McWeir squee, fake!incest rant

[wisdomeagle]

I think McKay/Weir has entirely destroyed my ability to correctly perceive the characters. It's terrible. And not just to perceive the characters... it's like prillalar was talking about in this post about how she has a few (very few) pairings that she adores so much that she cannot write them as anything other than superficial hearts + flowers + kisses

Comments

[cheese_munkey]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Note one: Personally, I find the idea of metaphorical sibcest like Daniel/Sam much more squicky than literal sibcest like Fujicest... or, gods help me, Beka/Raif or something (...trying to think of a scifidom comparison...) >_<. Maybe b/c my fangirl's all twisted and completely all over same/common backgrounds/blood ties drawing people into nice self-destructive relationships that they can't escape from.... (instead of me blathering on, just read N.P. by Banana Yoshimoto XP) or even fluffy smut that's just delicious b/c they have the deeper connection of a typically shared childhood in literal 'cest; & my real-life knee-jerk reaction to a nice, very close, platonic relationship is to *keep it that way*, because it's so much safer and appropriate and less generating of guilt. But that's me

[wisdomeagle]

& my real-life knee-jerk reaction to a nice, very close, platonic relationship is to *keep it that way*, because it's so much safer and appropriate and less generating of guilt. But that's me.

And my reaction is almost always just the opposite. Oh, I tell myself "no, no, we're just close friends, no need to..." *bam* *UST* *angst* Perhaps it's not the smartest thing to do, but it's what I always do. I suppose that's why friendship cum romance is one of my biggest fic!kinks.

I mostly take a nothing-is-sacred attitude, pairingwise... no relationship is so perfect and pure in canon that it can't become kinky, nasty, wrong!romance/sex in fic... except John/Chi. (There are other pairings I don't like, but I think that's the only one I don't like because I value their friendship too much.)

Uhh, literal sibcest in sci-fi.... Chi/Nirri and John/Olivia are springing to mind... *odd twitchy look* Sam/Mark, but since we never actually see Mark

[alixtii]

The only literal twincest I'm famililar with is Fred/George (HP) and I haven't read anywhere near a lot of it, but I see it as just so much sameness. Like glorified wank!fic.

And Padma/Pavarti (also from HP) I think is usually portrayed, at least pre-Hogwarts, as just so right it was never wrong...

Hmmm, yes. From what I've gathered from HP through osmosis, F/G and P/P do act very much more like the Cuckoos than Hallie/Annie, being more caricatures. But then we get into what I've said with the Cuckoos--that the very purity of the archetype is part of the appeal.

I don't usually truck with "Guys like lesbians because they want to imagine getting with both of them at the same time" explanations, because it doesn't match my experience at all--but I do think that in extreme cases of twincest the interchangeability of the subjects becomes part of the kink. I'm not sure how that works.

[wisdomeagle]

See, if I'd read all your comments before responding to them, I would have spared myself actually typing my previous comment, which covers almost exactly the same ground.

the interchangeability of the subjects becomes part of the kink. I'm not sure how that works.

Me neither. I'm thinking on it.

[azarsuerte]

Perhaps it's me being gay (and a gay woman at that, which is different from being a gay man), but for me, romance is built on similarity first. Lots and lots of similarity that attracts two people to each other first of all, and then of course people are different, but I have never really found difference to be much of a turn-on. Mostly, it just makes things more difficult.

It's not just you being gay. I feel the same way, and I'm straight. *grin* I like to say, "opposites may attract, but commmonalities last." A romance that's not built on SOME common ground has nothing to stand on once the original OMGhe/shesohot! wears off.

Giles. Is. Not. Buffy's. Father. (Or mother, for that matter.)
Giles. Is. Not. Willow's. Father. (Or Xander's, or Oz's, or Anya's, or Tara's, or Cordelia's.)
Sam is not Cassie's mother. Janet is.
Jack is not Cassie's father. She doesn't have one anymore. (It's not Daniel either.)
Sirius is Harry's godfather.To me it has nothing to do with whether the elder character in the pairing is a parental figure, it's

[wisdomeagle]

That does help. And that's fair... not everyone has a power kink.

And there is a whole rant about age difference vs. generation gap in the Jossverse re: Anya, Angel, and Spike, but I won't get into that here!

boss/employee or teacher/student or CO/subordinate

See, all those things are just yummy to me, but to each the own which belongs to each! That's what makes fandom fun.

[pepperjackcandy]

I won't 'ship Buffy/Giles for the same reason I won't 'ship Jack/Sam, because there's an ingrained inequality in the relationship in that the younger of the two EXPECTS to be told what to do by the other. It's why I've often said that I don't think Sam would ever be able to shake that mindset in a relationship.

I'm sorta coming late to the party and all, only having seen through S6 (and now we're trying to get caught up on Alias before January, so S7's still off in the future somewhere). Isn't it in Beneath the Surface where the first thing Sam remembers isn't that he's Jack, the love of her life :makes exaggerated smooching noises:, but Col. O'Neil, her boss?

[azarsuerte]

Oh, and on the McKay/Weir thing...I don't think it's out of character to have Rodney acting more respectful towards Elizabeth than he does towards the other women in his life, because he's already DONE so on-screen. Repeatedly. I was knocked flat on my butt in "Rising" when he told her she'd done the right thing, sending Sheppard to rescue Sumner and the Athosians, because that just seemed so UNLIKE McKay. But it's been a consistent character trait throughout the series, and it's why the 'ship is slowly growing on me even though I still like Shep/Weir too. *grin*

But hey...if you think about it, it's not really surprising either. After all, Elizabeth is one of the first people in McKay's life who treated HIM with unconditional respect, so it doesn't surprise me that she's earned the same from him in return.

[wisdomeagle]

But hey...if you think about it, it's not really surprising either. After all, Elizabeth is one of the first people in McKay's life who treated HIM with unconditional respect, so it doesn't surprise me that she's earned the same from him in return.

Oooh, that just made me go all squishy inside. <3 them so much... may I quote you in my essay for ship_manifesto? I spend the whole essay dancing around points and then people can just put them so succinctly... *sighs*

But Shep/Weir still makes me twitch. :p

[azarsuerte]

Sorry this is a bit late, but yes you may absolutely quote me if you want to. Cool. :-D

[hermionesviolin]

Wow, um, when did you start sharing my brain, and why didn't you tell me before now

[wisdomeagle]

Wow, um, when did you start sharing my brain, and why didn't you tell me before now?

Well, when you listed McGonagall/Hermione AND Willow/Giles in your fandomwishlist thingie, I decided that you must have stolen my brain and would like it back please thank you VERY much. :p

I think the oddest thing I figured out while writing this is that my fake!sibcest kink and my fake!parentcest kink are exact opposites: the sibcest is someone so close, so same, that the risk is that there's no tension at all, it's just all... melty. And then the parentcest is SO MUCH POWER which is why it's all fun.

And ooh, that quote is all shiny-like. :p

. One of my other kinks is a reverse-Lolita (i need to come up with a better phrase for that) i.e. the little girl initiating activity with the older male -- not that other powerlay can't be fun, too

I think it's just all fun. Especially f/f. The HP fandom frustrates me incessantly because there's almost no f/f chan. *weeps* But yay, power!kink.

*uses verywrong!lolicon icon again*

[hermionesviolin]

Dude, first i'm stealing lilithchilde's work ethic and now your brain. I'm turning into a regular ole klepto, huh?

I think the oddest thing I figured out while writing this is that my fake!sibcest kink and my fake!parentcest kink are exact opposites: the sibcest is someone so close, so same, that the risk is that there's no tension at all, it's just all... melty. And then the parentcest is SO MUCH POWER which is why it's all fun.

Yeah, i was thinking similar things. And speaking of powerplay [i totally misspelled that as "powerlay" in my original comment, didn't i?] and McGonagall/Hermione and the lack of f/f in HP... have you read jacito's fics Woman Eater and Obeisance?

And ooh, that quote is all shiny-like. :p

:) Does that mean i'm now obligated to actually write the piece?

THANK YOU for this rant!

[jedi_penguin]

I've noticed in Buffy fandom in particular that there is a horror of intimacy. Sex between natural enemies equals TEH HAWT and that hotness magically morphs into lurrrvvee. It irks me. Why can't there be room in fandom who like to see solid established relationships evolve? Yes, Buffy and Xander are best buds; why do they have to *stay* that way? Yes, Giles began with some modicum of authority over the Scoobies (though I don't think it was ever really all that great, actually), but they're all adults now. Can't their relationship evolve and transform as they do, or is he doomed to remain static even as they all change