mitzvot in Conservative Judaism

[cellio]

I was recently given a photocopy of the article "Conservative Judaism in an Age of Democracy" by Rabbi Harold Kushner. (I think it came from Conservative Judaism magazine. I can't find an online copy.) This theologically-attuned Reform Jew found it a fascinating read.

Comments

[anonymous]

I know I'm not the decider of who is or is not in what movement, but as a rabbi-to-be of Modern Orthodoxy, I would not consider someone who regularly violates the Shabbat to be within the Modern Orthodox fold. On the other hand, some might not consider me to be in the MO fold due to some of my behaviors.

[530nm330hz]

I read your precis of R' Kushner a little differently; I think he starts off by making the observation that on the ground, away from the JTS ivory tower, Conservative Jews have already made the transition to a non-binding halacha. Having grown up in a Conservative shul, I came to the same fork in the road that you did, and decided that between the two consistent positions of obligation and cultural inheritance, I was more comfortable accepting obligation. It was a few years later that I formally shifted membership to an Orthodox shul

[sanpaku]

I came to the same fork in the road that you did, and decided that between the two consistent positions of obligation and cultural inheritance, I was more comfortable accepting obligation. It was a few years later that I formally shifted membership to an Orthodox shul.

Here's a comment I would ask you (respecting the decision you made) and to cellio as well -- the assumption that the fork in the road leads to a broader recasting of the basics of belief. It is one thing to believe that I should perform the mitzvot out of a sense that God has obligated me to do so. But orthodoxy goes far beyond that: it demands that you accept not ony that the mitzvot were given by God, but that the Torah is an entirely divine creation, and even more so, that Tanakh is meant to be understood in a literalistic way. I.e., the psalms really were written by David and Kohelet by Solomon; the patriarchs observed Shabbat even before it was commanded, etc.

I'm going to put this in a comment to the main post and try to deal with it at greater length there.

Re: part 2

[cellio]

I might be weird (ok, I am weird :-) ), but I do actually feel I am commanded in certain things. I don't just keep Shabbat or kashrut or mitzvot about business dealings because they give me warm fuzzy feelings or I hope to parlay for divine attention by doing so. (And it's certainly not about cultural identification.) And heaven knows (if you'll pardon the expression) how inconvenient these things can be. Rather, through study and personal exploration, combined with effects that I can only describe as divine nudges (YMMV), I have come to understand these things as commandments. What I have not come to understand as binding is the system following from Avot 1:1

Re: part 2

[530nm330hz]

As I try to clarify in the comment I just posted later down on this page, I think the fork-in-the-road moment is one of whether one accepts the system in toto as obligatory. I think your model of engaged Judaism is a vital one, and that your understanding of the nature of obligation is deep.

I also have great respect for your understanding of what you don't consider obligatory: "What I have not come to understand as binding is the system following from Avot 1:1." That's the distinction, exactly put.

fidei defensor, continued

[sanpaku]

This comment is inspired by some of the comments and how they dovetail with the main post, so bear with me

Re: fidei defensor, continued

[530nm330hz]

There's Orthodox and then there's orthodox. As I wrote above:

On the other hand, I'm eagerly awaiting the fracture of Orthodoxy into YU Orthodoxy and Agudas Israel Orthodoxy --- As a "left-winger" I am very unhappy that the "black hats" get to define what most people thing of as Orthodox Judaism.

I believe that the halachic system is God-given and binding. I also believe that the Torah text was written and edited by divinely-inspired humans, that the universe is billions of years old, etc. The various beliefs that you ascribe to orthodoxy are held by some, but are not necessarily part of the halachic package.

You write:

I would reiterate that I really think this is a false dichotomy that everyone is setting up.I respectfully disagree. The question is: "Do I consider myself obligated by the demands of the halachic system, even when they are inconvenient and even when I dislike those demands?" (Please note: this question does not address the degree to which and means by which the halachic system itself may evolve over time

Re: fidei defensor, continued

[sanpaku]

Well, that last point there is the divergence between principles and practice. Just speaking for myself, I can't be bothered by that. Every belief system has armloads of hypocrites and tolerates hypocrisy. I agree with you that the divergence is lamentably bad for Conservative Jews, but that doesn't force a choice onto me personally.

I say this because I would certainly put myself in the category who sees myself (as you put it) "obligated by the demands of the haalachic system, even when they are inconvenient". And I agree that when most Conservatives pick and choose halachot with which they agree, they are being inconsistent -- but, nu, it's human nature that people are inconsistent, I think.

So if what you're saying is that Conservative rabbis or people like me who agree with your statements are essentially orthodox, great! :-) But of course that's not true on either the orthodox side or the Conservative side.

When I've brought this issue up with orthodox folks, they tend to give the answer that you do -- it's not really

Re: fidei defensor, continued

[sanpaku]

You claim that the fact that the institutions of Conservative Jewry won't permit eating pork & shellfish, but that Consevative Jews do so is a difference of principles and practice? If so, that should mean that were the pork-eaters asked, they would acknowledge that they shouldn't be eating pork, and perhaps feel some guilt. Is that what you believe would happen were the question asked?

[chaiya]

This article is still not available online, btw. (I bookmarked your post to look for it later.) I have succumbed and will be subscribing to the magazine instead, with a request to get the past two issues so I can read it. :P

[cellio]

Boy was I surprised to get comment email for this post. :-)

I'm sure I have the paper copy...somewhere. (Neatness, when it comes to paperwork, is not one of my virtues.) If you want me to send you a copy, please ping me after the flurry of holidays.

[chaiya]

If you could, please do! (I respond now out of fear that if I delay I will lose track of the plan.)