If there's only ash remaining, will the ash still be sentient? *shudders again*
I started thinking about that, and had to stop. I was picturing Vera's ashes or atoms screaming silently, because they are incinerated...but they are still alive and aware.
I'm assuming, partially for my own sanity, that ash is not aware. That's the idea behind cremating people who are "alive" but brain-dead - there aren't any nerves connected in such a way to feel pain or anything. You need chemical reactions for that sort of thing, and you need a certain number of alive, functioning cells to have awareness. That's why strangling victims just stare vacantly.
But ooooomg, I sat there, literally with popcorn halfway to my mouth, frozen when I realized what was about to happen to Vera. NOT COOL.
I'm pretty sure the point with Gwen's dad is that she has to learn, again, that she can't save everyone - in a new way, this time. That death is not always bad, that it's important to have. Not all foes can be fought with guns or even cleverness. Valar morghulis, for GRRMartin fans.
Don't get me wrong; I want her to save her dad from the fires. But we all know she'll have to let him go when this is all over. Sort of her "Cyberwoman," except not crappy beyond all reason.
It was certainly a shocker that I didn't expect - but then, when it happens to lead characters we've come to like, it hits harder, doesn't it.
I hope your interpretation of the state of ash is correct - though we did see that charred skeleton and it was clearly still 'alive', though to what extent isn't clear.
And, yes, that's an excellent point re. Gwen and her dad. Poor Gwen!
If anyone didn't think of sentient ash - and then try desperately to think of anything but sentient ash - they weren't watching the same show you and I were watching. It's absolutely fascinating and ghastly all at the same time, just as this whole arc has been. I felt so bad for Vera, (and so impressed with the actress.)
And yet, her ability to do the stupid thing at the wrong time, for largely the right ethical reason, shows that she's tailor-made for Torchwood. Torchwood, home of amazing people you love, who do cosmically stupid things because their emotion bone outweighs their logic bone. Yes, I am, in fact, looking at my beloved Gwen, here.
And Bill Pullman continues to be a revelation (see whut I did thar?) in his portrayal of Oswald Danes. Man, every time he's on the screen, I back away on the couch. Marvelous work!
This series is really gripping our emotions, isn't it? Some people have said that the development has been pretty slow up to this point, but I think that too was necessary. Would we have had the same degree of emotional attachment to Vera, and horror at her fate, if the writers hadn't taken five episodes to get us to here?
Torchwood, home of amazing people you love, who do cosmically stupid things because their emotion bone outweighs their logic bone.
Oh, yes. That is so true, and almost as much true of Jack as it is the others. He likes to think that he does what's necessary because it's necessary, but how many times has he let his heart rule his head?
There is a lot of great acting in this series, yes.
Poor Jack. It just breaks my heart every time he projects his guilt and self-hatred onto Oswald - who is too much of a monster to really feel either.
I think my brain shut off about midway through Danes' speech. He got as far as 'angels' and 'purified' and I'm suddenly back at PotW with the Dalek emperor and his 'angels' as they 'purified' the human race.
And poor Vera! :( If the ash actually is sentient, I really really would rather not have it confirmed! The possibility alone is bad enough.
Yes, Jack really doesn't get Oswald, does he, as much as he thinks he does?
As for Oswald's speech, that was bizarre. It's as if the careful self-censor he's been using throughout - on the TV interviews, in the hospital etc - just vanished and the insane Danes shone through. It was delusional, rambling and crazy - and I hope Jack knows now that he can't be trusted to help. At the same time, Danes is still kind of compelling viewing.
This is something I really love about Jack. As much as he's seen and done in his long life, there's still this streak of innocence in him that just doesn't seem to be able to comprehend that a person could do something so heinous to a child and not feel any remorse.
Personally, I think Oswald's speech has opened his eyes the hard way, but we'll see what the writers have to say this week, I guess. LOL
Danes is very compelling. I do like that they've given him layers rather than just being the stereotypical 1-dimensional monster some other shows may have turned him into.
Oh and Jane Espenson has kind of put my fears to rest about the ash - I hope I understood her right and don't get a majorly rude awakening this Friday, though. LOL
Re: This could be classed as a spoiler wendymrAugust 9 2011, 01:20:18 UTC
Oh, that will definitely hit Rhys at some point. I'll be interested to see what it does to him - my guess is that it will make him furious.
Hmm - interesting reaction from Espenson, but I'll wait to be convinced by how they explain it on-screen. If nobody can die, then... nobody can die, surely?
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I started thinking about that, and had to stop. I was picturing Vera's ashes or atoms screaming silently, because they are incinerated...but they are still alive and aware.
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But ooooomg, I sat there, literally with popcorn halfway to my mouth, frozen when I realized what was about to happen to Vera. NOT COOL.
I'm pretty sure the point with Gwen's dad is that she has to learn, again, that she can't save everyone - in a new way, this time. That death is not always bad, that it's important to have. Not all foes can be fought with guns or even cleverness. Valar morghulis, for GRRMartin fans.
Don't get me wrong; I want her to save her dad from the fires. But we all know she'll have to let him go when this is all over. Sort of her "Cyberwoman," except not crappy beyond all reason.
Reply
I hope your interpretation of the state of ash is correct - though we did see that charred skeleton and it was clearly still 'alive', though to what extent isn't clear.
And, yes, that's an excellent point re. Gwen and her dad. Poor Gwen!
Reply
And yet, her ability to do the stupid thing at the wrong time, for largely the right ethical reason, shows that she's tailor-made for Torchwood. Torchwood, home of amazing people you love, who do cosmically stupid things because their emotion bone outweighs their logic bone. Yes, I am, in fact, looking at my beloved Gwen, here.
And Bill Pullman continues to be a revelation (see whut I did thar?) in his portrayal of Oswald Danes. Man, every time he's on the screen, I back away on the couch. Marvelous work!
Reply
Torchwood, home of amazing people you love, who do cosmically stupid things because their emotion bone outweighs their logic bone.
Oh, yes. That is so true, and almost as much true of Jack as it is the others. He likes to think that he does what's necessary because it's necessary, but how many times has he let his heart rule his head?
There is a lot of great acting in this series, yes.
Reply
I think my brain shut off about midway through Danes' speech. He got as far as 'angels' and 'purified' and I'm suddenly back at PotW with the Dalek emperor and his 'angels' as they 'purified' the human race.
And poor Vera! :( If the ash actually is sentient, I really really would rather not have it confirmed! The possibility alone is bad enough.
Reply
As for Oswald's speech, that was bizarre. It's as if the careful self-censor he's been using throughout - on the TV interviews, in the hospital etc - just vanished and the insane Danes shone through. It was delusional, rambling and crazy - and I hope Jack knows now that he can't be trusted to help. At the same time, Danes is still kind of compelling viewing.
Reply
Personally, I think Oswald's speech has opened his eyes the hard way, but we'll see what the writers have to say this week, I guess. LOL
Danes is very compelling. I do like that they've given him layers rather than just being the stereotypical 1-dimensional monster some other shows may have turned him into.
Oh and Jane Espenson has kind of put my fears to rest about the ash - I hope I understood her right and don't get a majorly rude awakening this Friday, though. LOL
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and confirmed that with the burning - dead is indeed dead - no awareness anymore
Also: Rhys took patients to the 'Burns Unit' - he'll be hit with the realisation of what that means
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Hmm - interesting reaction from Espenson, but I'll wait to be convinced by how they explain it on-screen. If nobody can die, then... nobody can die, surely?
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I suspect we'll get the explanation in episode 6
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