I don't think it's just my perception that there are actually many people who struggle with depression in academia. But perversely, the pressure to seem smart, competent, and confident seems to quash acknowledgement or discussion of it.
I think also some academics have accepted a low grade of depression as just part of the territory? Which is...not right.
We're all sitting on our hands, wishing we could talk to someone, but no one wants to be the first to admit weakness or ask for help. :/
But perversely, the pressure to seem smart, competent, and confident seems to quash acknowledgement or discussion of it.
You just totally answered your own question.
Also, I think there's extra pressure for women, at least in science, to not let on.
And I completely understand wanting to talk about it with other academics. Aside from a couple Mythical Internet Friends, I don't/didn't do that--I told my advisor when I started taking happy drugs, and I've talked to her and past advisors about frustrations (by "talked to" I mean "had meltdowns"), but I have never had other students in my program or even school who I could talk to seriously about depression. And that would have been incredibly valuable.
Also, I think there's extra pressure for women, at least in science, to not let on.
Yeah, this too.
There are some discussion/support groups offered by my school's student health center, and they might be worth checking out; but again, I don't know if those groups would have the focus I want. I don't want to hear, "School can be stressful! Here are some tips for dealing," for the umpteenth time. I think there really needs to be something out there for career academics that frankly addresses all the baggage that comes with that identity. It's not just the workload, it's the notion of what kind of person (or, seemingly, what kind of automaton) one is supposed to be.
Because it's so intangible, maybe? Because it's something we can only see by the symptoms, and the symptoms are so... I remember I once told Mum I couldn't go to school because I was sad. Without a doctor's opinion saying that I had a chemical reason to be sad, she didn't understand that as an illness, so off I went. I was told this morning, as well, that Siobhan is convinced I'm not very bright, because I told her that I couldn't finish a university degree because of being sick in my brain. Siobhan figured she knew what that meant. I would find it very difficult to persuade her otherwise.
...This might not be the case, and if it is it's not condonable. "Work was hard so we quit"? Bugger all that for a lark, aren't we SCIENTISTS? Whatever kind of science it is. Like, um, arty science. Sciencey art? Art.
I'm talking specifically about a lack of discussion of depression in academia; I don't know if that was clear from my admittedly cryptic one-line post. So I think everyone involved knows pretty well what depression is, at least clinically, but there's this- disconnect between knowing that and acknowledging that yes, it happens to brainy science people too. What I'm getting at is that talking to a therapist is nice and all, but sometimes what I really want is to talk about the unique pressures of being depressed in academia. But I hesitate to speak up and say, "Sometimes I feel worthless as a human being, and I deeply question my intelligence and ability to do this work. Do you ever get that, guys? Guys?" because it seems really...not done in academia to admit to a lack of confidence. But even knowing, rationally, that there are other people going through the same thing, I'm still not quite brave enough to speak up and be the first to admit to this "weakness". And everyone else in academia who wants to talk about depression is looking
( ... )
I'm really sorry your program is sucking so much. I can totally imagine the kind of environment you're describing, and yeah, I don't know if I'd be able to cope.
If there's anyone at all in your department that you think you could talk to, or if you'd feel comfortable talking to an NYU counselor, I'd really encourage you to do so. You have to make the decision that's right for you, obviously, but you shouldn't have to do it without any help.
Oh man, personal dignity is so overrated. One of my biggest achievements when I was visiting a therapist a few years ago was learning to just soldier through while crying and keep talking, even if it meant blubbering, instead of clamming up like I would have done before.
Completely embarrassing yourself in front of someone can be kind of liberating, actually.
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I think also some academics have accepted a low grade of depression as just part of the territory? Which is...not right.
We're all sitting on our hands, wishing we could talk to someone, but no one wants to be the first to admit weakness or ask for help. :/
Reply
You just totally answered your own question.
Also, I think there's extra pressure for women, at least in science, to not let on.
And I completely understand wanting to talk about it with other academics. Aside from a couple Mythical Internet Friends, I don't/didn't do that--I told my advisor when I started taking happy drugs, and I've talked to her and past advisors about frustrations (by "talked to" I mean "had meltdowns"), but I have never had other students in my program or even school who I could talk to seriously about depression. And that would have been incredibly valuable.
Reply
Yeah, this too.
There are some discussion/support groups offered by my school's student health center, and they might be worth checking out; but again, I don't know if those groups would have the focus I want. I don't want to hear, "School can be stressful! Here are some tips for dealing," for the umpteenth time. I think there really needs to be something out there for career academics that frankly addresses all the baggage that comes with that identity. It's not just the workload, it's the notion of what kind of person (or, seemingly, what kind of automaton) one is supposed to be.
Reply
...This might not be the case, and if it is it's not condonable. "Work was hard so we quit"? Bugger all that for a lark, aren't we SCIENTISTS? Whatever kind of science it is. Like, um, arty science. Sciencey art? Art.
Reply
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(The comment has been removed)
If there's anyone at all in your department that you think you could talk to, or if you'd feel comfortable talking to an NYU counselor, I'd really encourage you to do so. You have to make the decision that's right for you, obviously, but you shouldn't have to do it without any help.
Reply
(The comment has been removed)
Completely embarrassing yourself in front of someone can be kind of liberating, actually.
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