Why Steven Moffat Isn't All That

[arabian]

I put in "empty writer steven moffat" into my google search on a whim to see if this comm would pop up and saw this:

Comments

[larissa_j]

The idea that someone as empty as Song could actually be a romantic foil for the Doctor goes way beyond distasteful.

And that's pretty much it, isn't it? And the comments about GitF had me cracking up.

The comments ranged from the Moffat-lovers jumping all over the writer (including many males not thinking misogyny is a problem)

And this is different from any other non Moffat loving post how? They simply cannot handle criticism even if it's presented logically and with facts.

Remember back when butterfly mentioned that she might not watch S5 and some idiot jumped all over her and actually said she should? As though she had no right consider her own personal viewing choices because OMG Moffat and you must watch!!!!!

It's like... what? Are you kidding me? It's now a duty to watch S5 because Moffat is in charge? This fandom is crazyThe writer above does have many good points but the best is that Moffat seriously jumped the shark with SiL/FotD. Those were supposed to be his best episodes. The ones that showed he was ready to take the helm in

[butterfly]

Remember back when [info]butterfly mentioned that she might not watch S5 and some idiot jumped all over her and actually said she should? As though she had no right consider her own personal viewing choices because OMG Moffat and you must watch!!!!!

The amusing thing to me was the argument that I'd never really watched Moffat's version of the Doctor and so I owed it to myself to try it out. Considering how out-of-character Moffat's version of RTD's Doctor was, if he wasn't going for his own version of the Doctor, then he's just a crappy writer.

[larissa_j]

so I owed it to myself to try it out.

*giggles* Right. Absolutely. You know, you've never had my cat yak in your shoes either. It's an experience he feels you shouldn't miss. I think you should send me your best pair of shoes and I'll have him yak in them for you.

And don't tell me you don't like cat yak. If you've not given it a chance, you're not being fair to the yak.

[butterfly]

I know. It's such a completely illogical argument. I know what Moffat's writing is like (just like I know what stepping in cat yak feels like). I don't need to try this new, specific variety of Moffat-writing to know that I won't like it.

[butterfly]

I'll rewrite 100% if I have to. With Steven Moffat's scripts, I don't touch a word, but anyone else's I do.

The thing that amuses me about this quote is that we heard recently that Moffat had it in his contract, from the very beginning, that RTD wasn't to touch his work. So it wasn't actually a voluntary thing.

Basically, the writer details so many of the misogynistic issues that those of who are NOT Moffat-fans have. Detailed and broken-down with logic and not presented under a haze of Doctor/Rose 4-eva twuwub, so there's some legitimate weight behind the words! Awesome.

The person on your journal who is arguing for misogyny in television makes my heart hurt.

*sigh*

[arabian]

God, I know! I just, just, yeah, no words.

[larissa_j]

The person on your journal who is arguing for misogyny in television makes my heart hurt.

And they're serious? Wow. Is this person a ... fan of Moffat's writing or did they come by just to troll your journal?

[butterfly]

It was said in a public post, so I'll go ahead and repost the entire quote for you:

Is it really bad that Moffat is misogynist in his writing? I've never seen that as a flaw, and I take his stories as his imagination at work.

That's to say that I've never watched Coupling, but I do know the man is all male and if that influences his writing, that's fine. TV does not need to be completely reflective of society as a whole.

"All male"

As opposed to, I suppose, Russell T Davies, who dares to write women as equals and thus is less than 'all male' (I think his boyfriend would disagree).

[principia]

Having dealt with someone who was literally claiming not to have heard the words coming out of Sir Moffat's mouth in the GitF commentary, I know that people who seem to otherwise be sensible will insistently put on blinders in order to justify themselves about their preference for his style of writing.

I don't so much mind the people who will up and admit that they've seen and heard it all, parsed his stories, and just don't care... it's the people who want to close their eyes, put their hands over their ears, and scream LALALALALAICAN'THEARYOU so they don't have to admit to themselves that they're sticking up for a misogynistic ass that drive me spare.

Setting aside the misogyny for the moment, I'm not sure that the BBC understands how profoundly his anti-continuity, standalone writing style is going to change the program. I think they're going to end up losing a lot of the new viewers RTD's Who has picked up, since they seem to be going backwards a good twenty-five years in the style of stories Who will be telling

[arabian]

I think they're going to end up losing a lot of the new viewers RTD's Who has picked up
I was telling butterfly tonight, these are the potential factions of viewers I could see going bye-bye ...

- Tennant fangirls/boys
- Billie fangirls/boys
- Rusty fangirls/boys
- Catherine Tate fangirls/boys
- Viewers who found that they really enjoyed the emotional character-based nature of new Who
- Anti-Moffat viewers
- Fans of Classic Who who can not even imagine that the Doctor thinks of sex let alone goes around shagging a different girl each week (ala the Doctor "James Bond" Who that's been hinted at by Moffat)
- Parents who now see plenty o' wink, wink, nudge, nudge as well as in-your-face sexuality on their safe, "children's" show
- Women who don't want their daughters watching the sexism and misogynism that Moffat hands out

Sure, each of these factions won't alone be much, but I do believe that members of all of the above WILL jump ship and all of those WILL add up. Someone (maybe even butterfly) pointed out somewhere that in checking the ratings, Moffat

[principia]

Someone (maybe even butterfly) pointed out somewhere that in checking the ratings, Moffat's episodes have ALWAYS been lower rated than the episodes before and after them.

I thought it was a bit telling that RTD has crowed in multiple commentaries on the DVDs about The Unicorn and the Wasp pulling 8.4 million eyeballs, smack during the middle of a series when the ratings are usually down considerably. It's not even one of his own scripts, or even his original story idea (having an Agatha Christie historical was Phil Collinson's concept), and yet he's incredibly proud of how well it did.

Is that a swipe at Moffat? Could be... although I find it even more compelling that he will gladly talk up other writers' work, versus casting everyone else as the class dunce in comparison to himself.

Chalk and cheese, man, chalk and cheese.

[arabian]

RTD is the kind of guy who appears to love to share the credit and joy, and then take the fall when it doesn't work.

I really, really heart RTD.

(BTW: I've seen and enjoyed your posts here and elsewhere, is it cool if I friend you?)

[x_bluerose_x]

Thank you, thank you, thank you... I was beginning to wonder if I was the only one who wasn't heralding Moffat's oncoming leadership of Who as this wonderful, beautiful thing which would save the show and make it even better. His stories HAVE gone downhill. I HATED River and found the second part of the two-parter predictable and clumsy. Agreed also on the misogyny.

I miss RTD already, and I'm not so sure I'll be sticking around for season five--which kills me, because this is my fav show. :(

[arabian]

No, it's not just us. Other people DO actually see it. I KNOW!!!
I HATED River and found the second part of the two-parter predictable and clumsy.
I didn't like River much at all and that really bummed me because I do love Alex Kingston.
I miss RTD already
Me too, but I just keep reminding myself we still have five more episodes with him. I will squeeze them and hug them and call them George.

[x_bluerose_x]

It's like I keep saying about other shows: it's not the actors; it's the WRITING. Moffat isn't a god; stop saying you won't edit a line of his work. ALL published writers need editors and betas no matter who the hell they are.

I'm so happy I found this place. I want to huggles it and call it George. Or something.

BTW, I run ten_support. Would you like to affiliate with us? We're a group that's all about the Tenth Doctor and nothing but, a nice bastion of Ten!fix in a sea of SM with our upcoming Eleven.

[arabian]

I'm so happy I found this place. I want to huggles it and call it George. Or something.
I am SO glad that I decided to just go for it and that butterfly was awesome to go into it with me.
BTW, I run ten_support. Would you like to affiliate with us?
I don't have a problem with that and I doubt highly that butterfly would either.

ETA: I am SO sorry for the constant edits. My brain is not working.