Comments | m_mcgregor: Marty-Stuing and the art of superpowers

m_mcgregor

Marty-Stuing and the art of superpowers

Sep 25, 2009 02:17

I assume someone somewhere has been graciously reminding people that The Wonderland Subject exists, as I've gotten a sudden influx of messages about it. One of them reminded me that I wanted to address something that more than a few people have said about the story, particularly the last few chapters. (That means there are SPOILERS in the upcoming ( Read more... )

ego, random complaining, writing thoughts, comic books

Comments 28

anonymous September 25 2009, 18:38:19 UTC

Wait a minute.

"Then again, I did a full writer's commentary on IAWIA, so I guess this isn't quite as arrogant."

Did I miss something?... When did you finish these?... Where are they?

Dave

anonymous September 25 2009, 20:07:36 UTC

Link to the prologue of IAWIA with commentary -- and to other IAWIA goodies.

http://m-mcgregor.livejournal.com/?skip=66&tag=fanfic+commentary:+i+am+what+i+am

(OK -- it looks good in the preview.)

m_mcgregor September 25 2009, 22:58:12 UTC

Yeah I finished it over a year ago now, I think. You can find it on the TAGS link at the top of my LJ, under fanfic commentary: I Am What I Am

gpi_s_avery September 25 2009, 21:20:27 UTC

Pretty much agree with you throughout the commentary, except on one small bit ( ... )

m_mcgregor September 25 2009, 23:04:55 UTC

I know you don't like Spike, but I'm not sure how this relates to what I was talking about. Yes, you and I know that the true "heart" of Buffy as a show was the ensemble cast. That's got nothing to do with the premise of Buffy. The premise is what the average person is going to think based on previews or trailers. The premise is the absolute core idea of the show, and the absolute core idea of Buffy, as Joss Whedon said many times, is that the teenaged blonde who gets chased into the alley by the evil monster turns around and kicks his ass ( ... )

gpi_s_avery September 26 2009, 01:21:07 UTC

Sorry, I think the point flew right past you, no worries, I put it down to the headaches you've been suffering through ( ... )

m_mcgregor September 26 2009, 02:03:57 UTC

Sorry, I think the point flew right past you, no worries, I put it down to the headaches you've been suffering through.

What a tremendously dickish thing to say.

You say "but I'm not sure how this relates to what I was talking about."
The point wasn't "spike is awful... etc etc etc"... the point was that this author spotted the poison that kills the show.

The poison that kills what makes the show good is when any of the characters betray the group dynamic.

If Xander stops being Xander and becomes some arrogant swaggering bore, it poisons the dynamic.

If Buffy stops being Buffy and becomes some arrogant swaggering bore, it poisons the dynamic.

If Willow stops being Willow and becomes some arrogant swaggering bore, it poisons the dynamic.
All of which has nothing to do with what I've been talking about. All you're doing here is taking the opportunity to complain about Buffy the show. I get it. You don't like the direction of the show, but that has nothing to do with the topic at hand, which is how things that sound bad on the ( ... )

Thread 8

waddis September 26 2009, 04:43:27 UTC

I was gonna comment on this shortly after I read it, but I got attacked by a squirrel.

That's not a lie; I wish it were.

I don't have a lot to say about premise, since I wholeheartedly agree with what you pointed out.

On your first point, though, specifically with regards to The Wonderland Subject, the best part of that story, to me, was Xander's disenchantment with being a superhero, specifically how, even with powers, there were still limits to what he could do. He may have been superhuman, but he was still human.

If you'll forgive the idolization of that statement.

Mary Suing is a serious accusation to make of anyone, and whenever I see the comments in, for instance, the Buffy vs. Cap'n America scenes, I get a little angry.

m_mcgregor September 27 2009, 00:52:23 UTC

You gotta watch out for squirrels, they are tricksome beasts ( ... )

waddis September 27 2009, 17:05:27 UTC

Hmm. You make it sound like they want a Mary Sued Xander.

I dunno, my longest-running piece stars an on-his-own Xander trying to make do in Africa, but there's no power to be had. I like to think he's anything but a Mary Sue, because he's often overwhelmed, regularly confused, and having trouble coping with what he encounters.

Just, otherwise, I don't think it'd be very fun to write. And if it's not fun to write, I don't see how it can be fun to read.

wittgens September 26 2009, 18:06:37 UTC

While I am still furious at how you Mary Sued the hell out of Buffy in A Wonderland Subject, it was still a pretty darn fine story. So I guess I can see what you mean.

But seriously, I do agree that people shouldn't dismiss things as not worthwhile based on premise. I think it's fine to dismiss something as probably not being "my kind of thing" based on the premise. But saying that is just flat out not good because of that? Kind of lame.

m_mcgregor September 27 2009, 00:54:27 UTC

Yeah, I mean I'm not out there reading political thrillers or murder mystery books, but I don't claim they're bad stories. I just don't care about the genre or the premise. If someone came up to me though and said, "Hey you have to read this [ostensibly a murder mystery] book! It's so great and it's unlike anything you've ever read before!" then maybe I'd give it a shot.

Just pays to keep an open mind about such things. You never know when a new favorite will come around the corner.

nocturnalista September 26 2009, 18:09:52 UTC

I agree with the fact that a good writer can turn any situation into a good and satisfying story. I'm just sick of the current trend in the Fantasy/SciFi genre that dictates that a person needs super powers or a special destiny to be interesting. It's what killed "Buffy" for me, it's what killed "BSG" for me.

I'd rather read about non-powered, non-destinied Xander any day, because that's what made him, as far as I'm concerned, the most interesting character on "Buffy."

m_mcgregor September 27 2009, 01:04:25 UTC

I agree with you on that, although it's a very difficult trope to turn on its head, especially in a sci-fi/fantasy genre. I've been trying to write an original story for a while, and I keep going back and forth between wanting to have the hero or heroes simply be great because of who they are and the circumstances of their birth, or be great because they do things that make them great ( ... )

nocturnalista September 27 2009, 01:56:39 UTC

Presentation is the biggest part of the battle. Too often, to me, destiny or superpowers lead to weak storytelling. For example, on BSG, Starbuck devolved from flawed but strong female lead to some pawn of fate who alternately clung to whatever was available or kicked ass. Destiny provided an instant, easy storyline at the cost of real character development, and frankly, I was sick of the character about halfway through the series ( ... )