I hadn't heard of rebecca solnit before, but she sounds fun! I'm a sucker for that getting lost as a way of life, pseudo-situationist approach to meandering and remaking urban space along purely subjective lines. I do think, actually, with regard to what you're saying above about the people in wall-e doing everything automatically, that learning to get lost/remaking subjective time could be some kind of solution to that lifestyle. I do feel like the clock in/clock out/commute workday is a huge part of the problem with people feeling disconnected from their desires, whether for food or meaningful sex or whatever. This is why I'm glad to be a free wheelin graduate student.
I wish people would stop talking about Knocked UpmistercreepyJuly 30 2008, 17:09:11 UTC
I don't think what you said applies to that film. At the same time, I don't really want to discuss the film--my most recent viewing of it was flat and unfunny.
Man I don't know if there are sufficient epic David Lean style films on my canon. Does Speed count?
It's no surprise that your thoughts on WALL-E focus mostly on the first 15 minutes or so of the film. They're the best part of the film, and maybe the best thing Pixar has done. I went into the film a little grumpy and was immediately awed, not just visually, but as you say with WALL-E's unusual aesthetic (I'm not sure if the cockroach applies in his anthropomorphicness, but Hello Dolly! sure as hell does--no one likes that movie). The problem is, it's also (along with the dancing in space routine) the only salient part of the film.
The plot of WALL-E is so tangential to the development of the film, yet the filmmakers continually bring it to the forefront. And while the aesthetic and characters of the film imply some of the best work Pixar has ever done, the plot ends up
( ... )
i didn't mention "knocked up" to bait youdanschankJuly 30 2008, 18:59:52 UTC
i was just thinking of something recent and "adult" that deals with masculinity and suspended adolescence, and it's the most obvious, everyone-reading-this-has-seen-it example.
once upon a time in america is kind of a david lean epic... is that still on there?
It's no surprise that your thoughts on WALL-E focus mostly on the first 15 minutes or so of the film.no they don't. the romance comes later, as does the whole issue of obesity, and the "introduction" sequence too. the only thing that explicitly refers to the beginning is his home
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yup, in the west is still on there. i'm guessing there are a couple epics...mistercreepyJuly 30 2008, 19:24:31 UTC
The overarching argument of your discussion is wall-e's unique aesthetic. I'm not going to do a word count here, but the rest of your points aren't developed in multiple paragraphs or over the course of the whole piece
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i wrote my response right after "bing"'sdanschankJuly 30 2008, 19:54:48 UTC
that's why i mentioned it. you read quick!
i think i just repsonded a lot differently. for example, i LOVED the cleaning robot. i thought he was one of those examples where the part-refers-to-the-whole? like, his needless pursuit of any trace of dust makes a perfect metaphor for the film's themes of needless labor, hygiene, etc. his job and very identity is a kind of "kipple." i also loved that he ends up changing his ways. i liked that the film felt like it could include anyone: robots, high-tech robots, out-moded robots, cockroaches, people, fat people, office drones, fred willard.
hurrah evangelista are coming to bmorelostcosmonautJuly 30 2008, 17:45:46 UTC
... and I remember when you talked about them/her before, it mighta been one of th first times we talked, mebbe ? Th Internet temporally squashes everything
Ah always think yr lists are really good, but this one probably has th highest percentage of items I've already heard/seen/read, so instead of being made curious about something, th effect was more like: "I agree w/ Dan Schank on that, Amen!"
F'rinstance, Night of th Hunter's maybe my favourite movie o.a.t., and that boat ride scene is such a mystery, it's nice to hear someone else think out loud about it in a way that doesn't irritate th shit out of me. You have a gift for translation or something that is rare, I think!--mza.
sometimes i worry about repeating "good things"danschankJuly 30 2008, 19:06:09 UTC
but that evangelista show was too awesome to not mention.
as much as i like it when i "introduce" people to things on here, i try not to stress that too much when i write. i'd hate it if this digressed into some obscuro-posturing-- it's more to the point to document my own excitement about the world, i guess.
Angelina Jolie is unattractive anywaystrevitronJuly 30 2008, 20:22:38 UTC
Sophy and I saw WALL-E a few weeks ago. It was one of those movies where we saw the preview, instantly realized that we would love it and have to see it, saw it, and loved it as expected. Obviously, I loved the political/philosophical message of the film, but I focused much more on the love story--I mean, I don't need that film to really do anything other than reaffirm and delicately massage my own beliefs. In fact, a few times throughout the film, I turned to Sophy and exclaimed, "That's us. That's totally our relationship." And of course, she loved it too and knew that I was right about the movie. And ever since then, she has been just a little bit extra-sweet to me, so all I can say is that it is a wonderful reminder of love. Although I get what you say about gender, I totally recognized each character's gender. To me, the whole "weapon of mass destruction" thing had the opposite effect on me: it made Eve seem even more feminine. And Eve doesn't save the day, they save the day by working together, don't you think
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that picture is adorabledanschankJuly 30 2008, 21:14:37 UTC
And Eve doesn't save the day, they save the day by working together, don't you think?
sure. what i was getting at here, maybe, is that there's a long sequence where WALL-E is literally the damsel in distress, and eve comes to his rescue. but yeah, people come together in a big way in the movie, romatically and otherwise.
i actually debated including a paragraph clarifying that i don't thing "genderlessness" is an ideal, or anything a film should necessarily shoot for. i probably sound like i do a lot of the time. but this post was already on its way to long-town, so i axed it. i guess what i liked is that it avoids all the bullshit that usually keeps me from giving myself over to the romance in a film. like, i think breakfast at tiffany's is kinda romantic in the middle there, but then it ruins it at the end with all that "you belong to me" nonsense (not to mention mickey rooney). there's no clutter in WALL-E, so i can totally see why you would focus on its sweetness. the sweetness is really awesome
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Re: that picture is adorablececiliajJuly 31 2008, 00:56:51 UTC
I agree that genderlessness is not an ideal, though it can feel like it is when you see what you're talking about in In Treatment. But one wonders if womanly women's more thought out connection to their bodies/gustatory pleasure wouldn't be more value neutral or positive if the rest of the culture weren't so toxic with high fructose poison etc.
Re: that picture is adorabledanschankJuly 31 2008, 03:13:59 UTC
But one wonders if womanly women's more thought out connection to their bodies/gustatory pleasure wouldn't be more value neutral or positive if the rest of the culture weren't so toxic with high fructose poison etc.
i'm not entirely sure i'm following your meaning here? i'm not sure if you're using "high frustose" metaphorically (as an example of the rotten-ness of body standards in general, etc.) or literally (meaning that food itself should be better)? both interpretations kinda work, haha.
regarding genderlessness, it's something i feel kind of innately attracted to. but i also feel like there's a neutrality to it that's unrealistic, and at its worst can stifle meaningful ways of expressing things? also, i'm glad you made the comparison to in treatment. have you seen it? i gather that a lot of people haven't. i think i'm the only person i know IRL who watched it. anyway, that was the portion of the above that was most difficult to write (i worry i'm venturing into territory i might not want to be too declarative about as a dude
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that's a nice thing to sayerin_lindsayJuly 30 2008, 23:32:35 UTC
thanks sir. have i already rambled on to you about how i love Octavio Paz? The Double Flame: Love and Eroticism is wonderful. i think you might like it.
also, i'm moving this friday & then WE NEED TO TALK! sorry i haven't called, i've been working too much (as usual) and uber busy. sat. or sun. will you be around?
aren't you in portland?danschankJuly 31 2008, 00:15:00 UTC
i think we might have talked about paz... i read his book about duchamp's large glass when i was about 18 (!!!)... part of me would like to track it down again. i feel like i've told you this before though? i have a copy of his book about mexico too, the labrynth of solitude. is that how you spell labrynth? i feel like i'm spelling it the heavy metal way, but maybe it's just a more metal word than most?
saturday i'm working late, but if you feel like giving a late-ish buzz i should be around. sunday is open...
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also, are you familiar with rebecca solnit? i suspect you'd like her a lot if you aren't.
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Man I don't know if there are sufficient epic David Lean style films on my canon. Does Speed count?
It's no surprise that your thoughts on WALL-E focus mostly on the first 15 minutes or so of the film. They're the best part of the film, and maybe the best thing Pixar has done. I went into the film a little grumpy and was immediately awed, not just visually, but as you say with WALL-E's unusual aesthetic (I'm not sure if the cockroach applies in his anthropomorphicness, but Hello Dolly! sure as hell does--no one likes that movie). The problem is, it's also (along with the dancing in space routine) the only salient part of the film.
The plot of WALL-E is so tangential to the development of the film, yet the filmmakers continually bring it to the forefront. And while the aesthetic and characters of the film imply some of the best work Pixar has ever done, the plot ends up ( ... )
Reply
once upon a time in america is kind of a david lean epic... is that still on there?
It's no surprise that your thoughts on WALL-E focus mostly on the first 15 minutes or so of the film.no they don't. the romance comes later, as does the whole issue of obesity, and the "introduction" sequence too. the only thing that explicitly refers to the beginning is his home ( ... )
Reply
Reply
i think i just repsonded a lot differently. for example, i LOVED the cleaning robot. i thought he was one of those examples where the part-refers-to-the-whole? like, his needless pursuit of any trace of dust makes a perfect metaphor for the film's themes of needless labor, hygiene, etc. his job and very identity is a kind of "kipple." i also loved that he ends up changing his ways. i liked that the film felt like it could include anyone: robots, high-tech robots, out-moded robots, cockroaches, people, fat people, office drones, fred willard.
Reply
Ah always think yr lists are really good, but this one probably has th highest percentage of items I've already heard/seen/read, so instead of being made curious about something, th effect was more like: "I agree w/ Dan Schank on that, Amen!"
F'rinstance, Night of th Hunter's maybe my favourite movie o.a.t., and that boat ride scene is such a mystery, it's nice to hear someone else think out loud about it in a way that doesn't irritate th shit out of me. You have a gift for translation or something that is rare, I think!--mza.
Reply
as much as i like it when i "introduce" people to things on here, i try not to stress that too much when i write. i'd hate it if this digressed into some obscuro-posturing-- it's more to the point to document my own excitement about the world, i guess.
Reply
Reply
sure. what i was getting at here, maybe, is that there's a long sequence where WALL-E is literally the damsel in distress, and eve comes to his rescue. but yeah, people come together in a big way in the movie, romatically and otherwise.
i actually debated including a paragraph clarifying that i don't thing "genderlessness" is an ideal, or anything a film should necessarily shoot for. i probably sound like i do a lot of the time. but this post was already on its way to long-town, so i axed it. i guess what i liked is that it avoids all the bullshit that usually keeps me from giving myself over to the romance in a film. like, i think breakfast at tiffany's is kinda romantic in the middle there, but then it ruins it at the end with all that "you belong to me" nonsense (not to mention mickey rooney). there's no clutter in WALL-E, so i can totally see why you would focus on its sweetness. the sweetness is really awesome ( ... )
Reply
Reply
i'm not entirely sure i'm following your meaning here? i'm not sure if you're using "high frustose" metaphorically (as an example of the rotten-ness of body standards in general, etc.) or literally (meaning that food itself should be better)? both interpretations kinda work, haha.
regarding genderlessness, it's something i feel kind of innately attracted to. but i also feel like there's a neutrality to it that's unrealistic, and at its worst can stifle meaningful ways of expressing things? also, i'm glad you made the comparison to in treatment. have you seen it? i gather that a lot of people haven't. i think i'm the only person i know IRL who watched it. anyway, that was the portion of the above that was most difficult to write (i worry i'm venturing into territory i might not want to be too declarative about as a dude ( ... )
Reply
have i already rambled on to you about how i love Octavio Paz? The Double Flame: Love and Eroticism is wonderful. i think you might like it.
also, i'm moving this friday & then WE NEED TO TALK!
sorry i haven't called, i've been working too much (as usual) and uber busy. sat. or sun. will you be around?
Reply
saturday i'm working late, but if you feel like giving a late-ish buzz i should be around. sunday is open...
Reply
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