Comments | the_summoning

the_summoning_d

TW:CoE

Jul 26, 2009 12:56

Finally saw Torchwood: CoE. I know this is an unpopular opinion right now, but you know what? I'm happy. I have no complaints.

Plus I think Jack did the right thing, and I'll defend my corner against all comers.

epic flaily joy, emotionally overinvested in fandom, fandom: torchwood, fandom

Comments 15

tarlanx July 26 2009, 12:23:28 UTC

I'm with you on this. I hated that Ianto died but could understand that, realistically, it could happen anytime in the kind of work they are doing.

So many people were disgusted that Jack never told Ianto he loved him as he was dying but it was there in every single look, in every word and action. It was there in the way he begged the 456 to save Ianto, willing to give up millions of children just to save Ianto! I'm always so confused that people cannot SEE love unless it has those three words spoken aloud!

I felt sad again when he had to sacrifice his grandson to save those millions of other children. In some ways I feel like he saw it as fitting self-punishment for letting the 456 have those 12 children all those years ago - the fallout eventually causing Ianto's death.

I could even understand his need to run...to get away from the pain that every moment on Earth caused for him.

the_summoning_d July 26 2009, 14:28:34 UTC

I suppose it depends on your definition of love. I don't doubt that Jack, in his own way, has loved the majority of the - many, many - people he's slept with. In the same way that he loves all of his team. I don't understand people who put J/I on a pedestal, though (I'll be honest, the twu-wuv-and-curtains brigade kind of turned me against the pairing)

As for the rest - needs of the many versus the needs of the few and so on. The death of one child versus a living nightmare for approximately 130 million children. It's hard to stomach, but it was the right decision.

And Jack will bounce back. Immortality doesn't offer the option of giving up: he can either go insane or deal with it. And given that he recovered from being abandoned on the Gamestation, a solid year of imprisonment and torture, a thousand and some years buried alive, two of his team being murdered by his brother...I think he'll recover from this just fine.

ultrapsychobrat July 26 2009, 13:05:00 UTC

I could accept everything better if anyone had spent time figuring out what to do until the last thirty minutes--a definite plot device or hole, depending on your point of view.

the_summoning_d July 26 2009, 15:08:55 UTC

Last night I was looking at a list of 'fantasy warnings', one of which was "warning: this story is 150000 words long, but could have been resolved in 1000 words if the characters hadn't acted like morons for the first 149000". CoE felt a bit like that.

liliaeth August 30 2009, 14:43:30 UTC

But here's the thing, sure they could have started resolving things sooner... if the government hadn't screwed them over by sending Miss Johnson to kill Jack, destroy Torchwood and basically get in their way as much as possible.

ladyalcamy July 26 2009, 14:27:21 UTC

Believe me, it's not an unpopular opinion at all. As far as I've seen, the majority of viewers (and reviewers) thought it was rather brilliant television. Personally, I loved it. I've watched it twice so far and will probably do so again in the near future. Yeah, I think I might be a bit of a masochist, but there's just so many amazing performances in it. :)

the_summoning_d July 26 2009, 15:06:28 UTC

Uh, no, I meant that the ending of Day 4 made me happy (whereas across fandom there was much wailing and gnashing of teeth)

pandoras_closet July 26 2009, 18:48:10 UTC

Jack did what he felt he had to do. The morality of it is up for debate.

As far as running, Jack's a runner. He ran from the Time Agency after his memory was wiped. Jack was running when he met the Doctor. Hell, if it weren't for Ianto, Jack likely would have run after 2000 years of being underground, or when the world was reset during the whole thing with the Master.

That's why Jack loves the Doctor so much. His TARDIS is the ultimate vehicle for running.

the_summoning_d July 26 2009, 19:47:20 UTC

Oops, polite disagreement time. I think your interpretation of events gives Ianto a lot more credit than mine does.

pandoras_closet July 26 2009, 19:52:17 UTC

No doubt.

My point is, Jack runs unless he has a reason to stay. Leaving Torchwood with everyone but Gwen dead and his own grandson's death on his shoulders is just par for the course.

jaxomsride July 26 2009, 19:57:29 UTC

I would have liked it more if it had been better written. In parts COE was like a bad fanfic with the ideas poorly executed.

Captain Jack tricked and lied to the children to make them go with the aliens, he lied to his nephew in the same way. He never gave the kid a chance to choose to sacrifice himself to save the rest.

liliaeth August 30 2009, 14:46:06 UTC

But wouldn't that be placing responsibility for the choice on the kid's shoulder. Esp. when he knew that they couldn't accept a no. Since they didn't have the time to go look for another kid?

Because it wouldn't really have been a choice to begin with. This way Jack doesn't even try and deny the blame for what he does to Stephen.

jaxomsride August 30 2009, 16:08:47 UTC

He didn't even give Stephen the chance to say no. It cheapens the sacrifice Stephen made, to treat him like the sacrificial lamb rather than a thinking being.
Yes it was a heavy responsibility, the fate of the entire human race and all that. Yet its assumed the kid isn't able to make the sacrifice knowingly and willingly..
No, he isn't allowed to be brave and its perfectly all right to lie to children and make the decisions for them. Stephen went to his death unknowing, betrayed and deceived.
What Jack did in the first place was bad enough, what he did to Stephen was despicable.