Could be interesting.

Nov 28, 2012 20:52

So, as y'all undoubtedly know (unless you're new or tend to skim or something), I identify as asexual and aromantic. This means, in a nutshell, that I am neither sexually nor romantically attracted to other people: I have no interest in banging anyone or dating anyone ( Read more... )

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the_epic November 29 2012, 04:27:21 UTC
CORGI!

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nobleplatypus November 29 2012, 05:49:21 UTC
Corgis are always appropriate for any occasion!

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Be cool... hukbillgoomba November 29 2012, 11:21:45 UTC


On a serious note, I do wonder sometimes about how I would tell the difference between being aromantic and being intensely socially anxious to the point where romance is just not feasible. I mean, I often feel that failure is inevitable in almost everything I do, so perhaps it's just part of that, in the same way I'll never be the first person to set foot on the surface of the sun.
DAMN YOU, SUN!!

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Re: Be cool... nobleplatypus November 29 2012, 14:16:47 UTC
It's definitely true that there was a good amount of "this isn't feasible" that prompted my little ~aromantic awakening~ in college. Social anxiety wasn't really the issue so much as my introversion and the fact that I'm easily bothered by other people, and my realization that the fictional (and tolerable) relationships I could imagine in my head did not actually translate to reality and how people actually behave. So for me, it was less "THIS IS WHOLESALE BOGUS" and more "Well, I can see the appeal but I don't think I'd actually want to involve myself with someone else that way because what I want doesn't exist."

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Re: Be cool... hukbillgoomba November 29 2012, 14:59:17 UTC
Yeah, like romance to me seems as feasible as the Penguin-Dragon wars, and other fantasies. Maybe I'm over-analytical but whenever I read about it in fiction it seems incredibly implausible - but because it's alongside magic, excitement, adventure and really wild things, I guess it fits in. XD

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Re: Be cool... nobleplatypus November 29 2012, 17:41:12 UTC
How plausible I find it in fiction depends on how it's handled, because there are a lot of romantic tropes that I just don't buy and never will (Continual fighting means they're really in love! Stalking someone is sweet and makes for a great How We Met story! etc.). But all that really matters is how unfitting it is for me, as far as reality is concerned.

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alto2 November 29 2012, 13:01:20 UTC
Okay, here's a question I've wondered about for ages: an LJ friend of mine also identifies as asexual but writes a pile of really romantic fic, both slash and het. I can't quite figure out how that works. I realize that I tend to write male characters without being one myself, so maybe it's that simple, but my poor addled brain just can't figure out how you can write about feelings/desires you don't yourself experience. Help?

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nobleplatypus November 29 2012, 14:02:49 UTC
I don't know your friend's romantic orientation, so there are two ways I could answer this.

I think it's a common misconception that asexuals are necessarily disinterested in romance because romance and sex are considered to be inseparable, and it's true that some aces (such as myself) are disinterested in anything beyond platonic relationships. But most aces do experience what we call "romantic attraction"--the desire for all the warmth and fuzziness that a romantic relationship would provide. That's why we usually identify ourselves as "asexual and [hetero/homo/bi/pan/a]romantic" when we talk about our orientations. It's possible--even likely--that your friend is personally familiar with what it's like to fall in (or be in) romantic love, even if she doesn't know what it's like to look at someone and think, "I'd hit that ( ... )

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alto2 November 29 2012, 15:47:25 UTC
So, what I think you're saying is that there can be a separation/division (not sure what the right word is--compartmentalization?) that exists between romance and sex, and so you can have/like/be interested in romance but not want to take it any further? Is that right, or am I misunderstanding? (I don't have that ability to compartmentalize, apparently, so I am not sure if I'm getting it or if I'm totally missing something important.)

I agree that writers write outside their personal experience, but can they write outside their own emotional experience? Or is the cultural kool-aid enough to counteract a lack of emotional experience here? Or is it more empathy? (But then, can empathy exist if the emotion you're empathizing with is totally alien to you?) I'm kinda thinking out loud here and kinda hoping for clarification, so take that as you will. Regardless, it's interesting to contemplate.

BTW, I really appreciate you providing the opportunity to ask this sort of stuff, because it's tough to grasp on your own--and tough to ask ( ... )

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nobleplatypus November 29 2012, 16:37:38 UTC
Yep, that's a good way of putting it! Just as it's possible to have sex without romance, it's possible to have romance without sex. As a society, we're far more familiar with the idea of casual sex than sexless romance, but they're both real things that happen.

For most asexuals, there's just no automatic progression from "I love this person and want to spend my life with them" to "and also I want to have sex with them," because sexual attraction isn't part of the equation. To us, that's on par with something like, "I love this person, so naturally I want to go kayaking with them." It doesn't follow.

This is where things can get complicated, because some asexuals are willing to have sex with their partners to make them happy, or for the emotional side of the equation, just as some people who aren't really into kayaking might be willing to go kayaking with their partner if their partner was into that sort of thing. But the innate desire to have sex is still absent.

BTW, I really appreciate you providing the opportunity to ask ( ... )

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tabslock November 29 2012, 16:37:05 UTC
I might have to think about it a little before I ask any questions, but I wanted to say now that:

a) it's really cool of you to provide this forum for people to increase their understanding and awareness, and

b) I initially read your first sentence as "I identify as asexual and aromatic" and heard Shirley in my head saying, "Oh, that's nice!"

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nobleplatypus November 29 2012, 16:51:16 UTC
a) Thanks. It's easy to get caught in a vicious cycle of "I don't talk about this because nobody understands because I don't talk about it," so here is me breaking the cycle. Whee!

b) I think just about everyone reads it that way at first. Most text programs tend to autocorrect it, too, so I'm always paranoid that I didn't catch it. XD

And now I'm hearing Shirley in my head.

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tabslock November 29 2012, 21:25:38 UTC
There are worse voices to have in your head than Shirley's!

Okay, a question (and I'm trying not to feel silly or shy about it)... A few weeks ago we shared a squee over this:

I MAY HAVE SKIPPED BACK TO REWATCH THE SCENE IN WHICH [ABED] CHANNELS DON DRAPER TO PUT THE MOVES ON ANNIE. BECAUSE IT WAS SHOCKINGLY HOT.

What does that mean in an asexual context?

I feel like that sounds like I'm trying to catch you in a lie or something, which please believe me I am not - it's just that at the time I wasn't really thinking about the asexuality angle, and now that I am, it's something I'm curious about.

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nobleplatypus November 30 2012, 00:13:06 UTC
Haha, no worries. Hopefully I can answer this coherently.

This is partly a case of appreciating something without actually wanting it, much like you can admire a nice painting in a gallery without thinking, "I have to have this on my wall!" And it's partly a case of watching a show with your focus on the character's feelings and not on your own.

I can appreciate that what Abed did was excessively hot (exhibit a: I like his beautiful face; exhibit b: his voice got all deep and purr-y and I like that, too; exhibit c: Annie was totally into it) while also recognizing that if I had been in Annie's position, I would have giggled nervously and scooted away from him the moment he sat down because people invading my personal space makes me uncomfortable as all get-out.

Plus, as I said, Annie was into it, and that makes a HUGE difference. She was clearly enjoying it, so I enjoyed it with her, but if she'd been taken aback or displeased I would have tapped into that, instead, and been skeeved out by Abed's behavior.

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ember_firedrake November 29 2012, 23:20:53 UTC
I have a question of sorts for you ( ... )

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nobleplatypus November 30 2012, 00:33:56 UTC
Oooh, this is exciting! I am hardly unbiased in this regard, but here are my thoughts:

I think explicit representation would be awesome. I think fiction needs more explicit representation of marginalized groups who otherwise have to settle for "arguably like me" when they encounter characters who strike a chord with them. It would be really great to have it be canon, and not in a "Dumbledore's gay because JKR said so in an interview" sort of way.

And I say that not to disparage that particular interpretation, but to point out that it's still interpretation and interpretation is not representation when you can just as easily interpret things a different way. Plus, being an ~English Major~ and all, I know just how little authorial intent matters when it comes to interpreting a work. Sometimes this works in the favor of fandom aces (see: anything Moffat has said regarding Sherlock's orientation and his ambiguous treatment of the Doctor and River's relationship), but often it doesn't, because most people don't fill perceived gaps ( ... )

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