Of intellectually and morally challenged Angels and their ineffable God who works in mysterious ways

[su_darklily]

First off, please be careful of spoilers if you continue reading, I will be referencing material from 5.18 but the material is not limited to only 5.18.

Thank you Supernatural Wiki!!  All quotes supplied in this post was referenced at the below site, I know I couldn’t have completed this post without them.

http://www.

Comments

[canyon_deye]

You blew my mind again. How do you do it? It's like you bring Supernatural to a whole new level.

Anyway. Excellent meta *applauds*

then there is no point in trying to force Dean to follow his destiny since regardless of whatever Michael does or does not and however Dean might try, the plan will play itself out perfectly.

True. This was my point exactly after that episode. However, well, on the other hand that's exactly the problem with determinism like that - does it or does it not entitle us to, you know, just sit and wait for our destinies to happen. I don't really know how to explain it understandably. The situations and environments will always drive us to our certain destinations, but without the situations and environments it wouldn't happen. Michael has to try and force Dean, because if he doesn't, his destiny will not be the one he would like it to be. It's like time travelling, even if you go to the future and see you've done something, you still have to actually do it, otherwise it will not happen

Always a pleasure ^^

[canyon_deye]

Hi Elina

Re: Always a pleasure ^^

[canyon_deye]

First off, Happy birthday, Su!

Secondly, I have no idea if I'm capable of putting anything I'm thinking into words. I feel like once I come to a conclusion of some kind, the idea starts slipping away from me immidiately. I'll watch the new episode and think some more and then I'll be back. ^__^

Anyway -- to go back to the basics, it's about if we believe that our lives are forethought and that we have no say in what will to happen us eventually. If God has a plan for us, as they claim in Supernatural, then I guess it's reasonable to say free will is indeed an illusion and that everything will always drive Dean to the destination God wants him to. What God wants might not be what everybody thinks he does, but still. However if we choose to believe all life is just a sum of random coincidences, then anything might happen, but if that was the case in Supernatural, why God put Sam and Dean on that plane would make no sense. Are we supposed to believe he cared enough to save two random little pieces of the universe but that he doesn't

Re: Always a pleasure ^^

[su_darklily]

Thank you Elina. I had a lovely birthday (even though I did have a bit of a cold

[sistermagpie]

Hee! This is awesome. I've always loved the way the angels are so ham-handed about trying to deal with Dean and humans. Always they're bragging about how inferior humans are, as if tricking a baby, yet they always get it completely wrong to the point where, as you say, it's insulting. Like back last season when Zach was plying Dean with hamburgers and women

Thank you ^^

[sistermagpie]

You know, I wasn't too confident about posting this because I was thinking it was too long (y'know tltr so no one will bother reading) and also because I was trying so hard to get it to say exactly what I wanted it to say

Re: Thank you ^^

[su_darklily]

that was me ^^;

Can't believe I didn't notice I was logging in as anon.

[etoile444]

I love your idea that the angels are at some lower, childish level in their development and thus unable to comprehend human motivation.

I like that you see the failure in all angels, not just the fallen.

I was thinking this morning: "Michael needs to go to Hell" and I laughed at myself because Michael hasn't done anything to prove himself a "good" angel. His righteousness is likely what got everyone in the mess in the first place.

Qualifications for falling to Hell

[su_darklily]

Hi Threecatmama ^^

I was wondering what a 'good' angel would be like when I wrote this post.

So far, I haven't seen any that I would be classify as a 'good' angel (my definition would include mercy and understanding as mandatorys trait for starters) in SPN.

So when you talked about Michael proving himself a 'good' angel, it made me laugh too because by 5.18, he's starting look like just about the worst angel out of the pretty tarnished lot.

So that made me wonder about how an angel (or a person too actually) really qualified for Hell as vs Heaven.

Based on SPN, so far, you don't necessarily go to Hell for (in fact it's almost like these qualities are requisites for getting into Heaven);

lying
torture
killing
bribery
gluttony
lust
substance abuse
anger/violence
despair
suicide (any death which was 'asking for it')
and any other vice which I might have forgotten to mention

But then again, what I've seen of SPN's Heaven wasn't actually all that great either! I'm starting to wonder if we can get a third choice?