Rich People Demanding Higher Taxes

[jordan179]

Some people are confused (or enraged, or inspired) by the existence of rich people -- some of them very rich -- who call for higher taxes on the wealthy. Are they being stupid? Self-destructive? Nobly self-sacrificing?

No, to all of these.

The rich people who want higher taxes on the rich are well aware that taxes do not destroy the wealth of

Comments

[operations]

While I agree with that theory Jordan, the reason no one really cares at this point if we tax the rich more is because most of us are struggling in this economy to go from Poor to Working Class or maybe even Lower-Middle Class. For a great majority of us, the idea of becoming rich will never even enter into the equation.

[jordan179]

This is foolish in the long run, as depressions don't last forever. They only look like forever at the time.

[gothelittle]

Aye aye, and this is what I point out to my friends when they despair of ever being able to retire. The people who were in their 30's *during* the Great Depression were starting to retire during the Roaring 50's and 60's.

That's also why my mother and grandmother taught me so strongly to never take a 30-year loan on variable rate interest. Within 30 years, entire generations happen, and the entire world can change. Heck the 80's was about 30 years ago now! Anyone else here remember when we all wondered if Russia was going to launch nuclear missiles at us? "Mr. Gorbachev, TEAR DOWN THIS WALL!"

By the time those of us in our 30's hit retirement, President Obama is going to seem just as far away as Reagan is now.

[prester_scott]

By the time those of us in our 30's hit retirement, President Obama is going to seem just as far away as Reagan is now.

This is true, but it could be true in either direction. Obama may be the last in a long chain of statists that plunge us into irreformable tyranny or anarchy. We could be looking back at 2012 the way Soviet subjects looked back at 1917 -- and that bad patch lasted well over a generation.

[luagha]

Anyone at any time in the US can write a check to the department of the national debt and make a direct payment against our national debt.

No one has any reason at all to listen to any of these people until they all come forward with their checks and make their willing, voluntary overpayments.

(When Warren Buffett was asked about this, he said that he doesn't invest in government because it doesn't have an efficient return. Surprise surprise.)

[cipher_six]

Exactly.

They want to remove the opportunity that allowed them to become wealthy, as last I checked most of the 1% in this country are still self-made (give it time, though, for it to flip to hereditary wealth as opportunity declines).

It bothers me that you have millionaires like Buffett are trying to get laws passed to tell other rich people to do with their money (while refusing to do the same voluntarily, a very childish "if he doesn't have to then neither do I!" attitude); you have the #Occupy movement trying to get laws passed telling the rich what do do with their money; andn then you have the politicians who are listening to them. My children will not have the same opportunities for wealth creation that I did, or that my parents' did, and its the fault not of the wealthy, but of the minority who don't believe anyone but themselves has the right to be wealthy.

[cipher_six]

Oh here you go:

http://dailycaller.com/2011/11/17/patriotic-millionaires-demand-higher-taxes-but-unwilling-to-pay-up-video/#ooid=9qcG4wMzqAYp0d-USgHvosm1FKEyxk0t

[bojojoti]

Thanks for that link. Very interesting.

Reasoning?

[zornhau]

It's a gloriously paranoid idea. It might even be true. However, please could you take us through the reasoning - just a two contrasting scenarios would be fine, e.g. Mr Noveau-Riche and Mrs Oldgold...

Re: Reasoning?

[marycatelli]

Mrs. Oldgold has an income of a million dollars a year from her investments of -- oh -- 25 million. Mr. Noveau-Riche is earning a million dollar a year salary and wants to sock away half of it every year. If Mrs. Oldgold ensures that he gets half of it taxed away, he won't be able to.

Re: Reasoning?

[jordan179]

Since income is taxed but assets are not, income taxes are a way to prevent people from getting rich, not from remaining rich. I don't really have the time between my jobs to construct a spreadsheeted scenario for you: the math should be obvious even if you assume complete honesty on the part of all involved. Factor in tax avoidance, let alone tax evasion (both of which are far easier for those who are already rich) and the advantage which high income taxes give old money should be really obvious. Consider not only tax shelters but family trusts, sometimes of a disguised nature using old-boy hiring networks to take care of incompetent relatives, the opportunities for offshore investment (possibly of funds never declared) and the storage of wealth in the form of small tangible assets, for instance.

Re: Reasoning?

[zornhau]

Brilliant!