What the fuck is wrong with people?

Oct 02, 2013 23:16

The fringe right thinks they can hold our government hostage as a method of mending laws ( Read more... )

intellectual liberal, american century, culture wars, politics, teotwawki, health care reform

Leave a comment

Comments 84

ford_prefect42 October 3 2013, 03:37:59 UTC
It is pretty freakin' shocking isn't it?

I'm fair vituperative at times, this I know. Yet, I find myself being the voice of reason all over my FB. It's genuinely difficult to respond levelly to outright calls for my murder. But many of my friends seem to need to be reminded that that's *me* they're talking about.

Interestingly, the 18 year old on my FB list is the best of them, taking basically nonpartisan positions, and poking fun at the doomsday-sayers. I'm really proud of him.

BTW, just for the record, 56% of the population wants the mandate delayed.
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/healthcare/health_care_law

Not that that's by any means, the salient point, but I remain at least that partisan :)

Reply

gwendally October 3 2013, 03:51:02 UTC
I definitely do not want the have it delayed by any means possible. In fact, at this point I don't even want it delayed. I want it implemented and fixed.

But, seriously, who thinks that our Congress is capable of fixing it? It's such a clusterfuck.

But... since we're going down anyway, I say free health care for all! We'll be in better shape when the government collapses completely. Sounds like a win to me.

Basic premise here is: if you're going to go bankrupt anyway, may as well go on a spending spree first. Get while the getting is good, particularly consumables that are investments like health care.

So I'm for it, even though I think we're fucked with it.

Reply

tobor_1138 October 3 2013, 04:10:39 UTC
At least Abe has the cultural heritage to channel a Samurai.

We, on the other hand, are playing with knives.

Reply

gwendally October 3 2013, 12:09:52 UTC
Your reference was (once again) too subtle for me. Are the Japanese following a similar path?

Reply


bart_calendar October 3 2013, 09:24:08 UTC
I'm not advocating violence against Tea Party supporters, simply re-education camps.

Reply

gwendally October 3 2013, 11:51:41 UTC
What is your opinion on the devaluation of the dollar, the impact of inflation on the hollowing out of the middle class, and the United State's ability to pay back the current official and unofficial debt?

Do you find ANY cause to be concerned in any of these arenas?

Don't know?

Maybe you should try listening to what OTHER PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT before you dismiss them as evil quacks.

They have exactly as much merit as the concern about people being unable to get adequate health care. THEY ARE BOTH RIGHT.

That's why this sucks so much.

Reply

bart_calendar October 3 2013, 11:59:37 UTC
The middle class is over in America no matter what. The US will be able to pay off it's debt - because Baby Boomers won't live forever. And I've yet to see any Federal government action in 25 years of monitoring currencies that has any real, long term effect on the value of the dollar. Mostly because China is happy to keep us as a reserve currency and the Euro zone is far, far more fucked than we are as is the UK, so there is no real alternative safe haven currency for people, which will mean that it will keep its value long term. (If I didn't think this I'd have my clients pay me in Euros or Pounds instead of dollars.)

Reply

gwendally October 3 2013, 12:06:37 UTC
You show lovely, if somewhat misinformed, faith.

Point is, the people who ARE concerned about this are neither stupid nor evil. They're just focused on things that you're not worried about.

Carry on.

Reply


haikujaguar October 3 2013, 10:22:39 UTC
Thank you for saying this. :(

Reply


oscarmama October 3 2013, 16:43:29 UTC
There are serious problems with the information environment, and have been.

There are many who don't realize that the PPACA met paygo rules but that axing it would make things worse because of the cuts to revenue. There are also Republican LEGISLATORS who don't realize the President put chained CPI on the table a looooooong time ago. Heck, the President's most recent budget proposal included means-testing Medicare.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/03/01/what-we-have-here-is-a-failure-to-communicate/

In science writing and medical writing we have been dealing with this for over a decade; it doesn't surprise me to see it spill over into discussions of healthcare, simply because we're talking about how people access medical care and the scientific evidence supporting various forms of care, and that has been problematic for years and years.

Reply

gwendally October 3 2013, 18:14:30 UTC
With the issues already so complex and so hard to discuss, it drives me crazy that people reach for "they're evil and stupid if they disagree with me." It's absolutely maddening. NO! That's not how you discern truth, by assuming you have nothing to learn from people who disagree with you, and, in fact, they should be stomped out!

Arrrggh!

Reply

ford_prefect42 October 3 2013, 23:14:33 UTC
It's not that most of us don't *know* that PPACA met Paygo rules, it's that we don't believe (and are, incidentally, correct in that belief), that those rules will ultimately translate to deficit neutral, or ultimate deficit reduction. Here's why ( ... )

Reply

gwendally October 3 2013, 23:23:22 UTC
The employer mandate is fatally flawed. The way it works is that employers who have more than 50 employees must provide "creditable coverage" (i.e., possibly more expensive) health insurance to their employees that does not cost more than (I forget exactly, but something like) 9% of the employee's household income. If the insurance is not at least that generous the employer will get hit with a fine of $2,000 per employee ( ... )

Reply


foreverbeach October 4 2013, 11:51:45 UTC
It's hard to treat people with respect when you have a system of government you despise forcibly imposed on you against your will, and you are thus systematically robbed and regulated by your inferiors. I don't respect statists and I will never respect statists.

Reply

gwendally October 4 2013, 12:26:41 UTC
The tricky time for using your respect-muscles is when you disagree with them ( ... )

Reply

foreverbeach October 4 2013, 12:53:00 UTC
Again, do respect the robber, the rapist, the murderer? I don't. That's what statism is: rape, robbery, and murder.

Reply

gwendally October 4 2013, 17:37:19 UTC
You're a soldier, so you see everything as a battle. Statism is SIMILAR to robbery. It does not resemble either rape, uh, you know what rape is, right?) nor does it resemble murder. (Every regime has murder in its toolkit.)

What makes statism different than robbery is the consent of the governed. If the sheep are clammoring to be fleeced you cannot call it robbery anymore. Now it's "difference in political philosophies."

Differing philosophies do not lend themselves to being debated from a position of warring nations. (Neither do warring nations.) Diplomacy and skills necessary for co-existing need to be brought in to play because, here's the thing: war is worse. It really is worse than being taxed. Because in war you get taxed AND raped AND killed. Engaging with war with your political foes means you LOSE EVERY ARGUMENT.

So get some new skills, soldier.

Reply


Leave a comment

Up