government leadership could make the enterprise a public one, with all the benefits that would entail, but few politicians do anything for the public good anymore, lest they be labeled "socialist".
Reply
And yet, it's still better than what we have now!
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Another band-aid would be European style cars. Very economic in their size, so less fuel to go from A to B, plus less pollution (maybe) and less congestion on roads (probably). I heartily agree that sometimes you need a big vehicle, but not when you're driving to work by yourself.
Reply
And then... Thunderdome!
You heart my brain? Kimling, when did you become a zombie? Does Mikey know yet?
Reply
If we could just parade some of the cooler Euro cars, like the one that's half-motorcycle-half-car, I think they'd take off like rockets.
I'd survive in Thunderdome world. In fact, I really think the geeks would inherit the earth.
Heh. Who says I'm a zombie? I could be something worse. And maybe Mikey's one too. Muahahahahahaha!!!
Reply
As for the cooler Euro-cars... well, honestly expect economical (read: smaller!) cars to become MUCH more popular the closer gas gets to $4 a gallon!
Hmm. Something worse than a zombie... damn, Kimling! Are you a Politician???
Nah, couldn't be...
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Damn the Technocracy for fucking up good Etherite experiments.
Reply
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