Don't expect an actual post all about why I didn't hate the finale anytime soon. Or maybe ever. Aww, that's too bad. I gobbled up every word or your Settlement but I can continue to discuss the finale forever. Because I'm totally and utterly confused. Still. Other peoples' thoughts have really helped me.
Your posts make me so thinky and long-winded! Here goes:
For me canon is what was on the show the first time an episode airs. Period. No webisodes, no extended DVD versions of the episode or deleted scenes. No commentary from the producers.Why? Are you not confused? I feel so . . . thick sometimes. I need those extras sometimes to explain stuff. I love hearing your take on what Earth II might have been like. Why wouldn't I want to hear the show creator's intentions too? There are things I couldn't have known, couldn't have confirmed without extras. Like what Baltar whispered into Felix's ear (though that was totally retconned). Or what Felix's sexuality was (thought that's still debated between bi and gay). I like to know what an
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I need those extras sometimes to explain stuff. I love hearing your take on what Earth II might have been like. Why wouldn't I want to hear the show creator's intentions too?
It's not that I'm not interested (okay, if it's RDM, I'm probably not interested, but that's just the irritation factor). It's information that I don't feel like I have to acknowledge if it doesn't work with what I want to do. If it does mesh, great! If not, I don't have any compulsion to include it for the sake of being canon-compliant because it's not what I view as canon. (Though njborba does make a good point saying that fanfic just isn't canon anyway.)
I like to know what an author intended. It surprises me because I thought you did too. You love author DVD commentaries more than anyone I know.
Again, I think it's the source. RDM irritates me. Other fanfic writers are generally awesome! And since I'm interested in writing, but not so interested in actually creating a TV show...
I liked hearing most of Joss Whedon's commentaries on the Buffy DVD's. Since
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What an interesting take on canon! You are talking the use of canon or non-canon in writing fic. What you can use to support your fic idea or not. I'm talking about what I believe actually happened. I'm not talking about writing at all, at least not at first. Before I write something, or even if I never write anything, I have to have an understanding of what actually happened in the canon story. When I pick and choose (and I don't since I accept it all) deleted scenes, I am trying to piece together 'the story'. It's an interesting idea, though. Reading the comments below I'm wondering if there is 'the' story. Maybe there's just 'my' story, the story I saw and the interpretations I made. Maybe we all have our own story of what happened.
After I figure out 'what happened' or what I think I've seen, then I can write if I want. As for what I use for fic, I can use anything. I'm AU girl. I sometimes disregard established canon altogether. I started reading and writing fic to see what didn't happen on screen. Anything else bores me. I like
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I'm talking about what I believe actually happened. I'm not talking about writing at all, at least not at first.
Huh. I just don't generally second-guess myself about the meaning of the show that's broadcast, once I've spent a few days 'digesting' it. I do like to read thougtful commentaries from other viewers but once I've formulated my general understanding and reaction, I don't often change it. I might wish for it to be different, but it is what it is.
As for what I use for fic, I can use anything. I'm AU girl. I sometimes disregard established canon altogether. I started reading and writing fic to see what didn't happen on screen. Anything else bores me. I like trying to make what I write fit into the show itself--most of the time, anyway. They just didn't have time to make that episode about Jean and Leoben on Caprica and about Trina finding the C-Bucs and getting captured! (I know, making up background for minor characters or inventing original characters doesn't seem much like 'canon' but I like telling myself that what
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I just don't generally second-guess myself about the meaning of the show that's broadcast, once I've spent a few days 'digesting' it. I don't usually, either. What I see is what I see. But when the storyteller doesn't do a great job and I'm confused, well that's what I see. Confusion. That's what eps like Daybreak 2 and even No Exit were for me. My meaning was, "Whaaa?" :-) That's why I went looking for answers outside of the screen. But you're right, my view hasn't changed much. I'm still at "Whaaa?"
They just didn't have time to make that episode about Jean and Leoben on Caprica and about Trina finding the C-Bucs and getting captured! Exactly! And they didn't have time to include the deleted scenes, either! Yay, more show! Fanfic, deleted scenes, I'll take what I can get!
I have to stop myself, because it's frequently very tempting to make commentaries on my own stories... You'll kill the mystery!! But of course, I'll still read it.
I listened to ALL of the commentaries on the Lord of the Rings discs... there were a LOT of
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You'll kill the mystery!! But of course, I'll still read it. Hee! That's my compulsion with real DVD commentaries! I have to listen to them, even though I sort of don't want to know!
Me too! It was all so beautifully done that you had to watch it all. Even though the extended versions were like four hours long. And that was just the movie alone! I spent a few days on each of those DVDs. Just to watch them build The Shire or Eowyn's castle was lovely. :-)
I'm glad it wasn't just me. You could spend a week watching those things...
Here's a question, if you read DVD commentary from a fic writer do you add that to the story you originally read, or does that story remain 'pure' for you? If the story remains pure, then why read the extras at all?Um... so far it hasn't been an issue. The fic commentaries I've read have added to my enjoyment and given me further insight, but I can't recall any revelations that were not hinted at in the story itself. Of course, text is a very different experience than a TV show. And I'm not writing fanfic based on their fanfic, so I don't have to worry about what's canon or not. Plus I can focus on what it teaches me about writing as well as what it adds to the story
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Of course, text is a very different experience than a TV show. And I'm not writing fanfic based on their fanfic, so I don't have to worry about what's canon or not. Interesting. You seem mostly worried about canon for fic writing. I worry about canon simply as, did I get what the writer meant? At all? Just sheer comprehension. Sometimes a commentary for an episode or a movie illuminates the work in a totally different way for me. And sometimes commentaries (even on movie DVDs) are simply annoying.
But they did at least make it to a planet--something I really wanted--and some part of them lived on.Heh. That's true. And you know I always disliked the planets. :-) I don't mind them in fic. I prefer them there. But the show was called Battlestar Galactica and that's where I wanted them to be and stay or die. We live on a planet. That's not so new to me. But living on a space battleship! That never, ever got old for me. I did love Kobol. :-) But that was more because of mythology and because it was
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To be honest, and I know I've said this before, but if you have to have an author explain what they intended, they failed at the art of story-telling in the first place.
That is true. They have failed. But I dunno. But I like the idea sparked in me about everyone having their own truth. Even when a creator, artist, writer, or show creator does their job well, I think the viewer takes what they will from what they see and makes it their own.
Maybe there isn't one 'canon' that everyone will agree upon. I'm liking that thought. RDM has his story and I have mine. I still like to know what he intended. Especially when he loses me. He had interesting ideas, the execution was just so poor sometimes.
I'm not trying to excuse bad writing of which there was plenty in BSG this year. But even when a story is told well, maybe canon isn't static. That's the fun part. We can each see things our own way.
Aww, that's too bad. I gobbled up every word or your Settlement but I can continue to discuss the finale forever. Because I'm totally and utterly confused. Still. Other peoples' thoughts have really helped me.
Your posts make me so thinky and long-winded! Here goes:
For me canon is what was on the show the first time an episode airs. Period. No webisodes, no extended DVD versions of the episode or deleted scenes. No commentary from the producers.Why? Are you not confused? I feel so . . . thick sometimes. I need those extras sometimes to explain stuff. I love hearing your take on what Earth II might have been like. Why wouldn't I want to hear the show creator's intentions too? There are things I couldn't have known, couldn't have confirmed without extras. Like what Baltar whispered into Felix's ear (though that was totally retconned). Or what Felix's sexuality was (thought that's still debated between bi and gay). I like to know what an ( ... )
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It's not that I'm not interested (okay, if it's RDM, I'm probably not interested, but that's just the irritation factor). It's information that I don't feel like I have to acknowledge if it doesn't work with what I want to do. If it does mesh, great! If not, I don't have any compulsion to include it for the sake of being canon-compliant because it's not what I view as canon. (Though njborba does make a good point saying that fanfic just isn't canon anyway.)
I like to know what an author intended. It surprises me because I thought you did too. You love author DVD commentaries more than anyone I know.
Again, I think it's the source. RDM irritates me. Other fanfic writers are generally awesome! And since I'm interested in writing, but not so interested in actually creating a TV show...
I liked hearing most of Joss Whedon's commentaries on the Buffy DVD's. Since ( ... )
Reply
After I figure out 'what happened' or what I think I've seen, then I can write if I want. As for what I use for fic, I can use anything. I'm AU girl. I sometimes disregard established canon altogether. I started reading and writing fic to see what didn't happen on screen. Anything else bores me. I like ( ... )
Reply
Huh. I just don't generally second-guess myself about the meaning of the show that's broadcast, once I've spent a few days 'digesting' it. I do like to read thougtful commentaries from other viewers but once I've formulated my general understanding and reaction, I don't often change it. I might wish for it to be different, but it is what it is.
As for what I use for fic, I can use anything. I'm AU girl. I sometimes disregard established canon altogether. I started reading and writing fic to see what didn't happen on screen. Anything else bores me. I like trying to make what I write fit into the show itself--most of the time, anyway. They just didn't have time to make that episode about Jean and Leoben on Caprica and about Trina finding the C-Bucs and getting captured! (I know, making up background for minor characters or inventing original characters doesn't seem much like 'canon' but I like telling myself that what ( ... )
Reply
I don't usually, either. What I see is what I see. But when the storyteller doesn't do a great job and I'm confused, well that's what I see. Confusion. That's what eps like Daybreak 2 and even No Exit were for me. My meaning was, "Whaaa?" :-) That's why I went looking for answers outside of the screen. But you're right, my view hasn't changed much. I'm still at "Whaaa?"
They just didn't have time to make that episode about Jean and Leoben on Caprica and about Trina finding the C-Bucs and getting captured!
Exactly! And they didn't have time to include the deleted scenes, either! Yay, more show! Fanfic, deleted scenes, I'll take what I can get!
I have to stop myself, because it's frequently very tempting to make commentaries on my own stories...
You'll kill the mystery!! But of course, I'll still read it.
I listened to ALL of the commentaries on the Lord of the Rings discs... there were a LOT of ( ... )
Reply
Hee! That's my compulsion with real DVD commentaries! I have to listen to them, even though I sort of don't want to know!
Me too! It was all so beautifully done that you had to watch it all. Even though the extended versions were like four hours long. And that was just the movie alone! I spent a few days on each of those DVDs. Just to watch them build The Shire or Eowyn's castle was lovely. :-)
I'm glad it wasn't just me. You could spend a week watching those things...
Reply
Here's a question, if you read DVD commentary from a fic writer do you add that to the story you originally read, or does that story remain 'pure' for you? If the story remains pure, then why read the extras at all?Um... so far it hasn't been an issue. The fic commentaries I've read have added to my enjoyment and given me further insight, but I can't recall any revelations that were not hinted at in the story itself. Of course, text is a very different experience than a TV show. And I'm not writing fanfic based on their fanfic, so I don't have to worry about what's canon or not. Plus I can focus on what it teaches me about writing as well as what it adds to the story ( ... )
Reply
Of course, text is a very different experience than a TV show. And I'm not writing fanfic based on their fanfic, so I don't have to worry about what's canon or not.
Interesting. You seem mostly worried about canon for fic writing. I worry about canon simply as, did I get what the writer meant? At all? Just sheer comprehension. Sometimes a commentary for an episode or a movie illuminates the work in a totally different way for me. And sometimes commentaries (even on movie DVDs) are simply annoying.
But they did at least make it to a planet--something I really wanted--and some part of them lived on.Heh. That's true. And you know I always disliked the planets. :-) I don't mind them in fic. I prefer them there. But the show was called Battlestar Galactica and that's where I wanted them to be and stay or die. We live on a planet. That's not so new to me. But living on a space battleship! That never, ever got old for me. I did love Kobol. :-) But that was more because of mythology and because it was ( ... )
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Maybe there isn't one 'canon' that everyone will agree upon. I'm liking that thought. RDM has his story and I have mine. I still like to know what he intended. Especially when he loses me. He had interesting ideas, the execution was just so poor sometimes.
I'm not trying to excuse bad writing of which there was plenty in BSG this year. But even when a story is told well, maybe canon isn't static. That's the fun part. We can each see things our own way.
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