Unpopular Fannish Opinions
neverneverfic asked about Wincest and Patrick Stump.
Wincest:
I have had an on-again, off-again relationship with Wincest since SPN started. I went through a phase where I read A LOT of it, mostly because my need for UST-filled, first-time fic pretty much trumps everything including any incest!squick I have. I never read established relationship Wincest, but to be fair I rarely read established relationship anything.
But even when I was reading a lot of Wincest, I never shipped it. There are Wincest stories I like, and it can be done in ways that I find compelling, but I also see it as innately tragic and I can't separate fic enough from the text to ever read it any other way. Even when I was reading it to hit my UST kink it could never really hit it, because underneath, no matter what story I was reading, I found it depressing. Even in the stories I like, even when it's compelling, it's depressing for me, and really too sad to ever be hot. The you-and-me against the world stuff is often difficult for me because it can read as incestuous even when the people involved aren't related. I tend to be attracted to 'ships that are based more on desire than on need and when relationships with that much need in them get sexualized I tend to find it tragic anyway. With Wincest, I just . . . it's really, really sad, you guys, the idea of what it would take them to get there.
I'm also not someone who ever saw the evidence for it in canon. I don't want to argue that because some people are always going to see subtext others don't and I'm not saying anyone's reading is invalid. We interpret things different; I just don't read it that way. They act like siblings. They act like siblings with weird boundary issues, but they act like siblings. One thing that does bother me is that sometimes it seems like there's an implication that their relationship as lovers would be inherently more meaningful than their relationship as family, and that I don't get.
And I am barely in that fandom these days, but I have been threatening to actually write down my Wincest opinions in coherent form for, like, a year. So there it is.
Patrick Stump:
Okay. I like Patrick. I think he is cute and talented and probably has the patience of a saint, anger management issues aside, because how else could one put up with Pete Wentz in that context for that long? That said, he does seem to be fandom's ultimate woobie. He's kind of the one bandom boy that it is not permitted to say anything negative about, and . . . I really don't know why that is. So Pstump! My unpopular opinion is probably that he's not my favorite; He's not even in my top ten. I like him! But I like other people more.
lafemmedarla wanted to know about A:TS:
I was going to say I don't have any unpopular fannish opinions here because all of my opinions were fairly popular, but I DO. I totally have one: I shipped Eve/Lindsey. And I thought Lindsey's death was thematically inappropriate and that bothers me TO THIS DAY, though I am soothed a bit by the existence of the comics because they mean NFA wasn't the end assuming you take them as canon. I am undecided on the canon issue and I don't really feel that strongly about it beyond some academic thoughts about authorial intent and textual ownership in different media, but I won't go into those because they would probably be boring. But yes! Eve/Lindsey! Immorality in love! The very idea of them hit my narrative kinks so hard, you guys. SO HARD.
nojah asked about - BSG:
I don't know what's going on with this fandom, so I don't know what's popular and what's not. Nothing stands out for me in this one. How does fandom feel about Cally/Tyrol? Because I still think it's the squickiest ship to ever squick and I think pairing them together without more explanation was sloppy. Otherwise, I don't know. Starbuck is my favorite, I love to hate Baltar, Baltar/Caprica!Six hits those aforementioned narrative kinks, Athena hits a few others (and owns my heart) with her CHOICE TO BE HUMAN OH GOD. It makes me sad that we never see Boomer and that Athena didn't get more screen time at the end of last season. I don't really think any of those opinions are unpopular, but I don't know.
marenfic asked about RPF/S:
Again, I don't think my opinions are particularly unpopular or even uncommon, for the most part. Obviously I'm a fan. After Keltie posted on her myspace about wanting to be left alone, I did have something of a crisis, and I do feel weird writing girlfriends/family/etc who aren't famous in their own right. Of course, I *am* currently writing a Keltie-pov fic that I intend to finish, so I've actually come to terms with that. I do have discomfort that rears its head every once in awhile though, and as much as I love bandom and am having more fun in it than I've had in fandom in a long time, sometimes I am still uncomfortable. I honestly believe we are writing fannish constructs. We're writing about communally constructed characters and to a certain extent our culture as a *whole* reads celebrity as text ALL THE TIME. We are nicer to Pete Wentz than the tabloids will ever be, and we admit when we're making shit up. I don't generally feel bad about what we do. However, we know we're writing constructs, but the RPS subjects don't necessarily know that and I think the line can get shaky when it comes to those who are fandom-famous, but not FAMOUS-famous. Obviously I like RPF. CLEARLY. But sometimes there is cognitive dissonance, especially given how accessible the bandom subjects are.
velvetandlace wanted to know about Bandom in general and nojah wanted to know about FOB and PATD:
I feel like bandom in general is pretty broad. Probably the only fandom-wide unpopular opinion I have has to do with my bizarrely picky reading habits. I wish there was more canon universe fic because I'm not that big on AUs or crackfic? There are AUs and crackfics that I love, of course, and I read them all the time, but I tend to like canon universe best. And I prefer pairings that have a lot of canonical connections. I figure anyone whose been in a band together is fair game, but if it's a pairing of people who don't really know each other and I can't go to interviews/footage and see subtext, it's not as interesting for me.
(I always feel weird about the above because I enjoy the whimsical nature of fandom and OTHER people's glee over crack!fic and whacked out pairings. It makes me smile. It just doesn't necessarily make me want to read it. Ex: To this day I have never read a wingfic. And I'll only read people turning into animals if it's about a show where that could happen in canon. I'm weird; I don't know).
Fall Out Boy:
I read a fuckton of Pete/Patrick fic and sometimes I even crave it, but I cannot ship them because I don't think any one person should be everything to another person, and this is especially true when one of those people is Pete Wentz. Pete strikes me as very high maintenance. The idea of one person being his best friend/confidante/lead singer AND significant other is actually kind of scary. Now, Patrick/Pete/Ashlee? I am ALL ABOUT THAT.
Panic at the Disco:
Gah, I don't know. My Panic opinions are not unpopular I pretty much just love them right now. Ummm . . . I still wear a Brendon/Ryan tinhat? That interview where Ryan says they don't like "Time to Dance" anymore makes me sad? That's pretty much all I got.
ALSO, songgirl12 said: "So what precisely is wrong with fandom's characterization of Gabe Saporta? Please use citations." I will answer that later, though, because Gabe's existential angst needs its own post.
Wincest:
I have had an on-again, off-again relationship with Wincest since SPN started. I went through a phase where I read A LOT of it, mostly because my need for UST-filled, first-time fic pretty much trumps everything including any incest!squick I have. I never read established relationship Wincest, but to be fair I rarely read established relationship anything.
But even when I was reading a lot of Wincest, I never shipped it. There are Wincest stories I like, and it can be done in ways that I find compelling, but I also see it as innately tragic and I can't separate fic enough from the text to ever read it any other way. Even when I was reading it to hit my UST kink it could never really hit it, because underneath, no matter what story I was reading, I found it depressing. Even in the stories I like, even when it's compelling, it's depressing for me, and really too sad to ever be hot. The you-and-me against the world stuff is often difficult for me because it can read as incestuous even when the people involved aren't related. I tend to be attracted to 'ships that are based more on desire than on need and when relationships with that much need in them get sexualized I tend to find it tragic anyway. With Wincest, I just . . . it's really, really sad, you guys, the idea of what it would take them to get there.
I'm also not someone who ever saw the evidence for it in canon. I don't want to argue that because some people are always going to see subtext others don't and I'm not saying anyone's reading is invalid. We interpret things different; I just don't read it that way. They act like siblings. They act like siblings with weird boundary issues, but they act like siblings. One thing that does bother me is that sometimes it seems like there's an implication that their relationship as lovers would be inherently more meaningful than their relationship as family, and that I don't get.
And I am barely in that fandom these days, but I have been threatening to actually write down my Wincest opinions in coherent form for, like, a year. So there it is.
Patrick Stump:
Okay. I like Patrick. I think he is cute and talented and probably has the patience of a saint, anger management issues aside, because how else could one put up with Pete Wentz in that context for that long? That said, he does seem to be fandom's ultimate woobie. He's kind of the one bandom boy that it is not permitted to say anything negative about, and . . . I really don't know why that is. So Pstump! My unpopular opinion is probably that he's not my favorite; He's not even in my top ten. I like him! But I like other people more.
lafemmedarla wanted to know about A:TS:
I was going to say I don't have any unpopular fannish opinions here because all of my opinions were fairly popular, but I DO. I totally have one: I shipped Eve/Lindsey. And I thought Lindsey's death was thematically inappropriate and that bothers me TO THIS DAY, though I am soothed a bit by the existence of the comics because they mean NFA wasn't the end assuming you take them as canon. I am undecided on the canon issue and I don't really feel that strongly about it beyond some academic thoughts about authorial intent and textual ownership in different media, but I won't go into those because they would probably be boring. But yes! Eve/Lindsey! Immorality in love! The very idea of them hit my narrative kinks so hard, you guys. SO HARD.
nojah asked about - BSG:
I don't know what's going on with this fandom, so I don't know what's popular and what's not. Nothing stands out for me in this one. How does fandom feel about Cally/Tyrol? Because I still think it's the squickiest ship to ever squick and I think pairing them together without more explanation was sloppy. Otherwise, I don't know. Starbuck is my favorite, I love to hate Baltar, Baltar/Caprica!Six hits those aforementioned narrative kinks, Athena hits a few others (and owns my heart) with her CHOICE TO BE HUMAN OH GOD. It makes me sad that we never see Boomer and that Athena didn't get more screen time at the end of last season. I don't really think any of those opinions are unpopular, but I don't know.
marenfic asked about RPF/S:
Again, I don't think my opinions are particularly unpopular or even uncommon, for the most part. Obviously I'm a fan. After Keltie posted on her myspace about wanting to be left alone, I did have something of a crisis, and I do feel weird writing girlfriends/family/etc who aren't famous in their own right. Of course, I *am* currently writing a Keltie-pov fic that I intend to finish, so I've actually come to terms with that. I do have discomfort that rears its head every once in awhile though, and as much as I love bandom and am having more fun in it than I've had in fandom in a long time, sometimes I am still uncomfortable. I honestly believe we are writing fannish constructs. We're writing about communally constructed characters and to a certain extent our culture as a *whole* reads celebrity as text ALL THE TIME. We are nicer to Pete Wentz than the tabloids will ever be, and we admit when we're making shit up. I don't generally feel bad about what we do. However, we know we're writing constructs, but the RPS subjects don't necessarily know that and I think the line can get shaky when it comes to those who are fandom-famous, but not FAMOUS-famous. Obviously I like RPF. CLEARLY. But sometimes there is cognitive dissonance, especially given how accessible the bandom subjects are.
velvetandlace wanted to know about Bandom in general and nojah wanted to know about FOB and PATD:
I feel like bandom in general is pretty broad. Probably the only fandom-wide unpopular opinion I have has to do with my bizarrely picky reading habits. I wish there was more canon universe fic because I'm not that big on AUs or crackfic? There are AUs and crackfics that I love, of course, and I read them all the time, but I tend to like canon universe best. And I prefer pairings that have a lot of canonical connections. I figure anyone whose been in a band together is fair game, but if it's a pairing of people who don't really know each other and I can't go to interviews/footage and see subtext, it's not as interesting for me.
(I always feel weird about the above because I enjoy the whimsical nature of fandom and OTHER people's glee over crack!fic and whacked out pairings. It makes me smile. It just doesn't necessarily make me want to read it. Ex: To this day I have never read a wingfic. And I'll only read people turning into animals if it's about a show where that could happen in canon. I'm weird; I don't know).
Fall Out Boy:
I read a fuckton of Pete/Patrick fic and sometimes I even crave it, but I cannot ship them because I don't think any one person should be everything to another person, and this is especially true when one of those people is Pete Wentz. Pete strikes me as very high maintenance. The idea of one person being his best friend/confidante/lead singer AND significant other is actually kind of scary. Now, Patrick/Pete/Ashlee? I am ALL ABOUT THAT.
Panic at the Disco:
Gah, I don't know. My Panic opinions are not unpopular I pretty much just love them right now. Ummm . . . I still wear a Brendon/Ryan tinhat? That interview where Ryan says they don't like "Time to Dance" anymore makes me sad? That's pretty much all I got.
ALSO, songgirl12 said: "So what precisely is wrong with fandom's characterization of Gabe Saporta? Please use citations." I will answer that later, though, because Gabe's existential angst needs its own post.