(no subject)
As some of you have already heard, I've been asked by a friend of my if I was interested in sharing an apartment with her. To which my answer was a resounding "Yes!". And there was much squeeing.
While trying to find something to write about in my American History paper, I found an interesting article comparing sex ed and its effects in Denmark and the US. I can't link to the article, but I want to post a particularly interesting bit of it. Also, I can email the pdf to anyone interested. But be warned, it's somewhat biased.
The article is titled Going Too Far? Sex, Sin and Social Policy and written by Susan Rose. It starts with some statistics and a couple of horrifying examples of abstinence-only teaching materials. The global gag rule is mentioned, as is the fact that the responsibility of abstinence is mostly put on the female.
Then there's this hilarious quote, which I just had to share:
Former U.S. Presidential candidate, Pat Buchanan, evidently concurred, commenting just
after the [UN Conference on Women] that "it was so bizarre, seeing all those women - it was like the bar scene out of Star Wars."
Because women are totally like aliens.
Then comes the bit that I found really interesting, on young people's attitudes towards sex:
* * *
Young People’s Perspectives
Individual interviews and co-ed classroom and small-group discussions (both same sex and
co-ed) with approximately 100 Danish and 300 American teens revealed significant
differences in how they spoke about sexuality and relationships. The Danish teens tended to
talk about sex in terms of mutual pleasure and responsibility whereas the American teens
tended to speak in terms of performance and achievement (as in “feeling inadequate if they
didn’t achieve orgasm”). When asked when “no means no,” both Danish boys and girls were
quite clear: “when someone says no, that means no.” Their language did not assume that the
male was the predator and the female the prey who was the one pressured into having sex.
For example, one 15-year-old boy in the presence of his male and female classmates said:
If I don’t feel like it, then I want that to be OK. If my girlfriend doesn’t
like something, well then we try something else. If one of us doesn’t
want to, then we find another way. Or we go for a walk.
A 15-year-old girl in the same class commented:
If a girl says no and she really means yes, well then she’s the one who
misses out - she could have said yes if she wanted to.
In discussions with American teenagers, there was much less consensus. Deciding when
“no meant no” was seen as a very confusing judgment call, and there was greater tolerance
for - or at least more willingness to not speak out against - sexually aggressive behavior. In
the American classrooms, those who came right out and said “if someone says no, that
means no” were in the minority. Typically there would be a prolonged conversation about
whether a person (always assumed to be a female) was clear in her own mind, whether she
really meant no when she said no, how forcefully or frequently she said no, whether she was
giving double messages either verbally or non-verbally, what the girl was wearing, and how
she was acting when she said no. The same ambivalence or confusion was expressed in
small-group discussions and individual interviews as well.
The discourse among American teenagers also was gendered in ways that the Danish
discourse about sexual responsibility and responsiveness was not. In the American context,
only females were referred to as saying “no” or being ambivalent about having sex; not once
was the male pronoun used to speak of someone saying “no.” When it came to talking about
women’s ambivalence, the discussion often led to girls and women being untrustworthy
rather than confused or conflicted about what they wanted, or their being unclear in their
expression of what they did and did not want. The blame for miscommunication was placed,
as much by other women as by men, on the female. Often the conversation in the American
classroom would fall back on: “I have known girls who tease men;” “… who say no when
they mean yes;” “You can’t blame the guys.” “If the girl teases a guy, then she has to be ready
to get what she gets.” “After a certain point, you can’t expect a guy to just stop.” In the Danish
context, both male and female teenagers put responsibility on the individual to say what he or
she meant, and they held the individual responsible for his or her actions (including
contraceptive choices). In the American context, more responsibility and blame was placed
on the female especially if something went wrong. One 16-year-old American girl told me:
I think sometimes girls are afraid to say “no.” They’re afraid of what
their boyfriends might think. Or, if they do say no, and then the guy
goes ahead anyway. Tthey don’t want to admit they said no because
that would mean that the guy didn’t care about them. I know I’ve
done that. I don’t like that about myself, but I’ve done it. And I have
friends who have too.
It may be easier for some of these girls to disregard their own desires and voices than to
believe they were forced to have unwanted sex from someone they thought they loved or
who loved them. This seemed to be much less of a quandary for the Danish girls interviewed.
While some of them had sex that was not particularly pleasurable, they were less likely to
have experienced unwanted or forced sex and much more likely to know what they wanted
and didn’t want. They also were much less likely to confuse love and sexual desire. For the
Danish young people and their parents, it was OK to have sex with someone once you turned
16 or 17. Validation did not depend on how much you were in love with the other person, but
how responsible you were in making decisions. Becoming sexual was considered a part of
normal development, of growing up.
Love is such a strong word. I have a boyfriend and I care about him.
We’re having sex and that’s OK with my parents. They know. They just
want us to be protected. He can sleep over at my house. But, I can’t
say I love him. Love and hate are such strong words. My parents, and
my sisters and my brother - I love them. I’ve known them all my life.
But my boyfriend, I’ve only known him a few months. We need to
know each other more. It should be really deep when you say that.
- 17-year-old Danish girl
I really love my boyfriend. So I think it’s OK I’m having sex with him.
But if my parents caught me, they would kill me!
- 17-year-old American girl
Lene, the Danish girl, takes love quite seriously. It is not a word to be thrown about easily.
Sex, on the other hand, is not a big deal. It’s fun, but you need to take care to use protection
so you don’t get AIDS or an infection. Elena, the American girl emphasizes love. Because
she’s in love, it’s OK to have sex. Elena is both sincere and adamant when she says, “I really
love my boyfriend,” but then she leans forward and whispers, “But if my parents caught me,
they would kill me. If they knew, it would be all over. I don’t know why they can’t understand
how much we love each other.”
Another striking contrast between the Danish and American teenagers was their attitude
towards alcohol and sex. While the American teenagers reported that they or their friends often
drink in order to lower their inhibitions to have sex, the Danish teenagers believed that alcohol
and sex were not a good match. A small group of 15- to 17-year-old Danish girls commented:
It ruins it if you’re drunk I think. If the boy’s very drunk he can’t get it
up. He can’t get [an] erection and that ruins it a lot. So I think you
shouldn’t do it if you’re drunk. And you forget the condom if you’re
drunk. It’s easier to have good sex if you’re not drunk.
A 15-year-old boy concurred,
If you’re drunk, you can’t do it very well and it doesn’t feel as good. If
I really like a girl, I don’t drink before we have sex.
The Danish girls were also more open in talking about sexuality, communication and intimacy:
But I think you have to be comfortable. If you feel totally comfortable
and safe with the person, you do more things. So I think you can have
sex and all, but the more safe and the more comfortable you get with
the person the more wild the things get, the more open you get with
your boyfriend.
- 16-year-old Danish girl
Nonetheless, Danish girls also experienced some of the same difficulties as American
girls. The double standard continues to exist in Denmark as well as in the United States,
although perhaps to a lesser degree:
Girls if they are kissing with two (boys) in one evening at a party then
they are cheap and hookers and all that. But, if a boy or a man is
together with more than one, ‘oh it’s just cool.’ I just think, that just
sucks really.
- 15-year-old Danish girl
* * *
I just really loved that final quote. *grins*
Also, that bit on "no means no" was scary.
Anyway, the paper is not coming along. Instead, I'm on my third fic in a week or so.
Sometimes, being a fan is not very practical.
While trying to find something to write about in my American History paper, I found an interesting article comparing sex ed and its effects in Denmark and the US. I can't link to the article, but I want to post a particularly interesting bit of it. Also, I can email the pdf to anyone interested. But be warned, it's somewhat biased.
The article is titled Going Too Far? Sex, Sin and Social Policy and written by Susan Rose. It starts with some statistics and a couple of horrifying examples of abstinence-only teaching materials. The global gag rule is mentioned, as is the fact that the responsibility of abstinence is mostly put on the female.
Then there's this hilarious quote, which I just had to share:
Former U.S. Presidential candidate, Pat Buchanan, evidently concurred, commenting just
after the [UN Conference on Women] that "it was so bizarre, seeing all those women - it was like the bar scene out of Star Wars."
Because women are totally like aliens.
Then comes the bit that I found really interesting, on young people's attitudes towards sex:
* * *
Young People’s Perspectives
Individual interviews and co-ed classroom and small-group discussions (both same sex and
co-ed) with approximately 100 Danish and 300 American teens revealed significant
differences in how they spoke about sexuality and relationships. The Danish teens tended to
talk about sex in terms of mutual pleasure and responsibility whereas the American teens
tended to speak in terms of performance and achievement (as in “feeling inadequate if they
didn’t achieve orgasm”). When asked when “no means no,” both Danish boys and girls were
quite clear: “when someone says no, that means no.” Their language did not assume that the
male was the predator and the female the prey who was the one pressured into having sex.
For example, one 15-year-old boy in the presence of his male and female classmates said:
If I don’t feel like it, then I want that to be OK. If my girlfriend doesn’t
like something, well then we try something else. If one of us doesn’t
want to, then we find another way. Or we go for a walk.
A 15-year-old girl in the same class commented:
If a girl says no and she really means yes, well then she’s the one who
misses out - she could have said yes if she wanted to.
In discussions with American teenagers, there was much less consensus. Deciding when
“no meant no” was seen as a very confusing judgment call, and there was greater tolerance
for - or at least more willingness to not speak out against - sexually aggressive behavior. In
the American classrooms, those who came right out and said “if someone says no, that
means no” were in the minority. Typically there would be a prolonged conversation about
whether a person (always assumed to be a female) was clear in her own mind, whether she
really meant no when she said no, how forcefully or frequently she said no, whether she was
giving double messages either verbally or non-verbally, what the girl was wearing, and how
she was acting when she said no. The same ambivalence or confusion was expressed in
small-group discussions and individual interviews as well.
The discourse among American teenagers also was gendered in ways that the Danish
discourse about sexual responsibility and responsiveness was not. In the American context,
only females were referred to as saying “no” or being ambivalent about having sex; not once
was the male pronoun used to speak of someone saying “no.” When it came to talking about
women’s ambivalence, the discussion often led to girls and women being untrustworthy
rather than confused or conflicted about what they wanted, or their being unclear in their
expression of what they did and did not want. The blame for miscommunication was placed,
as much by other women as by men, on the female. Often the conversation in the American
classroom would fall back on: “I have known girls who tease men;” “… who say no when
they mean yes;” “You can’t blame the guys.” “If the girl teases a guy, then she has to be ready
to get what she gets.” “After a certain point, you can’t expect a guy to just stop.” In the Danish
context, both male and female teenagers put responsibility on the individual to say what he or
she meant, and they held the individual responsible for his or her actions (including
contraceptive choices). In the American context, more responsibility and blame was placed
on the female especially if something went wrong. One 16-year-old American girl told me:
I think sometimes girls are afraid to say “no.” They’re afraid of what
their boyfriends might think. Or, if they do say no, and then the guy
goes ahead anyway. Tthey don’t want to admit they said no because
that would mean that the guy didn’t care about them. I know I’ve
done that. I don’t like that about myself, but I’ve done it. And I have
friends who have too.
It may be easier for some of these girls to disregard their own desires and voices than to
believe they were forced to have unwanted sex from someone they thought they loved or
who loved them. This seemed to be much less of a quandary for the Danish girls interviewed.
While some of them had sex that was not particularly pleasurable, they were less likely to
have experienced unwanted or forced sex and much more likely to know what they wanted
and didn’t want. They also were much less likely to confuse love and sexual desire. For the
Danish young people and their parents, it was OK to have sex with someone once you turned
16 or 17. Validation did not depend on how much you were in love with the other person, but
how responsible you were in making decisions. Becoming sexual was considered a part of
normal development, of growing up.
Love is such a strong word. I have a boyfriend and I care about him.
We’re having sex and that’s OK with my parents. They know. They just
want us to be protected. He can sleep over at my house. But, I can’t
say I love him. Love and hate are such strong words. My parents, and
my sisters and my brother - I love them. I’ve known them all my life.
But my boyfriend, I’ve only known him a few months. We need to
know each other more. It should be really deep when you say that.
- 17-year-old Danish girl
I really love my boyfriend. So I think it’s OK I’m having sex with him.
But if my parents caught me, they would kill me!
- 17-year-old American girl
Lene, the Danish girl, takes love quite seriously. It is not a word to be thrown about easily.
Sex, on the other hand, is not a big deal. It’s fun, but you need to take care to use protection
so you don’t get AIDS or an infection. Elena, the American girl emphasizes love. Because
she’s in love, it’s OK to have sex. Elena is both sincere and adamant when she says, “I really
love my boyfriend,” but then she leans forward and whispers, “But if my parents caught me,
they would kill me. If they knew, it would be all over. I don’t know why they can’t understand
how much we love each other.”
Another striking contrast between the Danish and American teenagers was their attitude
towards alcohol and sex. While the American teenagers reported that they or their friends often
drink in order to lower their inhibitions to have sex, the Danish teenagers believed that alcohol
and sex were not a good match. A small group of 15- to 17-year-old Danish girls commented:
It ruins it if you’re drunk I think. If the boy’s very drunk he can’t get it
up. He can’t get [an] erection and that ruins it a lot. So I think you
shouldn’t do it if you’re drunk. And you forget the condom if you’re
drunk. It’s easier to have good sex if you’re not drunk.
A 15-year-old boy concurred,
If you’re drunk, you can’t do it very well and it doesn’t feel as good. If
I really like a girl, I don’t drink before we have sex.
The Danish girls were also more open in talking about sexuality, communication and intimacy:
But I think you have to be comfortable. If you feel totally comfortable
and safe with the person, you do more things. So I think you can have
sex and all, but the more safe and the more comfortable you get with
the person the more wild the things get, the more open you get with
your boyfriend.
- 16-year-old Danish girl
Nonetheless, Danish girls also experienced some of the same difficulties as American
girls. The double standard continues to exist in Denmark as well as in the United States,
although perhaps to a lesser degree:
Girls if they are kissing with two (boys) in one evening at a party then
they are cheap and hookers and all that. But, if a boy or a man is
together with more than one, ‘oh it’s just cool.’ I just think, that just
sucks really.
- 15-year-old Danish girl
* * *
I just really loved that final quote. *grins*
Also, that bit on "no means no" was scary.
Anyway, the paper is not coming along. Instead, I'm on my third fic in a week or so.
Sometimes, being a fan is not very practical.