Reading some of the flames on the Pit, I don't think I've ever actually been flamed. Oh, I've gotten rude comments (and really enjoy replying to those :^P), but I've never been told to jump off a bridge, for example ...
I wonder what I'm doing wrong. >:^)
And I love blinkies! I have magpie tendencies to be drawn to sparkly things!
Fuck them. It's one person's opinion. Even novels regarded as some of the finest in history are hated by someone, as are the writers considered best at their craft. People who think their opinion = actual judgment of quality need their heads deflated. *proffers pin*
I think you've nailed it. Folks who are out to 'clean up' places like ff.net are either painfully naive, or (more often) doing it as a way to feel superior to 'those other crappy authors' (whose literary sin is often nothing more than having a different take on the subject than the flamer does). In the end, it's about the flamer's ego, not the literary quality (or lack of it) of their favored targets.
Honestly, I did see a comment once along the lines of, "Authors should be grateful when they get flamed." And the person was serious. The egos of these people, if spread into a thin sheet, would obliterate Canada.
I could be wrong, but I think I know who you are talking about here. I keep an eye on the place, just so I know what they're up to. Their attitude disgusts me as they are forcing people into writing what *they* see as good and are deeply condescending.
I am very much against flaming. OK, there is a lot of crap out there. But you simply do not know if that girl who wrote the mary-sue with the multi-coloured eyes might one day go on to get her name in the bestseller charts - if left to continue writing and growing.
One of the people in 'this place' was largely responsible for an author I greatly respected stopping writing a truly wonderful story that many were enjoying. That is something I can not easily forgive and I do not understand how they can take pleasure in this.
Also, as you said, this is about FUN. We write because we like doing it, whatever kind of story we favour. Once the fun leaves, the writers will to. And if people continue to flame, the fandom they profess to love will eventually just die.
I think I know the place you're talking about. ;) I'm not referring to any individual or group, per se; I've seen this attitude expressed by several different people, largely on the Pit of Voles, but in other Tolkien forums as well.
I do not understand how they can take pleasure in this.
Because it's a lot easier to tear someone else down than to work as hard as they do to achieve the same thing, I suspect. :)
For example, I work for hours each day on writing-related practice and activities. I see improvement in my writing, yes, but considering how hard I work, I think that glaciers might move faster!
Or the time that I spend on practicing, polishing, perfecting, and yes, reading other authors whom I admire, all in the name of improving my own writing, I could spend insulting those authors in an attempt to install myself at the top by default when they grow frustrated and quit or go elsewhere.
I think it's important to keep in mind that the time these people spend tearing down the work of others they are not spending on their own
( ... )
Just because I don't like bodice-rippers or Westerns or Mary Sues ... someone, somewhere in this world really does.
*raises hand proudly for bodice-rippers!!*
Hey, it is romance, and that's what I like to read. And double the points for steamy love scenes. Some books have lots of sex, others not nearly enough *giggle*. But I read them for the story as well. And of course, because I know that they'll end up with a happy-ever-after.
But I'll agree that I'm not much into westerns (ie, Louis Lamour) either. As for Mary Sues, I read more for the comedic value than anything... when I actually read a Mary Sue.
'Course, one could say that in a so-called bodice-ripper, the heroine suffers somewhat from a Sue complex. Which is rather humorous sometimes. ;-)
There is absolutely nothing wrong with liking bodice-rippers! Because you know what? I have a soft spot for those D&D-based sword-and-sorcery stories. Even the really bad ones. ;) We like what we like, and there's nothing wrong with that.
I should also add that I have not forgotten your beta. I've been swamped and have used your quiet muses as an excuse to poke along myself ... I will try my hardest to get it back to you this week! I'm so sorry for being a slug.
We like what we like, and there's nothing wrong with that.
Nope! Nothing wrong at all. I still read fantasy every once in a while. Maybe more like every blue moon since I can't yank my nose out of romance without instant withdrawal... And yes, I do know there's a certain amount of romance in fantasy. Just not enough to whet my appetite. So to speak... ;-)
I will try my hardest to get it back to you this week! I'm so sorry for being a slug.
No need to apologize! My muses haven't been totally quiet, but they aren't doing much work on my fanfic story. As of now, they're having a bit of fun creating my own historical romace (aka - bodice-ripper *grin*)... even though they are slow in that area too. :-)
I honestly wonder what makes those people tick. And then I realize...I don't wanna know. I mean, there's a forum on the Pit where they say they're offering- I dunno- offering to help writers improve and whatnot. When I visited it, I came across the most *pretentious* people who were preemptively rude to those they reviewed- I'm sorry, offered *advice*. I can't stand people like that.
(The owner of said forums left a review for one of my favourite authors on FF.net, advising her to get her a beta (that's how I found her forums in the first place). I'm afraid that got my back up even more. :\ )
which is, after all, meant to be all about fun, frivolity, and marrying Legolas astride a unicorn.
xD
And a (belated) Happy Birthday to Alex!! He's such a handsome, grown up doggy, yes he is...
You're probably on forums with the same people that I've been encountered. There is one in particular in the Tolkien section who offers "concrit" to those writers whom she feels have potential, only she does it in the most condescending way. She told someone on my flist that "if you fix these things, I'll add you to my C2 of good stories." WTF?!? Is that supposed to be a reward? To get added to some random, rude moron's C2?
But she's another of the flamers who is just "trying to clean up the website." I told her that she might want to consider visiting another archive, since ff.net has always been for mostly new and younger writers who don't "take their writing as seriously." Of course, she won't leave. They never do because half the fun for them is having those sorts of writers around, so that they can become better writers without actually having to become better writers.
!! Wow, I was reading some comments below and... yup, it's the same people. I always come across these kinds of people through a nasty shock where they end up either insulting or patronizing favourite authors of mine. Grr. *overprotective*
Is that supposed to be a reward? To get added to some random, rude moron's C2?
I know! It's more a punishment. D:< TBB (I'm reminded of tuberculosis every time I type that) was just rude...these people are condescending and rude, which makes it worse, IMHO.
Also, she says she doesn't attack writers, only stories...and then comes up with things like: "Do us all a favour, Love, choke on those marshmallows." And later on: "Idiot!"
...what? Did I miss something? Or does she not get what not attacking writers actually *means*?
so that they can become better writers without actually having to become better writers. Aw man, this made my evening.
Comments 77
(The comment has been removed)
I wonder what I'm doing wrong. >:^)
And I love blinkies! I have magpie tendencies to be drawn to sparkly things!
Reply
(The comment has been removed)
I got told I write like a 6th grader once.
Fuck them. It's one person's opinion. Even novels regarded as some of the finest in history are hated by someone, as are the writers considered best at their craft. People who think their opinion = actual judgment of quality need their heads deflated. *proffers pin*
Reply
Reply
The authors I admire most as writers are all very articulate, polite reviewers and very supportive ... or content to ignore what they don't like.
Now I know that correlation isn't causation, but it makes for mighty interesting speculation!
Reply
Indeed! It's a tough job, but someone's got to do it. Why aren't you properly grateful for their sacrifice on our behalf? :D
(I know being snarky isn't exactly polite either, but I'm human, and sometimes I just can't resist.)
Reply
Honestly, I did see a comment once along the lines of, "Authors should be grateful when they get flamed." And the person was serious. The egos of these people, if spread into a thin sheet, would obliterate Canada.
Reply
I am very much against flaming. OK, there is a lot of crap out there. But you simply do not know if that girl who wrote the mary-sue with the multi-coloured eyes might one day go on to get her name in the bestseller charts - if left to continue writing and growing.
One of the people in 'this place' was largely responsible for an author I greatly respected stopping writing a truly wonderful story that many were enjoying. That is something I can not easily forgive and I do not understand how they can take pleasure in this.
Also, as you said, this is about FUN. We write because we like doing it, whatever kind of story we favour. Once the fun leaves, the writers will to. And if people continue to flame, the fandom they profess to love will eventually just die.
Reply
I do not understand how they can take pleasure in this.
Because it's a lot easier to tear someone else down than to work as hard as they do to achieve the same thing, I suspect. :)
For example, I work for hours each day on writing-related practice and activities. I see improvement in my writing, yes, but considering how hard I work, I think that glaciers might move faster!
Or the time that I spend on practicing, polishing, perfecting, and yes, reading other authors whom I admire, all in the name of improving my own writing, I could spend insulting those authors in an attempt to install myself at the top by default when they grow frustrated and quit or go elsewhere.
I think it's important to keep in mind that the time these people spend tearing down the work of others they are not spending on their own ( ... )
Reply
*raises hand proudly for bodice-rippers!!*
Hey, it is romance, and that's what I like to read. And double the points for steamy love scenes. Some books have lots of sex, others not nearly enough *giggle*. But I read them for the story as well. And of course, because I know that they'll end up with a happy-ever-after.
But I'll agree that I'm not much into westerns (ie, Louis Lamour) either. As for Mary Sues, I read more for the comedic value than anything... when I actually read a Mary Sue.
'Course, one could say that in a so-called bodice-ripper, the heroine suffers somewhat from a Sue complex. Which is rather humorous sometimes. ;-)
Reply
I should also add that I have not forgotten your beta. I've been swamped and have used your quiet muses as an excuse to poke along myself ... I will try my hardest to get it back to you this week! I'm so sorry for being a slug.
Reply
Nope! Nothing wrong at all. I still read fantasy every once in a while. Maybe more like every blue moon since I can't yank my nose out of romance without instant withdrawal... And yes, I do know there's a certain amount of romance in fantasy. Just not enough to whet my appetite. So to speak... ;-)
I will try my hardest to get it back to you this week! I'm so sorry for being a slug.
No need to apologize! My muses haven't been totally quiet, but they aren't doing much work on my fanfic story. As of now, they're having a bit of fun creating my own historical romace (aka - bodice-ripper *grin*)... even though they are slow in that area too. :-)
Reply
(The owner of said forums left a review for one of my favourite authors on FF.net, advising her to get her a beta (that's how I found her forums in the first place). I'm afraid that got my back up even more. :\ )
which is, after all, meant to be all about fun, frivolity, and marrying Legolas astride a unicorn.
xD
And a (belated) Happy Birthday to Alex!! He's such a handsome, grown up doggy, yes he is...
Oh, and *pokes* ;).
Reply
But she's another of the flamers who is just "trying to clean up the website." I told her that she might want to consider visiting another archive, since ff.net has always been for mostly new and younger writers who don't "take their writing as seriously." Of course, she won't leave. They never do because half the fun for them is having those sorts of writers around, so that they can become better writers without actually having to become better writers.
Alex says thanks and sends *kisses*! :)
Reply
Is that supposed to be a reward? To get added to some random, rude moron's C2?
I know! It's more a punishment. D:< TBB (I'm reminded of tuberculosis every time I type that) was just rude...these people are condescending and rude, which makes it worse, IMHO.
Also, she says she doesn't attack writers, only stories...and then comes up with things like: "Do us all a favour, Love, choke on those marshmallows." And later on: "Idiot!"
...what? Did I miss something? Or does she not get what not attacking writers actually *means*?
so that they can become better writers without actually having to become better writers. Aw man, this made my evening.
Reply
Leave a comment