Finally pushed to putting in my two cents
So most people should know what's going on with LJ and deleting journals because of interests in people's user info. If you haven't, then you've either dropped off the face of the earth and not walked in fandom for a day or you don't care. If you don't care, then walk on by. If you do, then I guess this could be for you.
I won't comment on what's been happening. Everything I could think of to say has been said. A lot. But people have brought up the idea of leaving LJ altogether. A few suggestions have been made. And I, being the opinionated person that I am, have some comments about them.
1.) We must have a great migration and move to another journal site.
Ignorning the fact that every time I hear this idea, I have a vision of fandom as a huge flock of ducks heading for warmer climates, I ask what this would accomplish? Every journal site that we try to move to will have TOS. They will probably have TOS worded very similiarly to LJ. They have to. All it would take is for Warriors For Innocence to find out about that journal site or some other crack using group to do the same and we'd be running from that site as well.
We have to face the fact that every free site like LJ is going to have TOS. Hell, every not free site is going to have TOS. TOS are like a force of God: always there and always lingering in the background to wreck havoc on fandom life. Until the day comes that fanfic is not illegal, there will be a looming threat that we might get shut down. And the fact that there are those in fandom (yes, I'm counting myself here) that will write incest, noncon and chan means that we are in even more danger. That's not to say that we shouldn't write it. I know that no one who writes any of those is actually condoning any illegal conduct (okay, I hope they're not...I certainly don't), but writing it is in the fuzzy lines of legality. And when people who are not in fandom find out about these things, they tend to have very strong reactions. And by "very strong," I mean very strongly negative.
2.) Forums! We can move to forums!
Forums have actually been brought up in other conversations before. I know some people are sad that debates/conversations/meta used to last for months. Weeks, anyway. Now, because things fall off people's flist sometimes in a matter of hours (but usually days for most), conversations are moving lightning fast and a lot of people miss out on the good stuff. Forums do allow you to continue a conversation within the public pervue for longer and even restart that conversation for others sometimes months after the last post. But you can do the same for LJ. The only difference is that, instead of just posting to the original conversation, you just start a new convo where some things might just get rehashed. This is not an inherently bad thing. I will grant that, if done too often in close succession, it can get aggravating, but that is what linking is for. And memories.
Furthermore, and this is probably a personal preference, I don't particularly like the formatting of forums for fic viewing. It can be very similar to LJ but it can also be wacky as all hell. I know that some people's LJ can be wacky as all hell, too, but forums seem to be worse.
Here, I will admit some ignorance: can you build communities and groups on forums like you can on LJ? Because that is one thing about LJ that I love! Because if I have to log into a million different forums instead of just reading everything on my flist...that just seems inefficient.
3a.) Let's go back to e-mail groups like Yahell! or Google Groups!
If you don't remember the days when fandom was on Yahell...I hate you. You have just made me feel old. And I'm not. Not by a long shot.
I've had limited exposure to Google groups, but it was bad. Yahoo, as aggravating as it was (still is) seems better. And I will say that there is some fandom still on Yahoo. I, personally, run a NCIS Femslash group. Granted, there isn't much activity there (due to the small group of people interested and the fact that fandom just isn't really thriving on Yahoo anymore), but we do get some. And there are other groups. I know that sara_sofia is on both LJ and Yahoo. I'm sure there are others.
The problem with Yahoo was that they had a tendency to...well, they were aggravating. There were times when your account would suddenly start to bounce for no reason and you wouldn't get e-mails. And it could fill up your inbox in about two seconds flat depending on the group, it's activity level and the sheer number of groups you were involved in. Also, Yahoo's search function was crappy. I haven't used it in recent memory, but I would assume it still is.
4.) Let's go back to just archiving things on massive archives and websites and rec lists!
Again, if you have no idea that we used to do that (and still do!)...I hate you. I am *not* old!
I remember going to www.masterapprentice.org (the address was different back in the day, but it's the same archive) and spending hours just browsing the fics! It was gorgeous! And I did the same for The Sentinel (852 Prospect)and Babylon 5 (I can see the site in my head, but the name is not coming to me...it was red and was abbreviated AR...or AU...or A something...help!) and Earth: Final Conflict (rec lists) and a dozen others.
The problem with those sites was that it was sometimes hard to really get *involved* with fandom. You either wrote a lot and became fairly well known or you read a lot and lurked or you did you both and were sorta well known. That was why, I think, we tended to use archives in conjunction with Yahoo groups. I know that's how MA's fandom following got *huge*. And the fact that Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan were totally made for each other. ;)
***
Having said all of that, I suppose I should actually consider making a suggestion, shouldn't I? I think fandom should stay right where it is. LJ, bless them, works. Yes, we occasionally have to be aware of people trolling but we're gonna have to do that anywhere. Someone said...somewhere that they don't want to have to contantly be watching their back and waiting for the other shoe to drop. So don't. TPTB tend to leave us alone. And, if they don't...I hate to break your heart, but we are breaking copyright and there are some people who take offense to that.
Laurell K. Hamilton does not like that there is fanfiction written about Anita Blake and Merry Gentry. It's why I don't write it (and the fact that I think it's brilliant on it's own). George Lucas is peeved at fanfic writers after someone first tried to send him a fanfic story and tell him he needed to write this and then after someone tried to sell their fanfic on amazon.com. Evanescence does not like people using their music in fan vids. I believe they may have issues an all-encompassing, unofficial C&D. Granted, some people blatantly disregard these things and some people leave those fandoms (and artists) alone. Either way, it's out there to find if you really want to find it.
Should we go back to Yahoo (or some alternative) and archiving, I'll be annoyed, but I'll go. Should we go to forums...I'll be really annoyed and I'll resist like hell, but, eventually, I'd probably go there, too. Any other brilliant ideas? I may follow. I don't know. Depends on if I want to be a duck or not. But I would love it if we could just stay put. Please? It really isn't that bad. I promise.
I won't comment on what's been happening. Everything I could think of to say has been said. A lot. But people have brought up the idea of leaving LJ altogether. A few suggestions have been made. And I, being the opinionated person that I am, have some comments about them.
1.) We must have a great migration and move to another journal site.
Ignorning the fact that every time I hear this idea, I have a vision of fandom as a huge flock of ducks heading for warmer climates, I ask what this would accomplish? Every journal site that we try to move to will have TOS. They will probably have TOS worded very similiarly to LJ. They have to. All it would take is for Warriors For Innocence to find out about that journal site or some other crack using group to do the same and we'd be running from that site as well.
We have to face the fact that every free site like LJ is going to have TOS. Hell, every not free site is going to have TOS. TOS are like a force of God: always there and always lingering in the background to wreck havoc on fandom life. Until the day comes that fanfic is not illegal, there will be a looming threat that we might get shut down. And the fact that there are those in fandom (yes, I'm counting myself here) that will write incest, noncon and chan means that we are in even more danger. That's not to say that we shouldn't write it. I know that no one who writes any of those is actually condoning any illegal conduct (okay, I hope they're not...I certainly don't), but writing it is in the fuzzy lines of legality. And when people who are not in fandom find out about these things, they tend to have very strong reactions. And by "very strong," I mean very strongly negative.
2.) Forums! We can move to forums!
Forums have actually been brought up in other conversations before. I know some people are sad that debates/conversations/meta used to last for months. Weeks, anyway. Now, because things fall off people's flist sometimes in a matter of hours (but usually days for most), conversations are moving lightning fast and a lot of people miss out on the good stuff. Forums do allow you to continue a conversation within the public pervue for longer and even restart that conversation for others sometimes months after the last post. But you can do the same for LJ. The only difference is that, instead of just posting to the original conversation, you just start a new convo where some things might just get rehashed. This is not an inherently bad thing. I will grant that, if done too often in close succession, it can get aggravating, but that is what linking is for. And memories.
Furthermore, and this is probably a personal preference, I don't particularly like the formatting of forums for fic viewing. It can be very similar to LJ but it can also be wacky as all hell. I know that some people's LJ can be wacky as all hell, too, but forums seem to be worse.
Here, I will admit some ignorance: can you build communities and groups on forums like you can on LJ? Because that is one thing about LJ that I love! Because if I have to log into a million different forums instead of just reading everything on my flist...that just seems inefficient.
3a.) Let's go back to e-mail groups like Yahell! or Google Groups!
If you don't remember the days when fandom was on Yahell...I hate you. You have just made me feel old. And I'm not. Not by a long shot.
I've had limited exposure to Google groups, but it was bad. Yahoo, as aggravating as it was (still is) seems better. And I will say that there is some fandom still on Yahoo. I, personally, run a NCIS Femslash group. Granted, there isn't much activity there (due to the small group of people interested and the fact that fandom just isn't really thriving on Yahoo anymore), but we do get some. And there are other groups. I know that sara_sofia is on both LJ and Yahoo. I'm sure there are others.
The problem with Yahoo was that they had a tendency to...well, they were aggravating. There were times when your account would suddenly start to bounce for no reason and you wouldn't get e-mails. And it could fill up your inbox in about two seconds flat depending on the group, it's activity level and the sheer number of groups you were involved in. Also, Yahoo's search function was crappy. I haven't used it in recent memory, but I would assume it still is.
4.) Let's go back to just archiving things on massive archives and websites and rec lists!
Again, if you have no idea that we used to do that (and still do!)...I hate you. I am *not* old!
I remember going to www.masterapprentice.org (the address was different back in the day, but it's the same archive) and spending hours just browsing the fics! It was gorgeous! And I did the same for The Sentinel (852 Prospect)and Babylon 5 (I can see the site in my head, but the name is not coming to me...it was red and was abbreviated AR...or AU...or A something...help!) and Earth: Final Conflict (rec lists) and a dozen others.
The problem with those sites was that it was sometimes hard to really get *involved* with fandom. You either wrote a lot and became fairly well known or you read a lot and lurked or you did you both and were sorta well known. That was why, I think, we tended to use archives in conjunction with Yahoo groups. I know that's how MA's fandom following got *huge*. And the fact that Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan were totally made for each other. ;)
***
Having said all of that, I suppose I should actually consider making a suggestion, shouldn't I? I think fandom should stay right where it is. LJ, bless them, works. Yes, we occasionally have to be aware of people trolling but we're gonna have to do that anywhere. Someone said...somewhere that they don't want to have to contantly be watching their back and waiting for the other shoe to drop. So don't. TPTB tend to leave us alone. And, if they don't...I hate to break your heart, but we are breaking copyright and there are some people who take offense to that.
Laurell K. Hamilton does not like that there is fanfiction written about Anita Blake and Merry Gentry. It's why I don't write it (and the fact that I think it's brilliant on it's own). George Lucas is peeved at fanfic writers after someone first tried to send him a fanfic story and tell him he needed to write this and then after someone tried to sell their fanfic on amazon.com. Evanescence does not like people using their music in fan vids. I believe they may have issues an all-encompassing, unofficial C&D. Granted, some people blatantly disregard these things and some people leave those fandoms (and artists) alone. Either way, it's out there to find if you really want to find it.
Should we go back to Yahoo (or some alternative) and archiving, I'll be annoyed, but I'll go. Should we go to forums...I'll be really annoyed and I'll resist like hell, but, eventually, I'd probably go there, too. Any other brilliant ideas? I may follow. I don't know. Depends on if I want to be a duck or not. But I would love it if we could just stay put. Please? It really isn't that bad. I promise.