Sun-Tzu of the twentieth century?

[vigilante_wake]

My major accomplishment of the week thus far has been learning to knit with double-pointed needles. I once read someone describe it as "wrestling with an octopus" and I have to concur. This is some hardcore knitting. CIRCULAR NEEDLES ARE FOR THE WEAK!

We watched Fog of War today in Current World Problems. Amazingly, this meant we got through an

Comments

[jij]

Fog of War sounds fascinating, if indeed depressing. I'm reading "Flags of our Fathers" because I have a student studying the movie, and it's depressing me terribly. I just finished a section which was basically this

[vigilante_wake]

Have I mentioned before that I really like your "Illumination" icon? It's cute and clever.

I'm curious what "Rationality will not save us" means precisely. I can think of a bunch of different possible ways to read that--which way did the movie mean?

That lesson came up during the Cuban Missile Crisis segment of the movie. McNamara made the point that even though Kennedy, most of his advisers, and the Soviet premiere were all rational men, we almost had a nuclear holocaust anyway. Which is where lesson #1 comes in. Probably the only reason war was averted was because one of Kennedy's people knew Kruschev (I know that's spelled wrong) personally and was able to talk him down.

How would you interpret it?

That passage from Flags of Our Fathers...wow. I hear the Clint Eastwood-directed film is supposed to be pretty good, although the companion film told from the Japanese perspective, Letters From Iwo Jima, is better. Plus, it stars Ken Watanabe. Can't go wrong there

[jij]

Hmm...I wasn't sure if it was an argument that maybe religion or spirituality was necessary to get through these things. I like your explanation better, though. It does seem that entirely reasonable and rational people will still make terrible, reasonable, rational mistakes.

Flags of our Fathers, the movie...my student who's analyzing it said she didn't see anything terribly jingoistic about it, so that's good. And that Eastwood was willing to make the companion film says a lot of good things about him

[vigilante_wake]

It does seem that entirely reasonable and rational people will still make terrible, reasonable, rational mistakes.

It's true. And with nuclear weapons, there's no room for error.

I mean, the author's father was one of the Marines raising the flag in that photograph, so of course he has a very vested interest in one side, and he's a good writer...but I end up arguing with him mentally and it's wearing me out.

Hmm. That makes sense. He's probably too close to the subject matter to sit back and analyze things objectively. I'm sorry it's so exhausting. I would have a hard time reading it as well.

To bring this back to your teacher's favorite topic, the author also argues that the Nazis were very civilized when fighting--they always stopped hostilities at five o'clock, never stopped medics from treating men. He never bothers to mention that while they're being so civil on the battlefield they're cheerfully committing genocide in Eastern Europe.That's...so incredibly stupid. Is he actually trying to make the point that the Japanese were

[bradygirl_12]

I always shudder to think what would have happened if the Shrub was President in 1962 instead of JFK during the Crisis. I'm sure instead of mistrusting the generals and CIA and wanting to try and find some way out of the mess, he would have said, "Sure, bombs away! Let me get to my shelter!"

[vigilante_wake]

I always shudder to think what would have happened if the Shrub was President in 1962 instead of JFK during the Crisis.

The creepy thing is that it was more luck that President Kennedy that averted the war. One of his advisers was a personal friend of the Soviet premiere and was able to talk him down.

But I think you're right about Bush. What a scary thought. *shudder*

[stubbleupdate]

Wasn't one of the big problems with the Cuban Missile Crisis that the commanders on American ships on the blockade were too damn proud to follow the order to not engage Soviet ships that was handed down to them BY THEIR OWN PRESIDENT?

In International Relations we were given the Cuban Missile Crisis as a study in rationale, brinksmanship, and how the chain of command (sometimes) works.

[vigilante_wake]

Wasn't one of the big problems with the Cuban Missile Crisis that the commanders on American ships on the blockade were too damn proud to follow the order to not engage Soviet ships that was handed down to them BY THEIR OWN PRESIDENT?

Yeah, which is ridiculous. I mean, if the choice is between swallowing your pride and nuclear annihilation... I think the entire concept of brinkmanship is idiotic anyway because gambling with millions of lives is, well, wrong?

I love how the Cuban Missile Crisis is the poster event for "The Dangers of Group-think" and "How to Almost Fuck Up Really Bad."

*sigh* Mitchell Hundred for president!

[wispywillow]

My major accomplishment of the week thus far has been learning to knit with double-pointed needles.
Cool! And those knitting needles make awesome weapons if ninjas ever attacked while you were knitting ^_^

The Cuban Missile Crisis was scary when you realize just how close we came to nuclear annihilation.
Oh, i know! Thank god Kennedy was president then and not Bush.

I know the whole Iraq = Vietnam thing is old by now...
Anne and I were talking about it last night, actually. We got to talking about Kent State and protestors and the bipolarity of the country right now. Scary stuff.

[vigilante_wake]

Another gay LotR icon! Yay!

Cool! And those knitting needles make awesome weapons if ninjas ever attacked while you were knitting

I like how they make me feel dangerous. I used to carry knitting needles around in my purse and they would be sticking out the top. It made me feel like I was armed ^_^

Oh, I know! Thank god Kennedy was president then and not Bush.

*shudders at the thought* We need another Kennedy.

Anne and I were talking about it last night, actually. We got to talking about Kent State and protestors and the bipolarity of the country right now. Scary stuff.

I wonder how long it's going to be before something like Kent State happens again. With how high tensions are in the country, it feels almost inevitable : (

[stubbleupdate]

DARRRRRRRRRRRRRRK VENGEANCE!