Conservadoxy

[onionsoupmix]

With several notable exceptions,  Orthodox Jewish law has been frozen for the past 1600 years.

There is no Sanhedrin and no governing body and no one leader can take it upon himself to authorize important and needed changes. Instead, we all just cling to traditions passed down over the centuries and convice ourselves that this is authentic Judaism

Comments

Simply not the case

[anonymous]

There has been enormous evolution in the last 15 centuries.

Talk to anyone who has a thorough knowledge of the texts and how they got to be there

Some of the evolution not been in the direction you are looking for.

I gather you are a denizen of the Buckeye state - if you are near Columbus I know someone who has lot of expertise in this are and is quite open-minded non-party line kind of guy who is very well read in the humanities, etc.

If you are open to serious discussion with a great resource just respond and I shall post his name -he is a public figure so no privacy concerns here.
YC

Re: Simply not the case

[onionsoupmix]

Please send me a message with his name, number and a suggestion for how to start the conversation. Or you can post it here.

Re: Simply not the case

[anonymous]

It is no secret - His name is Rabbi Tzvi Kahan, he is the newish principal at the Jewish High school in Columbus -I am sure he is listed -just give him a buzz.
I know him form many years ago- but I know he is very involved in discussing these questions and is very broad minded

I know him from many years ago having met him and had long discussions with him in Atlanta or New Orleans some other big southern city -I forget which.....

I did just hear that he was in Ohio -so maybe you can get a dialogue going -"You have nothing to lose but your chains" (It is unclear whether Marx or Engels wrote that line, but it is a good one)

Happy yet another rabbinic burden to carry upon your aching shoulders a.k.a Channukah

Re: Simply not the case

[onionsoupmix]

That would be a little awkward. He's my kids' principal...

[ruchel]

I do not think Judaism would fall apart because of women rabbis or use of electricity (in fact when that one was still "in debate", some ruled it ok, especially on Yomtov, and especially closing).

Judaism though would fall apart if they started touching the intermarriage laws, saying the Bible doesn't say "all goyim" but only SOME are forbidden to marry...

In order to make valid changes only, we need enough responsible and learned people, that is a Sanhedrin. Do YOU see 71 rabbis worthy of being in the Sanhedrin and willing to work with others of different hashkafos??

[onionsoupmix]

Do YOU see 71 rabbis worthy of being in the Sanhedrin and willing to work with others of different hashkafos??

Sure. They are not the big gedolim who assur everything and deride secular education and women and allow thuggish violence against secular people. But there certainly are 71 rabbis who are intelligent and kind and sincere.

[ruchel]

Unfortunately you would need at least one from each and every derech. I do not see all the hashkafos agreeing to work together. Will anti Zionist work with hilltop DL? Will left wing MO work with Satmar? Will the Yekke with two PhD work with the anti-chol chassid? etc...

[onionsoupmix]

Why do you need one for every derech? You just need one or two poskim who will speak for orthodoxy (Like Rav Moshe Feinstein, for example) and the rest can choose to go machmir and not follow him or whatever.

[mindycl]

I disagree./ There have been plenty of halachic changes, however, they have to be IN LINE with Torah law. It's akin to amendments to the constitution but not changing the constitution itself. Things like IVF and birth control have been allowed in recent years, which rabbis just didnt permit 30 years ago. But things like mixed minyanim or women being able to sing in front of men etc. will never evolve. Basica HALACHA wont change, but qualified rabbis can issue one-time or even blanket heterim when it's really necessary.

You cant compare US law with Divine Law. You just can't.

[livelife73]

"You cant compare US law with Divine Law. You just can't." That is what I was going to say!!!!!!

I also believe that there have been several changes in a good direction.
One of the best things about being Jewish is that we are encouraged to ask questions and 'get to the bottom of it'. Even if the bottom is 5 differing opinions that don't really answer the question in the first place. At least I am ALWAYS encouraged to ask and at least my Rav is always wanting to find a meaningful and appropriate answer for ME.

[ruchel]

I disagree, birth control of some kind has been around since Talmudic times and apparently even since the Bible, according to the Talmud. So it wasn't the pill, it was pushing off mikve, herbs, a kind of diaphragm, etc. There was this fascinating thread on Imamother.

As for women being allowed to sing in front of men, there are all kinds of communities, from German Orthodoxy (not charedi not MO) where women sing at the shabbes table and men went to the opera, to YU who ruled that today, due to desensitization, anything except a "one on one serenade" was allowed.

Except all this, though, I agree.

[onionsoupmix]

Things like IVF and birth control have been allowed in recent years, which rabbis just didnt permit 30 years ago

Birth control has been permitted since the times of the gemarah. It just didn't exist until 30 years ago because it was illegal in America.

It's akin to amendments to the constitution but not changing the constitution itself.

This is my point. We don't have anything like amendments, not really. Amendments are made to allow the actual text and practice to change in accordance with social norms. So slavery was legal but then an amendment was passed and made it illegal. Women are discriminated against sometimes in Judaism and there is no amendement process. The only thing I can think of close to an amendment type thing would be the beis yaakov schools and also the cherem of Rabbeinu gershom, which expired and is not longer valid anyway. Those were the notable exceptions in my first sentence.

Good Points

[anonymous]

I agree with you, no surprise there :)

Margo from the Ballroom

[boobalah]

I have thoughts on this. I'm trying to sort them out well enough to write something intelligent. I think I have an interesting perspective on this, since I'm a secular Jewish studies student who considered the halakhic system like any other law code. I don't accept the divinity of the Torah, etc.

Oh, and happy Chanaukah.