PS Chapter Four: "The Keeper of the Keys"

[for_diddled]

* I remember how in the good old days before DH came out this chapter title spurred much interesting speculation regarding potential Hagrid-St. Peter parallels.

Comments

Nicer people

[hwyla]

Are you sure Hagrid said James and Lily were 'nice'? I seem to remember it as Hagrid saying they were 'good' - which does not equal 'nice'. I only recall it because I remember arguing that 'good' could mean talented as opposed to actually non-evil or even just nice

Re: Nicer people

[for_diddled]

Are you sure Hagrid said James and Lily were 'nice'? I seem to remember it as Hagrid saying they were 'good' - which does not equal 'nice'. I only recall it because I remember arguing that 'good' could mean talented as opposed to actually non-evil or even just nice.

He says both: on p. 45 of the 1997 Bloomsbury edition, Hagrid says "Now, yer mum an' dad were as good a witch an' wizard as I ever knew. Head Boy an' Girl at Hogwarts in their day! Suppose the myst'ry is why You-Know-Who never tried to get 'em on his side before..." And a couple of paragraphs later, after getting out a handkerchief and blowing his nose: "Sorry. But it's that sad -- knew yer mum an' dad, an' nicer people yeh couldn't find."

Re: Nicer people

[hwyla]

Thanks! Apparently, I've had it wrong all along!

RE: Re: Nicer people

[nx74defiant]

Hagrid also thinks Aragon is nice.

[vermouth1991]

* “Yeh look a lot like yer dad, but yeh’ve got yer mum’s eyes. Probably time you gave them back to her.”

Reminds me of a creepy Internet short story I'd read: I have a crush on this girl. She had the most beautiful green eyes. That's why I carry them with me. At all times. In a jar. }:)

[josephinestone]

The reason that Lily's sacrifice matters is because she had a choice, when most people they attacked didn't. For instance, James also died before he killed Lily, but he never asked James to step aside. It wasn't that Lily was the first to die protecting someone she loved, it was that she was the first that Voldemort ever gave that option to

[hwyla]

Altho' I like your interpretation that Voldie still has some humanity, I'm not sure I agree that it is needed for him to give Lily the option to step aside.

He might also be doing so to have leverage over Sev, After all, Sev risked his life in asking she be left alive. Keeping her alive gives Voldy someone he can threaten if Sev ever becomes a problem. And just the fact that Sev asked for her life shows that he just might become one.

This also comes at a time when Sev had begun working at Hogwarts (the giving Lily the option - not Sev's asking). That has to raise a bit of worry, even if it was on Voldy's orders.

We know that when Voldy returns, he assumes Sev will no longer be loyal. I would think that indicates that Voldy was going to allow Lily to live in order to ensure Sev's loyalty. Once she's dead, Voldy assumes Sev will no longer be loyal.

[for_diddled]

Given what we see of how Voldemort treats his DEs, I doubt concern for Severus' happiness was really on his mind. More likely he was doing it to put him in his debt, and/or to have someone to threaten if he ever stepped out of line. Besides, if Voldy really wanted to look after Snape's interests, he could have just stunned Lilly and either left her on the floor to wake up later or kidnapped her and handed her over to Severus.

[radicalhighway]

It's doubtful that its only because Voldemort gave Lily a choice.

This is repated in book 7, where Voldemort didn't really give Harry a choice just beforehand. He made some vague one about coming to him or he'd kill everyone else. Supposedly, that was the same thing.

Plus, Voldemort was never portrayed as having any kind of humanity. He was always a monster (or a monster in the making). He certainly had no humanity left when he gave Harry the choice in book 7, otherwise no such thing as Voldemort being "beyond help" according to Dumbledore (its true he's disgusting liar and manipulator though).

Still, it's completely impossible that such a "choice" hasn't ever been done. Furthermore, why would it not work for other spells and therefore more known? Just bulshit from JKR.

[aikaterini]

/"‘I know some things,’ [Harry] said. ‘I can, you know, do maths and stuff.’" Unlike most wizards, who as far as we can tell never bother with anything so prosaic as mathematics

[radicalhighway]

"JKR didn't stop to consider that by making James and Lily such awful people, she made lines like these from Petunia actually have a point, rather than just being simple nastiness."

Interestingly, in book 2, Vernon's sister accuses James of being unemployed and this upsets Harry... yet its true, he was unemployed LMAO. Nothing wrong with unemployment, but she wasn't lying and Harry blew up his aunt, amongst other reasons to be this one.

"And in five books from now, Hagrid's former classmate will do the same thing when he assigns Draco an impossible task in order to punish Lucius."

It's only bad when a Slytherin does it.

[jana_ch]

Yes, what exactly is the difference between being an unemployed lay-about and being independent wealthy? Isn’t that the definition of being gentry-not having to work for your living?

[seductivedark]

* I’m surprised Uncle Vernon managed to get a gun at such short notice, given all the checks you have to go through in England.

I'm not British, but I do know it's difficult to get hold of firearms over there, so this caught my eye, too. I thought that, maybe, it was shorthand for Vernon being corrupt in some way: either he already had a gun - and living in the suburbs, with no mention of his being an avid hunter, then that's a little odd; or, he got it through subversive means, perhaps as favoritism. (Someone who is British might be able to answer how this struck readers of the series on first go. It'd be interesting to find out.)

Of course, then I argued with myself that the guy who rented them the shack might have given it to them for the duration of the rental - maybe the crackpot thought there was a Kraken out there (but, in this universe, he might be right...) Or, that Vernon was indeed an avid hunter, at least for certain clients, and had the gun for those particular client visits.

[spongebending]

I have a head-canon that maybe Vernon got the gun because he knows about wizards, so he has this extra fear that other non-magical people don't really worry about. Most of them just go about their business oblivious, you know, but Vernon, he KNOWS that there are these powerful beings out there that could kill him instantly or even erase his mind! If I knew wizards were real, I'd probably go buy some sort defense against them this instant

[hwyla]

The shotgun connotations for me seemed to be part of 'Country House Weekends' - something Vernon would have (probably along with his golf clubs) to get ahead in business.

I've probably read too many stories about that type of weekend in murder mysteries. I have no idea if that's the implication for those raised in the UK, but I doubt their first thoughts of 'hunting' is 'redneck' (not that all hunters in the USA are rednecks, but many associate hunting as such).

[seductivedark]

I've lived in 'redneckville' for a while now, even worked at a convenience store selling hunting licenses during season. Hunting takes place in what are considered to be 'redneck' areas, but not all hunters are what one would consider to be rednecks. Just to clarify, of course, since not everyone is U. S.

I'd wondered if the shotgun was for hunting, or for posturing to be a hunter for clients who were. It might even help if he doesn't practice except while with clients, so the clients can do better than he does, so he can compliment them.