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Hands down, people without kids have better lives—except for this one major thing drdoug September 12 2014, 11:33:55 UTC
Interesting. I've seen other bits of research on the topic that report parents as *less* likely to say they're happy when you ask 'How happy are you today?' or 'How happy are you right now?'. But I think I've also seen the effect reverse if the question is broader in time scope so it's more like 'Thinking about your life overall, how happy are you ( ... )

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Re: Hands down, people without kids have better lives—except for this one major thing quirkytizzy September 12 2014, 12:21:53 UTC
I agree with this. I think whether or not you are happy (or happIER) with kids boils a lot down to whether or not having kids is achieving some personal goal you've set...or if having kids is something you consider a mistake. Personally, I mean. I think if you think being a parent will be fulfilling, you'll find yourself fulfilled. If you think it WON'T be fulfilling, you won't feel fulfilled.

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a_pawson September 12 2014, 12:31:57 UTC
The situation is complicated by social expectations. Society expects parents to adore their kids, and tell everyone who will listen that they bring more happiness than anything else ever could, even when that is not true.

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cairmen September 12 2014, 13:20:23 UTC
Something that would be very interesting to hear is whether the question about happiness was asked after all the other questions in the survey(s), and whether there was any preamble.

For example, "We're doing a survey of parents against non-parents, and we just wanted to ask you one question - " rather clearly leads in - as does asking the happiness question after all the other questions about kids.

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a_pawson September 12 2014, 11:40:51 UTC
On a purely technical level, Robinson is right. The second of his two questions was “Why should a Scottish voter believe you a politician, against men who are responsible for billions of pounds of profit?”, which Salmond didn't give an actual answer to. Yes the clip shown on the BBC was edited in such a way as to exclude the first of the two questions, which he answered comprehensively, but at no point did he actually give a response to the second question.

I'm not quite sure what Salmond expected. If you ambush a reporter, and accuse them of dodgy methodology, in the middle of a live press conference, I doubt you should expect that reporter to file a terribly favourable report.

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drdoug September 12 2014, 16:10:26 UTC
Indeed, I thought the same, both on the technical answer and it being unsurprising that Robinson fought back after getting a drubbing from Salmond on the platform.

Although I do think the cut, while technically true if you interpret it charitably, is materially misleading - the cut makes you think Robinson asked that simple, short question, and Salmond didn't answer it. The full clip makes it clear Robinson asked two longer, multi-part questions, and it certainly seemed to me that Salmond addressed what conversation analysts would call the project of the second question. Just not the literal question at the end of it. (I couldn't hear what Robinson was shouting without a mic later on. He should know better.) That said, I can't see Scottish voters being particularly impressed with the Robinson clip.

Very useful exercise to compare the two. Makes me realise how much dodginess and spin goes in to such things when I don't get to see the full clip.

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ggreig September 12 2014, 20:21:03 UTC
I agree it could have been more clearly signposted but he does address the second question, starting at 1:50. He doesn't say why we should trust him more than the businessmen, which was the literal question (would anyone believe it if he did?), but he sets out a couple of reasons why the businessmen's announcements might be seen in the same light as claims from a politician:
  • He suggests they were coordinated by David Cameron's business advisor.
  • He points out that the "new" announcements from two of Nick Robinson's three examples (BP, Standard Life) were repeating things they'd already said months ago.
He then goes on to make a detailed comparison with RBS (not one of Nick's examples) where the reporting was substantially more alarmist than the Chief Executive of RBS's portrayal to his staff, leading in to his criticism of the Treasury's (and the BBC's) role in the reporting ( ... )

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postal vote regret woodpijn September 12 2014, 13:24:58 UTC
If they can fly reporters out to the Shetlands in between postal vote time and actual vote time to interview people about their voting regrets, surely they could have flown a mobile ballot box out there on polling day?

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a_pawson September 12 2014, 13:59:38 UTC
Logistically it's not possible from Fetlar. The island has a population of about 60, no airstrip, and there is no ferry service after the polls close. Arguably it is possible by either a) using a helicopter or b) waiting until the next day to count the votes, but I assume the electoral commission decided the desire for a swift count outweighed the right of the islanders to vote at a ballot box.

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randomdreams September 12 2014, 14:47:36 UTC
The intelligence one appears to be misrepresented because of a bad summary. Researchers have found genes that correlate with intelligence. This study looked for genes that correlate with educational achievement, and found nothing. This particular bad summary is showing up everywhere.

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Hands down, people without kids have better lives—except for this one major thing brixtonbrood September 12 2014, 15:38:21 UTC
For me the definitive statement on parenthood was made by Ursula Le Guin, in a quite different context.

“I am not trying to say that I was happy, during those weeks of hauling a sledge across an ice-sheet in the dead of winter. I was hungry, overstrained, and often anxious, and it all got worse the longer it went on. I certainly wasn’t happy. Happiness has to do with reason, and only reason earns it. What I was given was the thing you can’t earn, and can’t keep, and often don’t even recognize at the time; I mean joy”

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