(Untitled)

[ficangel]

stardust_rain's post of yesterday got me thinking, because both arguments that seem to be dominating discussions-"LJ wants fandom gone" vs. "LJ is in heap-big financial trouble"-both seem to have their flaws. If LJ wants fandom gone, why not just yank on the copyright violation angle, which is much more plausible than ZOMGCHILDPORN!? If LJ is in heap-big

Comments

(works with 6A, but this isn't official LJ policy)

[anildash]

Hi, I work at Six Apart but not on the LJ team, but I thought I might have some perspectives that are useful here. This is my opinion as a team member, not official 6A policy, so please be gentle

Re: (works with 6A, but this isn't official LJ policy)

[anildash]

I think the comments weren't maxed out on that post because a lot of folks glanced at the advertising onslaught, said whoa, 'not interested' and stopped reading.

Also, since it's become clear that 6A is never going to PROVIDE A CLEAR AND UNAMBIGUOUS SET OF GUIDELINES FOR ACCEPTABLE POSTING CONTENT, many people have taken their creative content elsewhere

Re: (works with 6A, but this isn't official LJ policy)

[mzcalypso]

Sorry, didn't intend this as anonymous, I wasn't logged in.

Re: (works with 6A, but this isn't official LJ policy)

[theantijoss]

if we were gonna do something like that *we'd just tell you*. Pretty straightforward.

Yes, because your company is known for clear and open communication with its paying userbase.

And we all know that corporations don't exist to make a profit, they exist to make the world a better place!

Glad you cleared that up for us. Thanks!

Re: (works with 6A, but this isn't official LJ policy)

[anildash]

I'm not arguing that we're not also in business to make money or to be successful by any one of a dozen other measures; I'm just saying we don't need to mislead anyone to do so, nor do we intend to mislead anyone to do so.

As I readily admit, we can do a better job of this, and I'm trying to. For what it's worth, I think a lot of us at 6A share the same cynicism about corporations, and I've been at 6A since the beginning and have spent a *lot* of time and effort trying to make sure we're not just an ethical company but that we're also one that treats its customers and its community well.

I do understand if you don't believe that right now, but I'd be remiss if I didn't mention that it matters to us as a company, and to me personally.

Re: (works with 6A, but this isn't official LJ policy)

[theantijoss]

Well, if you're going to go and get all "fellow cynic" on me, I'm going to have to take off my Huffy Hat and sulk.

I realize that you're just one guy in a company, and I do know how that feels. At this point, for many of us, this just doesn't feel like the safe fan zone it once was. People are bitter -- it's like having your right-wing conservative grandma move into your crunchy hippie rainbow house and start wielding her cane in an unpleasant way.

Or, you know, replacing the fresh squeezed orange juice with Pepsi Max, randomly and inconsistently burning some books that may be questionable and not others that are really, obviously objectionable, and then painting the whole place puce without ever answering any questions as to why. Although the other housemates seem happy to answer for her, it doesn't mean much if Grandma can't or won't get her own shite together enough to make a definitive statement until long after the damage is done

Re: (works with 6A, but this isn't official LJ policy)

[buggery]

People are bitter -- it's like having your right-wing conservative grandma move into your crunchy hippie rainbow house and start wielding her cane in an unpleasant way.

Or, you know, replacing the fresh squeezed orange juice with Pepsi Max, randomly and inconsistently burning some books that may be questionable and not others that are really, obviously objectionable, and then painting the whole place puce without ever answering any questions as to why. Although the other housemates seem happy to answer for her, it doesn't mean much if Grandma can't or won't get her own shite together enough to make a definitive statement until long after the damage is done.

My metaphor is weak

Oh, NO. Your metaphor is *perfect*. ::applauds::

Re: (works with 6A, but this isn't official LJ policy)

[elfwreck]

have spent a *lot* of time and effort trying to make sure we're not just an ethical company but that we're also one that treats its customers and its community well.By whose standards? The company's

Re: (works with 6A, but this isn't official LJ policy)

[mzcalypso]

The problem with you personally vs. 'you' as a corporation is that a corporation can do damn near anything and NOBODY is willing to take responsiblity.

Abe Hassan ridiculed your paying customers in a way that would have got him fired in any face-to-face business. I guess he's off the hotseat and you're the new spin doctor? It doesn't matter what any individual member of 6A says to anybody in these journals--until and unless 6A changes the way it has been arbitrarily reinterpreting the rules, refusing to alter TOS officially in order to weasel out of the California requirement that you give users the option of a refund if they can't stomach the changes... there is no reason for anybody to trust you

I have a nice simple question.

[buggery]

This hentai cartoon of a prepubescent girl being raped (first image) and what appears to be a photograph of a naked young girl (third image) were among the images used to spam a LiveJournal community, members of which, objecting to the images and obedientgirl's message, reported the post to LJ Abuse... only to be told that sexual exploitation of *girls* " does not constitute a violation of the LiveJournal Terms of Service"!

Why is there a double standard being applied for heterosexual content which clearly violates the most-recently-released version of LJ's policy regarding child pornography and things which might look to a layperson like child pornography, as compared to homosexual content which might violate that policy if one squints and guesses and opts for the broadest possible reading of the policy?

(Someone took a screenshot of that post, by the way, and I'm sure it will go up somewhere if obedientgirl or LJ Abuse ever get around to deleting the post or the journal.)

Re: I have a nice simple question.

[anildash]

Wait, I read the email posted on genderqueer and didn't see any mention of the gender of the person in the pictures having anything to do with the judgment rendered.

I don't see any evidence from the links you've provided of a double standard, and of course our policy doesn't endorse or support any kind of double standard. There's nothing in the email from Megan that says anything about *girls* at all, is there?

I do see frustration that our policy doesn't block people from being total assholes, which it would appear this troll/spammer is being, but of course that's in the eye of the beholder so we *can't* make that kind of policy, anyway.

Maybe I'm being overly simplistic, but if someone's spamming a community repeatedly, why don't the mods just ban them? Am I missing something?

Re: I have a nice simple question.

[oconel]

I don't think the problem is that the email mentioned that a girl can be exploited sexually, but the fact that pictures of fictional characters (that happened to be in homosexual relationship) have their authors banned, while the characters of an hentai image (hetersexual, and minors) and the picture of a girl who could be underaged, just get the answer of "ban the user from the community".

I think that's where the people see the double standard.

Re: I have a nice simple question.

[anildash]

Ah, okay. I don't know the specifics of the individual images being discussed. (And blech, I really don't *want* to) but I'd guess it depends on how graphic the images themselves are, not the genders or apparent gender identities of anybody involved.

FWIW, we're a very LGBTQ-positive company, and I'd guess most members of abuse and support identify as somewhere 2 or higher on the Kinsey scale. I'll cop to a lot of miscommunication on our part, but the charges of homophobia just don't fly with me. I think if it *is* true that more suspensions or reviews are of homosexual content, it's probably because most fic is of homosexual content. It breaks my heart to see that people think we're anti-gay, but I don't think I could change anybody's mind about that, since the feeling is mostly an emotional thing anyway.

Re: I have a nice simple question.

[oconel]

I'd guess it depends on how graphic the images themselves are, not the genders or apparent gender identities of anybody involved.

The girl was completely naked (frontal) and I'm not sure about if the nipples could be seen in the hentai picture. Anyway, I think the RL girl is more important than a drawing (hentai is legal on the US anyway, right?). In that post there were several pics & drawings of women being spanked and arses and stuff.

We're a very LGBTQ-positive company
I don't doubt it. I think this just has been really badly handled, but the message those mistakes give your users is that gay=bad, women explotation=right. Again, we're back to miscommunication and no answers bringing up theories about LJ being evil.

Re: Photobucket took action. Link to screenshot.

[oconel]

I'm glad someone made a screencap about it. I was more worried about the RL girl and didn't remember the details of the hentai one.