writing in a second language
*waves* Hi everyone! Our discussion topic for today (and thanks to the always awesome elliotsmelliot for having me here) is the many wonders (or maybe not exactly wonders) of writing in a second language. Since I didn't want to blather endlessly about what I think about the subject, also because for everyone it's a different thing, I asked other second-language writers to give me their two cents in my journal a while ago. Everyone answered the same questions and this is what you'll find under the cut along with my answers to said questions. Also, I had the two cents of a couple of people in my FL who aren't from Lost fandom but who write in a second language too, who don't have answers of course for the last Lost related question. So thanks in advance to everyone who answered back at my LJ aka gottalovev, alemyrddin, lenina20, fosfomifira, etpmvemp from Lost fandom and pnr and reckess from my own fl.
Okay, this be the actual questions. I copied and pasted as they were on my journal and I sincerely hope I didn't mess answers up, if I did notify me and I'll check. If someone who hasn't answered them wants to do it, here is the list:
1) How do you approach writing in a second language opposite writing in your own?
2) What is that you find easier in the task and what you find hardest? Related with the last part, what is that you feel like you could improve?
3) What's the advice you'd give to other people writing in second language?
4) How do you approach writing Lost specifically? Have you ever tried writing Lost in your first language and if yes, how is it like?
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1) How do you approach writing in a second language opposite writing in your own?
gottalovev: Writing in English is something I have to take my time to do, mostly, as writing French (while it's a tricky language as a rule) generally flows. I am confident in my French and always doubt my English. So what I do is that I try to write in 'proper' English as I go, hoping it becomes a second nature, but sometimes I stumble on a word that I don't know or an expression that I wish I could use. If I'm in those rare moments where the words are stumbling out, I might put a word in French and come back later, but generally I try to work around the obstacle and re-think my idea. I re-read and edit all the time, trying to whip the story in shape, and that process doesn't wait until I am done with it. When I think I've done as much as I could, I send it to beta (unless it's a drabble or very short/fast fic like the Luau stuff), and rely a LOT on the beta job to learn more.
alemyrddin: Actually, I don't write in my own language at all. At least, not fic. I write work-related papers, but the two processes, as you might guess, are largely different.
I find myself more comfortable writing fics in English because I've always read fanfic in that language, and it's been at least 2 years since I starting watching the show in English as well. I often find myself thinking in English when I think about Lost. Therefore the terms come more easily to my mind in that language, and I think the story flows better. I've tried a couple of times to read fic in Italian, but it just doesn't work for me.
lenina20: I don't write much in Spanish, so I'm much more used to the rhythm of words in English. Rhythm is very important for me, the number of words per cent needs to sound right, and maybe because I only read in English and mostly write in English as well, that comes naturally. In Spanish, I worry much more about semantic nuances of words that in English evade me. I think it could be said that my writing in English is more superficial. I worry more about how it sounds than about what actually says, in terms of wording.
fosfomifira: I ... I don't know. I really don't write fiction in my own language, so I'm basically writing in the only way I know, the only way I've ever written fiction. Obviously, it took me some time to gain the confidence to write fiction in English, but what held me back wasn't the language itself as much as my lack of confidence in my abilities as a writer. Basically, I didn't write (in any language) because I didn't have any stories to tell. Writing fanfic in English seemed like the logical way to go - that's the language most stories are written in (at least in the fandoms I've been active) and it was clear to me that by writing fic in my own language I'd limiting myself to a tiny readership, not that I ever seriously considered writing fanfic in my own language. I always tried to downplay the whole English as a second language factor. Never posted any details that could immediately identify me as a non-native speaker. It's not that I'm not proud of where I come from or my own language, it's just that I wanted to be judged by the same standards every other writer was. I didn't want to be the girl who writes well considering English isn't her first language. I wanted to be the girl who writes well, period. I know my English is far from perfect and that my non-native speaker status slips through, no matter what, but I do my best.
The downside to this situation is that when I try to write fiction (not fanfic) in my own language it doesn't look right. It feels and looks more artificial than English does. I'm guessing it's a matter of practice and getting used to a different way for words to flow and look.
etpmvemp: I don't really, which is part of my problem in writing. Ever since I started being able to express myself in English as well as in Greek I became almost bilingual in writing. I usually favored the one language over the other for short periods of time, but I use both of them equally. This goes both for “creative” writing, and more mundane things, such as letters and diaries. I don't really know if we think in a specific language (I wonder if thinking as a process actually uses words), but when I think consciously, with the intention of turning these thoughts into words, I use the language I'm writing in, instead of translating in my head. I don't know if this is at all helpful, or even if it makes any sense, but I am not very sure of how it works myself.
janie_tangerine: I write fanfiction both in English and Italian (well, Italian not so much these days), even if Lost was the first fandom I wrote for in the language it was conceived in. I mean, when I wrote it for comic books stuff I had read the original source in Italian and same thing for shows/rps. With the premise that I can't write in Italian something I originally know in another language and I can't read it either anymore, my own language is obviously easier because I know everything that I'm doing, while in English I edit a lot more and my first draft are usually full of empty brackets I leave when a word doesn't come to me and I don't want to lose the flow to search it up. English is also more difficult because it's easier to end up repeating yourself because of vocabulary issues but that's why I spend more time on anything I write in English than I ever spent time on fic I wrote in Italian. Then things are made easier also by the fact that all the fic I read these days is in English and it does facilitate, at least in my experience.
pnr: I am so used to writing in English by now that I don't think about it. I even prefer writing in English compared to Swedish, somehow I feel I can express myself better you know? So I suppose I just let it flow?
reckess: It's really a clear border between my writings in English and in Finnish - the former is slash, the latter is other stuff, which for the past few years hasn't meant much else than school essays. In the actual writing, though, there's not much difference - I try to use as colourful a language as possible, keep in the style I've picked, and get my points across.
2) What is that you find easier in the task and what you find hardest? Related with the last part, what is that you feel like you could improve?
gottalovev: The easiest part for me is that when the character have dialog, since I listen to the shows I write about in English, it's pretty easy to get the tone or what they'd say sound kind of right because i can "hear" them talk. The hard part is sentence structure, verb tense and not having all the vocabulary for the subtleties I might have wanted to include in a description. I have no formal training aimed towards writing in English, I mean I had English classes in high school and that was it. Even in French my writing was limited to school work and I studied science, which is not somewhere you learn about writing stories. For the vocabulary, I am trying to read more in English and I also try to use thesauruses and other tools. For the structure of the text, I rely a lot on what my beta readers tell me and I surely hope that I learn by my mistakes. I've seen improvement, even if I could do better.
alemyrddin: For me, the hardest part, even though it's not directly related to the language I'm writing in, is always the plot - it's hard to come up with a story I think worth writing, and that's why I don't write many stories - I'm simply not that creative. More on topic, the thing that I deem the most important when writing in English is to avoid writing sentences that sound Italian. An English sentence is not just a collection of English words - there must a sense of English-ness in the choice and order of words. This is the hardest part for me, but also one that comes easier with exercise and if you think about your story directly in English. Obviously, a beta helps a lot, too. Grammar and spelling mistakes are less problematic for me - a good dictionary is almost enough (again, a beta helps too, but his/her work is much easier if he/she doesn't have to completely change the structure of a sentence! So that's where I try to put the most of my effort).
lenina20: The easier is the rhythm, finding combinations of words that sound pretty put together and distribute well a sentences. I feel that the sentence structure of my English doesn't sound Spanish at all, but very natural in English. The reason for this is that I'm exposed to English writing 24/7 due to my career choices. The harder is semantics. Most of time I want to convey certain feelings, images, concepts, and I really don't know the appropriate word in English. When you use a dictionary or any other resource, you can never be sure you're using the appropriate word and that word will always sound foreign to you. It will never feel like a word that has come out of your own mind and creativity. The problem is, the only way to improve this is read a lot, and write a lot. Practice (and patience) makes perfect!
fosfomifira: The easiest part is that I can't imagine doing it any other way. The characters' voices, their speech patterns are in English, so it makes sense for me to simply follow that pattern. The hardest part for me is when I can't quite find the expression I'm looking for, when I have doubts about my grammar. It's not about my vocabulary, it's more like my brain goes blank. I tend to do little google searches to see if I'm getting it right, but I always feel more comfortable and confident about a story once it's been betaed. As for what I could improve: write more ;) Seriously, I think it'd give me more confidence. The more I write, the more fics I get betaed, the more I learn from my mistakes=I make less mistakes.
etpmvemp: In some respect I find writing in English much easier, because I consider it, for the most part, a very precise language. You can express with a word in English concepts that would need a sentence in my own language. Generally, I think that a second language has the advantage of novelty: there are words that you love, that you find extremely useful and you can appreciate, because you are more aware of them than you are of the words of your own mother tongue. Having said that, the most difficult think is when you get stuck with a phrase that perfectly expresses the essence of what you are trying to say, but you can't use it because its in the wrong language, but it cannot be translated without it losing everything that made it useful. However, since you already have something so good in your hands, it is impossible to think of something else to use instead. And then again there is the problem of wanting to use a word which is very common in your own language, but doesn't even exist in English.
janie_tangerine: the easy part for me is the plot and the dialogue. I think I've developed a good ear and I've never had much of a problem coming up with a story. Also, when I actually write the thing I just go with the flow and care about the rest just when I edit, I don't do the edit-as-it-goes and for me it's easier because I first want to have the story out and then fuss over it. The hard part is avoiding making sentences sound like Italian-translated-into-English, not messing with the tenses, being concise (I wrote sentences which are waay long and I think all of my English teachers told me that in English sentences are supposed to be shorter but I never could fully get it). And the worst thing I do is that there are some words which I'm sure exist in English and then they don't and I can't stick in my head to put them there anyway (IE: I always use bis instead of encore because that's how we say it in Italian and I don't know why I think that if it's Latin then it's good for any language). Also, I tend to mix Brit English and American English, but I was taught British and mostly read/listen to music in American English, which translates in me making a mess and being mostly terrible at writing Brit characters with Desmond being the only exception.
pnr: The task of writing in a second language? I find it easier to express myself as I said. Somehow I find it easier to find the right words and expressions... stuff that we might not have in Swedish (or the equivalent sounds stupid). And when writing about fandom (discussing or writing fanfic or whatever) ir just feels wrong to do it in Swedish when the show/movie/whatever is in English. Fandomy jokes/expressions/etc just can't be translated. You lose the means/purpose of the whole thing. The hardest? I dunno really. OF course I sometimes find myself wondering how to spell things or if my grammar is fucked up, but then again it's the same for me in Swedish so xD Actually, the hardest thing is to keep my Swedish "pure" and alive haha. I am integrating English into my everyday Swedish language, and I often find myself using expressions that are translated straight form English and just sounds so wrong in Swedish cause the grammar dies or something. What do I need to improve? Well, I mix British and American English a bit too much. I'm inconsistent that way. I would like to weed out the American parts (cause my English is mainly British anyway. That's the kind we were taught in school.) And I just generally need to pay attention to what I write. Lately I have reread posts and comments (after posting then) and realise that my brain said one thing and my fingers typed another. Grammar, spelling... all fucked XD And I make typos ALL OVER.
reckess: I like writing dialogue in English, because obviously slash is a very people-centric style, so I can have fun with the characters' speech, trying to bring out their personality in it, things like that. What I'd like to improve is description, learning to use words and expressions in more diverse ways to make for more, well, "intense" text.
3) What's the advice you'd give to other people writing in second language?
gottalovev: Don't be afraid to ask for help. some beta readers will go above and beyond to tell you what is not quite right and when you get a real awesome one, they will tell you WHY. I think reading a lot helps too, to train your brain to the flow of English.
alemyrddin: If you have an idea (ha!), give it a try. It definitely comes easier and it can give you a lot of satisfaction. Use a good dictionary and don't be lazy or shy about asking for a beta reader!
lenina20: Read. Read. Read. Read. As I trained English teacher (kind of), I only have one piece of advice for learners. Read. And then read. And then read some more. It'll eventually come to you. Also, don't ever stop writing, even if the results make you feel embarrassed at the beginning. That's perfectly natural. It has happened to all of us. It gets better, quickly.
fosfomifira: Use a beta. Even if you are a great writer, even if you feel very confident about writing in a second language, it's always best to have a native speaker proof-read your text. Sometimes we don't get some expressions right, slang or whatnot and that can be very distracting for a reader, at least for me. I can't give the story the attention it deserves because my brain switches on to editing mode.
etpmvemp: Oh god. I hate giving advice and I am very bad at it, but I will give a try, but I don't think I can give you anything you can use. I think that the most important thing is reading a lot in the language you intend to use in writing: if you see it a lot, then it will be easier for you to do it (assuming of course that you can write in your own language in the first place). Also, I consider overthinking dangerous: usually the first thing that comes into your head is the best. I also think that too much “trimming” after writing can make the final text worse rather than better. Just read it again once or twice, and then have someone else look at it too: usually the really obvious mistakes are not so obvious to the person who wrote them, because he/she knows what he/she intended to write and sees that, instead of what is actually written.
janie_tangerine: First, think in English when you're writing. If I think in Italian it doesn't work. Thinking in English makes things flow way easier. Then, echoing lenina20, read. If I could write in English when I started a year and a half ago, it's because I had spent five years before then reading English fiction and fanfiction in original language. Otherwise I don't think I could have ever taken the leap.
pnr: Practice, practice, practice. Read stuff! Read different things too (books, blogs, news, fic), with different writing styles. However, be aware of what you're reading/who's written it. If you're reading someone's blog or rambling, don't pay attention to spelling for example. Cause they might very well be like me and just like spewing stuff out and not looking through it properly. If you write fic, get yourself a beta or two. Hell, that applies to anyone writing in their first language as well. And see the beta (or anyone who corrects your language) as an asset, not someone who's after you to beat you down and point and laugh.
reckess: Don't be afraid of making mistakes - beta readers are there for you, and heaven knows there isn't anything worse than a fic written in boring language because the author wants to play it safe. On the other hand, DO. NOT. Write in second language if you're only at an elementary level. Textbooks are for learning the basics of language, creative writing is for expanding the skills learned.
4) How do you approach writing Lost specifically? Have you ever tried writing Lost in your first language and if yes, how is it like?
gottalovev: I don't approach Lost differently from other fanfiction. The thing is? I have NEVER tried writing fanfiction in French. Or any other creative writing, to be honest. I've written in French solely for real life matters, and the few stories I have done were for school (and we are talking about a long LONG time ago), so I can count them on one hand. I just cannot wrap my head around writing Lost in French because I can' t imagine how the words would get out of their mouths without sounding totally stupid. Oh, I never watch the show dubbed for more than 5 minutes at the time for the same reason btw, it just does not compute. I could maybe do descriptions more easily, do internal dialog but not make the characters interact by speech. You know, I'm curious now. I wonder what it could give and if my 'style', if I have one, would be different... mmmmm....
alemyrddin: I don't have a scientific method for writing Lost (or House, which is the only other thing I've ever written). If something in an episode or in a prompt gives me an idea (usually I fill in the blanks or resolve a situation in a way I like better), then I try to write it. Since I don't usually write long and plotty fics, I don't really check canon a lot before writing (and sometimes by beta corrected me about important details!!) and my fics aim at surprising the reader with a little twist at the end. But that is not really Lost-specific only. I find myself more comfortable writing the characters I like (and therefore know) best, like Jack and Sawyer. Reading a lot of fics about them helps a lot too: even though sometimes you can find yourself writing a clicheed version of them, it's better than writing an OOC one, in my opinion.
lenina20: Ummm... Writing Lost is awfully easy when compared to other shows I've written for, such as House, because generally the situations/vocabulary/dialogues are more general and broader. I've never tried writing that in English, not really, because no one would read it. But I think the problem would be that you'd have to renounce to the particular voices of each character. You can't convey those in Spanish. Every one, naturally, will sound the same. There are different accents and manners of speaking in Spanish of course, but they can't be paralleled with those that characterizes the characters of Lost. The rest of it, the plots and dialogues and island-stuff would probably be the same. But what's the point of fic if the characters don't sound like themselves?
fosfomifira: Never. I don't think I've ever tried to write fanfic in my own language. It sounds so terribly complicated. It can be hard enough to capture a character's voice in English as it is. To make that voice recognisable in a different language sounds like hell. Maybe it's possible, but it sounds like a potential 'bang my head against every wall in my house out of sheer frustration' situation. I hate dubbed movies, so why would I do that to my writing?
etpmvemp: I don't write Lost, or fan fiction, so I can't really answer that. I expect though that the most difficult characters to write would be the ones with a way of speaking I am not used to writing in, such as Sawyer, and the easiest ones would be those who speak English as a second language (Sayid, Sun etc.)
janie_tangerine: I've written Lost in Italian. For a community where once each year there's a sort of porn challenge where you get prompts and write comment fics. Anyway, I did it last year and this year and let me tell you, it sucks. It just doesn't work. While at the first round I did it I actually had written stuff like threesomes rated nc17 which I still don't feel confident for in English, it just felt weird. But while in dialogue-less fic it felt just weird, as soon as there was dialogue the whole thing felt completely stupid. It's a whole other thing and doesn't work. I think that there was just one ficlet which I really felt satisfied with and it didn't really have much dialogue, but the rest I really wouldn't bother to translate even if I'm sure that if I did it'd sound better. When I write it in English it's way easier because I know how they speak (in Italian, I don't have one idea) and after a year and a half I feel fairly confident with most people. But if I write Lost I need to check a lot of canon stuff which I don't do for other shows and I do an awful lot of research which I don't do for other shows. And that's all the specific I can say also because Lost is 98% what I write now so it's not like I have much other fandoms to compare my approach with. Also, I used to translate English fics into Italian for a couple of friends way back (not my fics though) and even if it was an RPS AU and so it was kind of easier to do the work, the translation didn't really compare.
reckess (who will eventually end up writing Lost, I know she will): I haven't written Lost yet and I haven't tried writing anything in first language except some j-rock crap (please, Gods of Slash, forgive me) when I was first getting into fanfic. I don't think I'll try it again - Harry Potter is the only fandom I can think of it working in. XD
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Now, clearly who has already answered the questions doesn't have to do it again but I'd say we could go and discuss the hell out of this. ;) If you're foreigner and didn't answer up there and want to do it now that'd be awesome! And for native English speakers, please do join and give us some advice/input/anything on whatever you feel like, it'd be great to hear your two cents!
Okay, this be the actual questions. I copied and pasted as they were on my journal and I sincerely hope I didn't mess answers up, if I did notify me and I'll check. If someone who hasn't answered them wants to do it, here is the list:
1) How do you approach writing in a second language opposite writing in your own?
2) What is that you find easier in the task and what you find hardest? Related with the last part, what is that you feel like you could improve?
3) What's the advice you'd give to other people writing in second language?
4) How do you approach writing Lost specifically? Have you ever tried writing Lost in your first language and if yes, how is it like?
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1) How do you approach writing in a second language opposite writing in your own?
gottalovev: Writing in English is something I have to take my time to do, mostly, as writing French (while it's a tricky language as a rule) generally flows. I am confident in my French and always doubt my English. So what I do is that I try to write in 'proper' English as I go, hoping it becomes a second nature, but sometimes I stumble on a word that I don't know or an expression that I wish I could use. If I'm in those rare moments where the words are stumbling out, I might put a word in French and come back later, but generally I try to work around the obstacle and re-think my idea. I re-read and edit all the time, trying to whip the story in shape, and that process doesn't wait until I am done with it. When I think I've done as much as I could, I send it to beta (unless it's a drabble or very short/fast fic like the Luau stuff), and rely a LOT on the beta job to learn more.
alemyrddin: Actually, I don't write in my own language at all. At least, not fic. I write work-related papers, but the two processes, as you might guess, are largely different.
I find myself more comfortable writing fics in English because I've always read fanfic in that language, and it's been at least 2 years since I starting watching the show in English as well. I often find myself thinking in English when I think about Lost. Therefore the terms come more easily to my mind in that language, and I think the story flows better. I've tried a couple of times to read fic in Italian, but it just doesn't work for me.
lenina20: I don't write much in Spanish, so I'm much more used to the rhythm of words in English. Rhythm is very important for me, the number of words per cent needs to sound right, and maybe because I only read in English and mostly write in English as well, that comes naturally. In Spanish, I worry much more about semantic nuances of words that in English evade me. I think it could be said that my writing in English is more superficial. I worry more about how it sounds than about what actually says, in terms of wording.
fosfomifira: I ... I don't know. I really don't write fiction in my own language, so I'm basically writing in the only way I know, the only way I've ever written fiction. Obviously, it took me some time to gain the confidence to write fiction in English, but what held me back wasn't the language itself as much as my lack of confidence in my abilities as a writer. Basically, I didn't write (in any language) because I didn't have any stories to tell. Writing fanfic in English seemed like the logical way to go - that's the language most stories are written in (at least in the fandoms I've been active) and it was clear to me that by writing fic in my own language I'd limiting myself to a tiny readership, not that I ever seriously considered writing fanfic in my own language. I always tried to downplay the whole English as a second language factor. Never posted any details that could immediately identify me as a non-native speaker. It's not that I'm not proud of where I come from or my own language, it's just that I wanted to be judged by the same standards every other writer was. I didn't want to be the girl who writes well considering English isn't her first language. I wanted to be the girl who writes well, period. I know my English is far from perfect and that my non-native speaker status slips through, no matter what, but I do my best.
The downside to this situation is that when I try to write fiction (not fanfic) in my own language it doesn't look right. It feels and looks more artificial than English does. I'm guessing it's a matter of practice and getting used to a different way for words to flow and look.
etpmvemp: I don't really, which is part of my problem in writing. Ever since I started being able to express myself in English as well as in Greek I became almost bilingual in writing. I usually favored the one language over the other for short periods of time, but I use both of them equally. This goes both for “creative” writing, and more mundane things, such as letters and diaries. I don't really know if we think in a specific language (I wonder if thinking as a process actually uses words), but when I think consciously, with the intention of turning these thoughts into words, I use the language I'm writing in, instead of translating in my head. I don't know if this is at all helpful, or even if it makes any sense, but I am not very sure of how it works myself.
janie_tangerine: I write fanfiction both in English and Italian (well, Italian not so much these days), even if Lost was the first fandom I wrote for in the language it was conceived in. I mean, when I wrote it for comic books stuff I had read the original source in Italian and same thing for shows/rps. With the premise that I can't write in Italian something I originally know in another language and I can't read it either anymore, my own language is obviously easier because I know everything that I'm doing, while in English I edit a lot more and my first draft are usually full of empty brackets I leave when a word doesn't come to me and I don't want to lose the flow to search it up. English is also more difficult because it's easier to end up repeating yourself because of vocabulary issues but that's why I spend more time on anything I write in English than I ever spent time on fic I wrote in Italian. Then things are made easier also by the fact that all the fic I read these days is in English and it does facilitate, at least in my experience.
pnr: I am so used to writing in English by now that I don't think about it. I even prefer writing in English compared to Swedish, somehow I feel I can express myself better you know? So I suppose I just let it flow?
reckess: It's really a clear border between my writings in English and in Finnish - the former is slash, the latter is other stuff, which for the past few years hasn't meant much else than school essays. In the actual writing, though, there's not much difference - I try to use as colourful a language as possible, keep in the style I've picked, and get my points across.
2) What is that you find easier in the task and what you find hardest? Related with the last part, what is that you feel like you could improve?
gottalovev: The easiest part for me is that when the character have dialog, since I listen to the shows I write about in English, it's pretty easy to get the tone or what they'd say sound kind of right because i can "hear" them talk. The hard part is sentence structure, verb tense and not having all the vocabulary for the subtleties I might have wanted to include in a description. I have no formal training aimed towards writing in English, I mean I had English classes in high school and that was it. Even in French my writing was limited to school work and I studied science, which is not somewhere you learn about writing stories. For the vocabulary, I am trying to read more in English and I also try to use thesauruses and other tools. For the structure of the text, I rely a lot on what my beta readers tell me and I surely hope that I learn by my mistakes. I've seen improvement, even if I could do better.
alemyrddin: For me, the hardest part, even though it's not directly related to the language I'm writing in, is always the plot - it's hard to come up with a story I think worth writing, and that's why I don't write many stories - I'm simply not that creative. More on topic, the thing that I deem the most important when writing in English is to avoid writing sentences that sound Italian. An English sentence is not just a collection of English words - there must a sense of English-ness in the choice and order of words. This is the hardest part for me, but also one that comes easier with exercise and if you think about your story directly in English. Obviously, a beta helps a lot, too. Grammar and spelling mistakes are less problematic for me - a good dictionary is almost enough (again, a beta helps too, but his/her work is much easier if he/she doesn't have to completely change the structure of a sentence! So that's where I try to put the most of my effort).
lenina20: The easier is the rhythm, finding combinations of words that sound pretty put together and distribute well a sentences. I feel that the sentence structure of my English doesn't sound Spanish at all, but very natural in English. The reason for this is that I'm exposed to English writing 24/7 due to my career choices. The harder is semantics. Most of time I want to convey certain feelings, images, concepts, and I really don't know the appropriate word in English. When you use a dictionary or any other resource, you can never be sure you're using the appropriate word and that word will always sound foreign to you. It will never feel like a word that has come out of your own mind and creativity. The problem is, the only way to improve this is read a lot, and write a lot. Practice (and patience) makes perfect!
fosfomifira: The easiest part is that I can't imagine doing it any other way. The characters' voices, their speech patterns are in English, so it makes sense for me to simply follow that pattern. The hardest part for me is when I can't quite find the expression I'm looking for, when I have doubts about my grammar. It's not about my vocabulary, it's more like my brain goes blank. I tend to do little google searches to see if I'm getting it right, but I always feel more comfortable and confident about a story once it's been betaed. As for what I could improve: write more ;) Seriously, I think it'd give me more confidence. The more I write, the more fics I get betaed, the more I learn from my mistakes=I make less mistakes.
etpmvemp: In some respect I find writing in English much easier, because I consider it, for the most part, a very precise language. You can express with a word in English concepts that would need a sentence in my own language. Generally, I think that a second language has the advantage of novelty: there are words that you love, that you find extremely useful and you can appreciate, because you are more aware of them than you are of the words of your own mother tongue. Having said that, the most difficult think is when you get stuck with a phrase that perfectly expresses the essence of what you are trying to say, but you can't use it because its in the wrong language, but it cannot be translated without it losing everything that made it useful. However, since you already have something so good in your hands, it is impossible to think of something else to use instead. And then again there is the problem of wanting to use a word which is very common in your own language, but doesn't even exist in English.
janie_tangerine: the easy part for me is the plot and the dialogue. I think I've developed a good ear and I've never had much of a problem coming up with a story. Also, when I actually write the thing I just go with the flow and care about the rest just when I edit, I don't do the edit-as-it-goes and for me it's easier because I first want to have the story out and then fuss over it. The hard part is avoiding making sentences sound like Italian-translated-into-English, not messing with the tenses, being concise (I wrote sentences which are waay long and I think all of my English teachers told me that in English sentences are supposed to be shorter but I never could fully get it). And the worst thing I do is that there are some words which I'm sure exist in English and then they don't and I can't stick in my head to put them there anyway (IE: I always use bis instead of encore because that's how we say it in Italian and I don't know why I think that if it's Latin then it's good for any language). Also, I tend to mix Brit English and American English, but I was taught British and mostly read/listen to music in American English, which translates in me making a mess and being mostly terrible at writing Brit characters with Desmond being the only exception.
pnr: The task of writing in a second language? I find it easier to express myself as I said. Somehow I find it easier to find the right words and expressions... stuff that we might not have in Swedish (or the equivalent sounds stupid). And when writing about fandom (discussing or writing fanfic or whatever) ir just feels wrong to do it in Swedish when the show/movie/whatever is in English. Fandomy jokes/expressions/etc just can't be translated. You lose the means/purpose of the whole thing. The hardest? I dunno really. OF course I sometimes find myself wondering how to spell things or if my grammar is fucked up, but then again it's the same for me in Swedish so xD Actually, the hardest thing is to keep my Swedish "pure" and alive haha. I am integrating English into my everyday Swedish language, and I often find myself using expressions that are translated straight form English and just sounds so wrong in Swedish cause the grammar dies or something. What do I need to improve? Well, I mix British and American English a bit too much. I'm inconsistent that way. I would like to weed out the American parts (cause my English is mainly British anyway. That's the kind we were taught in school.) And I just generally need to pay attention to what I write. Lately I have reread posts and comments (after posting then) and realise that my brain said one thing and my fingers typed another. Grammar, spelling... all fucked XD And I make typos ALL OVER.
reckess: I like writing dialogue in English, because obviously slash is a very people-centric style, so I can have fun with the characters' speech, trying to bring out their personality in it, things like that. What I'd like to improve is description, learning to use words and expressions in more diverse ways to make for more, well, "intense" text.
3) What's the advice you'd give to other people writing in second language?
gottalovev: Don't be afraid to ask for help. some beta readers will go above and beyond to tell you what is not quite right and when you get a real awesome one, they will tell you WHY. I think reading a lot helps too, to train your brain to the flow of English.
alemyrddin: If you have an idea (ha!), give it a try. It definitely comes easier and it can give you a lot of satisfaction. Use a good dictionary and don't be lazy or shy about asking for a beta reader!
lenina20: Read. Read. Read. Read. As I trained English teacher (kind of), I only have one piece of advice for learners. Read. And then read. And then read some more. It'll eventually come to you. Also, don't ever stop writing, even if the results make you feel embarrassed at the beginning. That's perfectly natural. It has happened to all of us. It gets better, quickly.
fosfomifira: Use a beta. Even if you are a great writer, even if you feel very confident about writing in a second language, it's always best to have a native speaker proof-read your text. Sometimes we don't get some expressions right, slang or whatnot and that can be very distracting for a reader, at least for me. I can't give the story the attention it deserves because my brain switches on to editing mode.
etpmvemp: Oh god. I hate giving advice and I am very bad at it, but I will give a try, but I don't think I can give you anything you can use. I think that the most important thing is reading a lot in the language you intend to use in writing: if you see it a lot, then it will be easier for you to do it (assuming of course that you can write in your own language in the first place). Also, I consider overthinking dangerous: usually the first thing that comes into your head is the best. I also think that too much “trimming” after writing can make the final text worse rather than better. Just read it again once or twice, and then have someone else look at it too: usually the really obvious mistakes are not so obvious to the person who wrote them, because he/she knows what he/she intended to write and sees that, instead of what is actually written.
janie_tangerine: First, think in English when you're writing. If I think in Italian it doesn't work. Thinking in English makes things flow way easier. Then, echoing lenina20, read. If I could write in English when I started a year and a half ago, it's because I had spent five years before then reading English fiction and fanfiction in original language. Otherwise I don't think I could have ever taken the leap.
pnr: Practice, practice, practice. Read stuff! Read different things too (books, blogs, news, fic), with different writing styles. However, be aware of what you're reading/who's written it. If you're reading someone's blog or rambling, don't pay attention to spelling for example. Cause they might very well be like me and just like spewing stuff out and not looking through it properly. If you write fic, get yourself a beta or two. Hell, that applies to anyone writing in their first language as well. And see the beta (or anyone who corrects your language) as an asset, not someone who's after you to beat you down and point and laugh.
reckess: Don't be afraid of making mistakes - beta readers are there for you, and heaven knows there isn't anything worse than a fic written in boring language because the author wants to play it safe. On the other hand, DO. NOT. Write in second language if you're only at an elementary level. Textbooks are for learning the basics of language, creative writing is for expanding the skills learned.
4) How do you approach writing Lost specifically? Have you ever tried writing Lost in your first language and if yes, how is it like?
gottalovev: I don't approach Lost differently from other fanfiction. The thing is? I have NEVER tried writing fanfiction in French. Or any other creative writing, to be honest. I've written in French solely for real life matters, and the few stories I have done were for school (and we are talking about a long LONG time ago), so I can count them on one hand. I just cannot wrap my head around writing Lost in French because I can' t imagine how the words would get out of their mouths without sounding totally stupid. Oh, I never watch the show dubbed for more than 5 minutes at the time for the same reason btw, it just does not compute. I could maybe do descriptions more easily, do internal dialog but not make the characters interact by speech. You know, I'm curious now. I wonder what it could give and if my 'style', if I have one, would be different... mmmmm....
alemyrddin: I don't have a scientific method for writing Lost (or House, which is the only other thing I've ever written). If something in an episode or in a prompt gives me an idea (usually I fill in the blanks or resolve a situation in a way I like better), then I try to write it. Since I don't usually write long and plotty fics, I don't really check canon a lot before writing (and sometimes by beta corrected me about important details!!) and my fics aim at surprising the reader with a little twist at the end. But that is not really Lost-specific only. I find myself more comfortable writing the characters I like (and therefore know) best, like Jack and Sawyer. Reading a lot of fics about them helps a lot too: even though sometimes you can find yourself writing a clicheed version of them, it's better than writing an OOC one, in my opinion.
lenina20: Ummm... Writing Lost is awfully easy when compared to other shows I've written for, such as House, because generally the situations/vocabulary/dialogues are more general and broader. I've never tried writing that in English, not really, because no one would read it. But I think the problem would be that you'd have to renounce to the particular voices of each character. You can't convey those in Spanish. Every one, naturally, will sound the same. There are different accents and manners of speaking in Spanish of course, but they can't be paralleled with those that characterizes the characters of Lost. The rest of it, the plots and dialogues and island-stuff would probably be the same. But what's the point of fic if the characters don't sound like themselves?
fosfomifira: Never. I don't think I've ever tried to write fanfic in my own language. It sounds so terribly complicated. It can be hard enough to capture a character's voice in English as it is. To make that voice recognisable in a different language sounds like hell. Maybe it's possible, but it sounds like a potential 'bang my head against every wall in my house out of sheer frustration' situation. I hate dubbed movies, so why would I do that to my writing?
etpmvemp: I don't write Lost, or fan fiction, so I can't really answer that. I expect though that the most difficult characters to write would be the ones with a way of speaking I am not used to writing in, such as Sawyer, and the easiest ones would be those who speak English as a second language (Sayid, Sun etc.)
janie_tangerine: I've written Lost in Italian. For a community where once each year there's a sort of porn challenge where you get prompts and write comment fics. Anyway, I did it last year and this year and let me tell you, it sucks. It just doesn't work. While at the first round I did it I actually had written stuff like threesomes rated nc17 which I still don't feel confident for in English, it just felt weird. But while in dialogue-less fic it felt just weird, as soon as there was dialogue the whole thing felt completely stupid. It's a whole other thing and doesn't work. I think that there was just one ficlet which I really felt satisfied with and it didn't really have much dialogue, but the rest I really wouldn't bother to translate even if I'm sure that if I did it'd sound better. When I write it in English it's way easier because I know how they speak (in Italian, I don't have one idea) and after a year and a half I feel fairly confident with most people. But if I write Lost I need to check a lot of canon stuff which I don't do for other shows and I do an awful lot of research which I don't do for other shows. And that's all the specific I can say also because Lost is 98% what I write now so it's not like I have much other fandoms to compare my approach with. Also, I used to translate English fics into Italian for a couple of friends way back (not my fics though) and even if it was an RPS AU and so it was kind of easier to do the work, the translation didn't really compare.
reckess (who will eventually end up writing Lost, I know she will): I haven't written Lost yet and I haven't tried writing anything in first language except some j-rock crap (please, Gods of Slash, forgive me) when I was first getting into fanfic. I don't think I'll try it again - Harry Potter is the only fandom I can think of it working in. XD
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Now, clearly who has already answered the questions doesn't have to do it again but I'd say we could go and discuss the hell out of this. ;) If you're foreigner and didn't answer up there and want to do it now that'd be awesome! And for native English speakers, please do join and give us some advice/input/anything on whatever you feel like, it'd be great to hear your two cents!