I think that the first point in number five- about how so little sexuality is shown, but so much violence is- is less a quirk of the fantasy genre and more of a western (nowadays it's in particular North America, but nearly all western cultures are guilty of it) cultural norm. It takes far more violence to change the rating of a movie than it does sex, and while many people find it easy to take offense at "immoral sexual behavior" or the "sanctity of marriage," relatively little initiative has been taken in regards to toning down depictions of violence (with the notable exception of video games, the only medium I've seen such an initiative in). Even a children's story can depict people being killed (sometimes in truly gruesome ways, a la the brothers Grimm), but a work that contains sexuality is incredibly controversial.
Other than that, though, these are excellent, especially the point about "serious optimism."
Definitely! And it's something that's tripping me up right now, because I'm trying to write a young adult targeted fantasy novel, and I'm realizing that if I let my protagonist have a few old schoolgirl crushes on her female classmates, I'll never be able to market the thing as young adult. Somehow it would be okay if I gave her a tragic past with (not much detailed) sexual abuse, but a few kisses with other girls and it would be aimed at a Mature Audience. Sigh.
As for the tales of the brothers Grimm, those I'll at least defend in that they weren't originally meant for children, or at least not only for children. Adults could sit around and enjoy the story of Goldilocks being caught by the bears, and ineffectively not-quite-killed until they finally did her in by impaling her on a church steeple. (Which is, in my opinion, a much more fitting ending for a fairy tale about a kid who goes breaking and entering with no listed cause.)
Although you have to wonder why they were diluted for children in the first place. Just comparing the real Goldilocks with the kiddy one makes me confused. All Goldilocks would teach children is "Breaking and entering is a horrible thing because every house is a death trap" - which by itself is a good enough lesson.
Anyways, my point is that I'm newly fond of the whole child eating an apple from a tree with hanged men on it idea. It's morbid but equally delectable. It's not from a book is it? I feel the need to write something about it :o
I was actually referring to the later watered-down ones in that reference, which still reflect the higher tolerance in western culture for violence than for sexuality (cannibalism is okay to describe, but premarital sex can't be alluded to!) not the originals, but you make a good point.
One of teh reasons I love Glen Cook's Black Company series is, that he has a nasty way of reminding you that these protagonists are not Good Guys after you've gotten complacent and are sympathizing with the characters. One favorite moment, from which book I've forgotten, is when Croaker and some of the others are inside a building, in the aftermath of a battle, and he mentions hearing the mercs outside guarding the prisoners shouting at them and making them dig graves. And near the end of the scene, Croaker matter-of-factly mentions hearing the screams of the prisoners as they discover that the graves they were digging were their own. It's horrible, and yet it makes perfect sense - you can't afford to hang on to them and you cna't afford to let them go and you can't spare any of your own soldiers to dig the graves - and it's also kind of funny. Certainly makes /me/ realize that these characters I've been rooting for really are black bastards at heart with different priorities and morals than I have
( ... )
One thing I love about Croaker is how utterly unromantic he is, and remains. He says he's unromantic at one point, despite the silly romantic writing he does, and, well, he is. The "love of a good woman" doesn't alter his whole character for the better.
A favorite Croaker moment of mine: when he crawls out of his tent after sharing it with said good woman, and says something to the effect of: it's a really good feeling knowing you're the only one in this entire army to get some last night.
(must ... not ... reread ... now! no ... time! aaaaarg!)
Authors creating their own genres. Or subgenres, maybe, since if it was a whole other genre entirely, I suppose it wouldn’t be fantasy.
tiamatschild and I were talking yesterday about how much we like "fantasy" that's really more like pseudohistory; no magic or anything to speak of, but still noticeably not our world, rather like Kay's Sarantium and Le Guin's Orsinia and a lot of Lloyd Alexander. It's not alternate history as such, because it doesn't hinge on a defining event where it ceased to be Reality.
*likes this rant; it gives her Interesting Thoughts*
Want a beta? Or a cheerleader? I've been writing in that fandom for a couple of years now (I know it's melodramatic, but I adore the worldbuilding and the secondary characters, at least in her first trilogy) and I can count on one hand the number of fics that I can read without cringing. (I do, however, recommend "I Am The Pirate Queen" over at The Pit.)
then you get the predictably cute denoument of the hero walking back into that town, now with a limp and a scar and a battered sword, and marrying his True Love (who never, you know, married the blacksmith in his absence).
Unless you're Robin Hobb, who never quite grasped the concept of "happy ending". Which was wonderful up until "Fool's Fate", at which point I got somewhat, er, irate.
Oh, and um, hi, Limyaael. I've been avidly following your rants for some time now, and enjoy them immensely. So wonderful to find something that makes me think. :-)
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Other than that, though, these are excellent, especially the point about "serious optimism."
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As for the tales of the brothers Grimm, those I'll at least defend in that they weren't originally meant for children, or at least not only for children. Adults could sit around and enjoy the story of Goldilocks being caught by the bears, and ineffectively not-quite-killed until they finally did her in by impaling her on a church steeple. (Which is, in my opinion, a much more fitting ending for a fairy tale about a kid who goes breaking and entering with no listed cause.)
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Anyways, my point is that I'm newly fond of the whole child eating an apple from a tree with hanged men on it idea. It's morbid but equally delectable. It's not from a book is it? I feel the need to write something about it :o
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(must ... not ... reread ... now! no ... time! aaaaarg!)
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Oh, and I guess I'll get around to introducing myself as well, Limyaael. I got here through my sister anonymous_bosh.
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(and I think I have to go tinker with a motivation in my current one...)
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tiamatschild and I were talking yesterday about how much we like "fantasy" that's really more like pseudohistory; no magic or anything to speak of, but still noticeably not our world, rather like Kay's Sarantium and Le Guin's Orsinia and a lot of Lloyd Alexander. It's not alternate history as such, because it doesn't hinge on a defining event where it ceased to be Reality.
*likes this rant; it gives her Interesting Thoughts*
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(The comment has been removed)
Want a beta? Or a cheerleader? I've been writing in that fandom for a couple of years now (I know it's melodramatic, but I adore the worldbuilding and the secondary characters, at least in her first trilogy) and I can count on one hand the number of fics that I can read without cringing. (I do, however, recommend "I Am The Pirate Queen" over at The Pit.)
then you get the predictably cute denoument of the hero walking back into that town, now with a limp and a scar and a battered sword, and marrying his True Love (who never, you know, married the blacksmith in his absence).
Unless you're Robin Hobb, who never quite grasped the concept of "happy ending". Which was wonderful up until "Fool's Fate", at which point I got somewhat, er, irate.
Oh, and um, hi, Limyaael. I've been avidly following your rants for some time now, and enjoy them immensely. So wonderful to find something that makes me think. :-)
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(The comment has been removed)
(Everyone always goes, "Work more on Hedika!" and there's nothing more to say about her)
Been there, done that. I fume whenever I get an "Update this!" review for something that's clearly marked as a one-shot.
New project sounds thoroughly cool...light Jewels get no love whatsoever, so it'd be great to see one in a fic.
*quietly and sheepishly hands Limyaael her thread back*
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