Comments | antishurtugal: That One Mary Sue Essay We Just Talked About

mage_apprentice in antishurtugal

That One Mary Sue Essay We Just Talked About

Dec 08, 2011 22:32

Hi, everyone! I know everyone already said what they wanted to say, but hell, this deserves a spork, and I want to celebrate the end of my latest college semester! Not to mention, this is a bit too long to just add as a single comment on the original post. Just some time ago, dualtriene posted about an essay by an adventuresofcomicbookgirl. To be ( Read more... )

mary-sue, lack of logic, feminism, fantasy, reading, characters, writing

Comments 29

anonymous December 9 2011, 15:15:02 UTC

This girl seems pretty scatterbrained. At times, I can see her point, just muddled. Other times... I think she doesn't really understand what the main problem of a Mary Sue is. She can have wonderful powers, get the guy, and everything in between. Plot relevance is the problem. If the story revolves ENTIRELY around one person, regardless of what they've done and ignoring supporting characters, that's the problem with Mary Sues. I really think that was the point she missed.

Unfortunately, she did get something right. On a lot of fandoms, if a new character is brought in for any reason and with any characterization, they are usually labeled as a MS. It really doesn't matter on if they're good or bad. It just matters that they're new. Sometimes it's the opposite, but it's pretty rare. Usually the useless ones get the latter treatment.

Anyway, good spork. :)

streamfish December 9 2011, 15:45:30 UTC

I get the feeling that, should I ever talk to you in person, trying to get you to understand what a Mary Sue is would be just as futile as trying to convince the Zelda fanbase that Sheik's physical gender doesn't mean anything to the overall story line of Ocarina of Time.

(cackle) Oh my goodness. As a member of the Zelda fanbase, this cracked me up big time.

Thank you for this rebuttal. There are many feminist issues to be talked about concerning Mary Sues, but this essay just doesn't address them in the right ways or for the right reasons.

mage_apprentice December 9 2011, 17:09:12 UTC

I'm part of the Zelda fanbase too, yet that debate drives me up a wall. I even wrote an essay tearing apart the stupidest arguments they use to support their points. The argument that Sheik is female because the Super Smash Brothers series says so must be the stupidest one I've seen yet. Then the fact that a lot of fem!Sheik fans turn to the same article for backing over and over when that one has tons of flaws too. *sigh*

On the plus side, Skyward Sword looks awesome! *haven't had the chance to play it yet*

streamfish December 9 2011, 18:07:42 UTC

Wait, seriously? SSB is not... not canon in any sense of the word. :| Noooo. It's difficult enough to make an argument for one or the other - it would be easier to think that Zelda simply changed her cosmetic appearance to look like a Sheikah male, but it's even more difficult to make it an issue. Wlasdlfk.

Skyward Sword is pretty awesome! I played up to halfway through the first dungeon with a friend (curse you, university!), and the design is friggin' beautiful. The motion control is a bit iffy, and it's difficult to get used to problem-solving with it, but I enjoyed everything I got to play. Also the soundtrack. (drool)

mage_apprentice December 9 2011, 18:16:37 UTC

That's what's so confusing, too. And what's ironic is that the fem!Sheik article they keep referencing denounces the Ocarina of Time manga as canon yet uses the SSB series as proof. Then again, many male!Sheik fans use the manga as evidence for their argument while SSB supports fem!Sheik. Ahhh, hypocrisy at it's finest.

Personally, I figure it doesn't matter since Zelda can change it to whatever she wants. She could even be a hermaphrodite if she wants, Triforfe piece and all.

Lucky.

Thread 15

(The comment has been removed)

mage_apprentice December 9 2011, 17:12:50 UTC

I can always find time to write, but a big part of me being able to write right then and there was that the semester is over. I finished my last final exam yesterday morning so . . .

I love my userpic, too. <3

anonymous December 9 2011, 16:35:32 UTC

IMO, a Mary Sue isn't about what they can do, but about how they do it and how they are able to do it. So with the Batman example; handled poorly, he is a Sue, but since he worked hard for those amazing skills, has a poor personal life as a result (which, I believe, is often utilized in stories about him and is a flaw), I wouldn't call him one--if he was a teenager who knew all these things from a couple years of training and did everything perfectly and had a nice personal life and everyone loves him and he does no wrong ever, THEN he's a Sue.

darth_gojira December 9 2011, 18:13:16 UTC

Every paragraph I read of the original article, I keep wondering what her Suefic looked like.

mage_apprentice December 9 2011, 18:24:55 UTC

Her Sue could probably do everything a male canon character can't and has a lot of stacked abilities, and is also probably a rebel princess Sue.

Her thing against the term doesn't mean we can't criicise her. As long as the reviewer avoids the words "Mary Sue," the reviewer can still rip her a new one without her getting smug and saying "Yup!" Then again, most suethors don't accept critisism.