[Multilingual Monday] Wa, ga, word order, bad advice

[aadroma]

It's embarrassing, certainly, but I admit: even after years of use in the Japanese language, I still fuck up fundamentally grammatical points. Like wa and ga. These two particles, for those who don't speak Japanese, are a "topic marker" and a "subject marker" respectively, and are not interchangeable, even if their general use (connecting a

Comments

[muckefuck]

These two particles, for those who don't speak Japanese, are a "topic marker" and a "subject marker" respectively, and are not interchangeable, even if their general use (connecting a predicate to the rest of the sentence)

Actually, "the rest of the sentence" is the predicate, at least in the case of ga. Wa is quite different; in addition to marking the subject, it can be used to draw out virtually any element of the predicate (save a conjugated verb or certain adverbs) and mark it as the topic or "theme". So Kouhii wa Muhamado ga nomimashita, with wa replacing wo, would be another possible variant of the sentence you gave.

Wa can even be used multiple times in a row. In his Reference grammar of Japanese, Martin gives the example Shikasi kanojo wa wareware ni wa, chichi wa shinda to itta. The third wa is in a subclause, but this still means that in the main clause we still see wa marking both the subject and the indirect object. The overall effect is to background every element except the verb, which has the effect of emphasising it

[aadroma]

Don't forget about kouhii wa Muhamado wa nomimashita ga; indeed, it can be used multiple times, but it needs to be used CORRECTLY each time and its implications need to be noted with each instance.

The sample you gave is SORT of cheating since "wareware ni wa" can only TAKE wa instead of ga. :: laugh ::

My issue is not when it's necessarily CORRECT, but when it's more NATURAL, and THAT's the issue. Indeed I've had instances where what I've said is technically not WRONG, but it is unnatural because of my choice of particles (and it's not uncommonly the wa/ga thing).

[philbutrin]

my college japanese teacher said knowing when to use は and when to use が is really sort of an art, rather than something that can be explained by rules. her advice was to just listen to/read a lot of japanese and develop a sense of when one is used over the other, rather than thinking in grammatical terms.

i think i have an average sense of when to use one or the other. when i'm reading, i do find that sometimes i'll run across one that surprises me, and that's always interesting for learning.