Karelian?

[ulvesang]

An earlier post mentioning Finno-Ugric languages eventually mentioned the Karelian language. Now, I'd never heard of a proper Karelian tongue, but it's gotten me interested as to what this is exactly. I have a friend from Finnish Karelia who, as I initially assumed, speaks really goofy, old-fashioned Finnish, but this new tidbit has me wondering if

Comments

[teap]

I have no idea if anyone in Finland still speaks it. My guess is if they do, they are not very young... But yes there is Karelian language. I even found a whole website dedicated to it - in Finnish though. It is said to be the nearest relative language to Finnish. Last year they even published a dictionary for it here in Finland.

Here you go:
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4280/eng_linkit.html

[alcarilinque]

I'd assume not many people do speak it in Finland. There's more in Russia, certainly, but the language is beginning to die out, as more people learn russia, and more children are raised bilingual, and speak Karelian at home.

[allassein]

According to the Wikipedia entry on the Karelian language, it is indeed still spoken in Finland, by about 5000 people, as well as by people in the Russian Republic of Karelia. The Wiki has some additional information, and is actually more in-depth than I expected, given the relative obscurity of the subject.

[apoivre]

as per the latest census, 35,000+ people speak it in Russian Karelia alone (can't be bothered to check the neighbouring regions): 31,794 Karels, 2,470 Russians, 404 Finns, etc

[muckefuck]

Since most of the runot which made it in were collected in Karelia, my understanding is that the language of the Kalevala has a fair number of Karelian forms and terms. (One that springs to mind from my limited perusal is otso for karhu.) Could this be part of what makes Karelian sound like "old-fashioned Finnish" to you?

[ulvesang]

Well I can't remember many specific examples, but she claims that most Finns make fun of her and those in her region because they talk like "old people", and uses bizarre words and phrases. Like kokko instead of the proper kotka.

[alcarilinque]

Bears were considered at one point to be rather holy animals in terms of finnic religions, so there've been a number of terms for them, one was taboo at one point as a result. According to the Finnish wiki entry on 'karhu', yes:

Karhulla on Suomen kielessä monia kutsumanimiä, muun muassa otso, mesikämmen, kontio, metsän omena, metsän kuningas ja nalle. Myös "karhu" on alun perin kiertoilmaus, tarkoittaen karheaa turkkia, mutta sittemmin se on vakiintunut karhun nimeksi. Kiertoilmauksia käyttämällä muinaissuomalaiset ovat halunneet välttää kutsumasta petoa luokseen. Kristillisyyden syventyessä ja vanhojen käsitysten hävitessä karhua on alettu entistä enemmän vihata ja pelätä, vaikka siihen liittyvä myyttinen kunnioitus ei olekaan täysin hävinnyt.

In the Finnish language there are many terms for 'bear', among others: otso, mesikämmen, kontio, metsän omena, metsän kuningas and nalle. Also, "karhu" was originally a circumlocution meaning a rough fur, but later on it became established as the name of bears. By using these

[alcarilinque]

Oh right; the word I've seen in use in (southern dialects of) Karelian is kondie.

[tonique]

It's quite probable that your friend speaks a dialect spoken in Finnish Karelia, of which two main groups exist: the southeastern dialects and eastern Savo dialects. The latter share many features with the actual Karelian language. The former are what Finns will generally think of when they speak of Karelian dialects.

Wikipedia has plenty of information on various Karelias...