I need to find the unpopular opinions meme, clearly

[bottle_of_smoke]

I was so happy seeing this secret yesterday, and all the assent in the responses. YES. THANK YOU. I haven't seen all of the man's films, but those that I have seen (and it's a fair few because I always manage to convince myself that maybe it will be good this time, fucking hell) have never been anything better than mediocre. Perhaps likable at best

Comments

[apiphile]

Seeing as I'm on the subject of Unpopular Fandom Opinion: you can apply this rant to Joss Whedon also.

ILU. GAY-MARRY ME.

Oh, and those "pithy quips and withering one-liners"? not as funny and clever as you think they are.

I love the way you imitated his apparently ubiquitous speech patterns there. Priceless. :D

[bottle_of_smoke]

WE'RE ALREADY GAY-MARRIED. DID I NOT TELL YOU? It was roundabout the time you pwned that American telling you to lay off the poor Londoners in their time of grief (7/11) on Metaquotes. I THINK I LICKED THE SCREEN.

...A lot of alcohol has happened since then. THAT WAS YOU RIGHT? Otherwise I need a divorce D:

[apiphile]

Me and papervolcano, yes. We were the tagteam of London awesome. Woe? Fuck woe. I WANTED TEA.

Also I love that icon like I love fics about choking.

[bottle_of_smoke]

ICON IS AMAZING, YES. (summer_sun18 made it)

I KNEW IT WAS YOU! I read the whole thread with silly clappy hands, laughing like an idiot. Hey, guess what? No one gets to tell anybody how they should (or should not) mourn, especially a person on the other side of the fucking ocean to people who felt the fucking bombs go off! AND NOW I'M LAUGHING ABOUT THAT LONDON_WEEPS COMM AGAIN. Okay, okay, so the intent was sweet, perhaps, but I don't think anyone told London it was weeping. I mean, I was there a few days later and no one I saw seemed to be crying into their tea. (Though the Circle Line was down. I think that was down to the Circle Line being the Circle Line though, and not due to any bomb/weepy nonsense.)

[denorios]

I agree. Totally. Completely.

I get that he has his own style and that's what comes across in his movies, but there's never anything different. There's no evolution, no growth as a filmmaker. It's always the same quirky, offbeat weirdness - and you're right, it is derivative. Sleepy Hollow, Batman, Alice, Charlie - it's all the same, take the original and put a Tim Burton 'spin' on it. Honestly, to use a weird metaphor, it's getting as formulaic as LJ icons - you know the ones you see endlessly, where the artist has used the same softlight, exclusion, screen layers ad infinitum and the whole thing takes five minutes?

[bottle_of_smoke]

That's it exactly. I don't mind directors having a hallmark - most of them do (Danny Boyle, who I tend to like, has a tendency to use music and "lurking cameras" and colour in a way I see as 'his') - but it's the same style every time. As you say it never evolves, and it doesn't matter to him if it doesn't fit the story. He bends the story to suit his style, not the style to suit the story and that? is bad film-making.

[drazzi]

I quite enjoy his films. Not because he does them, or Mr Depp is ass deep in them, just because... I tend to enjoy them.

THat secret basically made me go "Who's that? ... Big Fish... Oh Burton. Wait, no one's heard of Big Fish? Wtf. That film's great."

I don't know who Joss Whedon is though. Because I haven't seen Firefly or Serenity... or whatever he's done because... I don't want to...

[bottle_of_smoke]

He did Buffy as well. And numerous other things. All of which I can't stand because I can't bear the way he has his characters speak. (And I hate fandom's insistence that he is a demi-god. Stop telling me I'll LOVE his stuff, because seriously? Never cared. And I have tried.)

I've seen Big Fish and can't remember what my opinion of it was, so probably the same as most Tim Burton films i.e. "okay." Conversely, I remember exactly what I thought of Sweeney Todd because it was fucking awful and nobody could sing in it. And I accidently wrote Sweeney Toss there, which about sums it up.

[dragged_up]

He takes other people's creations and then sets at them with a hammer (or a fucking black-striped candy cane machine, who fucking knows) until what made that creation special in the first place is unrecognisable, and soulless.

YES, EXACTLY.

And oh god I am dreading Alice, especially after the PILE OF WANK that was Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. Even the promo pics make me cringe.

[bottle_of_smoke]

I find Alice in Wonderland dreadfully creepy (not least because of the video game) and it could be done so well by a director who understood the tone of that creepiness. Tim Burton is not that director. Tim Burton takes stories, projects what he wants on them and hangs the material. He defines, for me, "all style and no substance", which is a shame because he style is neither beautiful nor interesting. It's just the same movie over and over, except the characters' names change. And it's going to be dreadful. Uuugh.

On the other hand, Stephen Fry is the Cheshire Cat, so that is at least something for those people who end up seeing it. (I have no intention to, but I never have intentions with Burton films but they still keep happening!)

[dragged_up]

That's precisely it, yes. I just can't bear the thought of him taking this story (which I have loved since I was tiny, I avoid the film adaptations as a rule but I can't have been more than eight or nine when I fell for the books) and sapping all the cleverness out of it in preference for the same edgy bullshit as EVERY OTHER FILM HE'S EVER MADE. I wouldn't mind so much if he didn't do that and nothing but ALL THE TIME. He could at least do something original again instead of adaptation after adaptation. And cast someone other than Johnny and Helena. I like them fine in other people's films but Jesus, Burton, give it a rest.

[bottle_of_smoke]

He tries so hard to be "edgy" yet I've never seen anything remotely controversial or new in any of his films. How sad.

I do not get his obsession with re-casting Johnny and Helena - especially in roles they are clearly not suited for. (Hey, guess what? Johnny Depp ain't English and that faux-David Beckham voice isn't going to work each time around! LEAST OF ALL HEATHCLIFF. Seriously, thank god that adaption never happened.)

[silveronthetree]

Hmm. I'm not sure where I stand on Tim Burton. I have a ridiculous amount of love for his Batman movies. But I think that is mostly because they are Batman. I haven't seen many of his other things - just the first three you mentioned, since the rest just didn't appeal. IMHO the best thing about Sleepy Hollow was the opening credits (and by that I mean that actual animation of the text of the credits). I also don't get what is so great about Johnny Depp.

I disagree totally about Joss Whedon. HE IS GOD! *Spots a sheepdog and turns to follow the rest of the herd*

[bottle_of_smoke]

I don't get the Johnny Depp thing either! He's strikes me as rather boring and up himself. :/

I think my problem with Joss Whedon is my problem with a lot of US telly in general - except 10-fold. I cannot stand shows in which all the characters are witty/ass-kicking/beautiful/variation thereof. If he sorted his dialogue out and learned to differentiate between voices I'd be more than willing to give his stuff a second chance but until then no. It just throws me out too much. And I don't think he's very funny either.

[silveronthetree]

The only thing Johnny Depp has going for him is that he can wear eyeliner well, which is a rare rare skill and must be appreciated.

You have summed up exactly why I do enjoy US telly. The appeal to me is that it is completely unrealistic and hence perfect escapism. Plus I find Whedon funny. But then I compare it to Being Human for example and...yeah.

[bottle_of_smoke]

I'm really big on realism. I like people to look a bit rough, a bit ugly and to speak like real people, otherwise I can't relate to them. I went them flaws and all. I find perfect witty characters completely unidentifiable and utterly boring. Part of the reason I liked the Star Trek film so much was okay, so they're all pretty (Kirk in a 'rough diamond' sort of way; seriously, he spends most of the film with his head kicked in), but Kirk is such a douche. Not only that but we're meant to think he's a douche, too. The film doesn't hail his behaviour at the beginning as something admirable or cool, and in fact it comes across as rather desperate. I really, really liked that. Plus he has that Indiana Jones doofiness quality I like so much in my heroes. On top of that, Bones is a racist, Spock has a stick up his ass the size of the Major Oak and yes. Lovely!

I LOVE BEING HUMAN. The second series can't happen fast enough. NINA THE NURSE, WHAT HAVE YOU DONE?!