O Jameron, my Jameron

[roxybisquaint]

I haven't had my jameronectomy reversed, if that's what you're thinking. But it's clear that there was some sort of relationship between John and Cameron in the future that she came from and I've been thinking about what it was and why it came about.

"He wasn't talking to anyone anymore, just herI've decided John became attached to Cameron in the

Comments

[indiefic]

My take is that however manipulative Cameron is, Future!John is a thousand times as manipulative and he was manipulating Cameron so she would/could in turn manipulate his younger self.

As for the "He wasn't talking to anyone anymore, just her." line, meh. I figure General John Connor only lets people see what he wants them to see. In the end, I absolutely do not buy any sort of emotional relationship between Cameron and Future!John (Cameron and Emo!Teenage!John is an entirely different story). And I don't buy the idea that Cameron has any emotions at all, full stop.

Of course, my Jameron denial is mighty.

[bobmacpharson]

I don't think John and Cameron would ever have the type of relationship that Jameronians clamor for (I confess I am a Jameronian so typing those words is difficult). However, if you don't think Cameron has any types of emotions whatsoever I think you haven't been paying attention. One of best things about the show, IMO, is how it shows robots that are each, theoretically, completely logical, but who have developed very different personalities. And they do this not by saying "oh they just have human emotions" a la Battlestar Galactica, (or any other story with robots, pretty much), but by developing emotions that actually make sense for a machine to have

[bobmacpharson]

Some more thoughts

[indiefic]

However, if you don't think Cameron has any types of emotions whatsoever I think you haven't been paying attention.

On the contrary. I have paid attention. And what seems readily apparent to me is that Friedman and Co. intentionally keep certain aspects of the SCC universe and mythology vague enough that viewers can any number of conclusions to suit their particular bent.

You can apparently make your "malfunction error" terminator theory fit in your interpretation.

At the same time, I truly see no evidence that Cameron has any emotions. Programming yes. Conflicting sets of directives, almost certainly. But emotions? No.

Humans are great at reading emotion into situations where they don't exist. This is evidenced everywhere from The Kuleshov Effect to the teenage girl who is more than willing to attribute the characteristics of dark and brooding to the cute boy in class when in reality he just doesn't want to talk to her

[valhallalilly]

I don't think it was because of Kyle at all.

And maybe one day I will be able to exound on that statement but today is not looking like that day ;)

[roxybisquaint]

Well until you do, your comment doesn't count!

[gega_cai]

I agree, I've always thought Kyle being sent back was the catalyst for John's attachment to Cameron and overuse of machines once Derek has returned to see

[gega_cai]

That is to say, I think Kyle would have it known that using machines was wrong and Kyle's influence on John is far more gospel than Cameron's

Though, maybe John is still capable of being steps a head of Cameron (and Skynet)

[roxybisquaint]

Oh goodie. I like when I find out other people are thinking along the same lines. It makes me feel like I'm not so wacky!

And it totally makes sense, doesn't it? There has to be a motivation for the son of Sarah Connor - the man who lives through the apocalypse, witnesses the slaughter of humans by machines, and is imprisoned in a Skynet work camp where the human race is that close to going out forever - would anthropomorphize to such an extent.

[equustel]

Hmm, I like this theory. It ties in with what John tells Jesse in Today is the Day, Part 2 - that he finally understands why his future self decided to depend on machines so much. "Human beings can't be replaced. They can't be rebuilt. They die and they never come back."

Present John is already dealing with the loss of his father, so it makes a sad sort of sense that he'd come to the same conclusion, and confide in Cameron for the same reasons he might have in the future.

[roxybisquaint]

Exactly! I think John's closeness to Cameron in the future she came from parallels his closeness to her in the present timeline we've seen in the show. The loss of people he cares about (even the loss of people he doesn't know, like all those FBI guys) ultimately push him toward reliance on (and companionship with) machines.

He's totally right about why they're useful - human beings can't be replaced. But until he finds the balance, things are kind of messed up for John, both in the prior timeline (future!John) and the current one (our John).

[bobmacpharson]

For the record, just so I feel like I'm at least SOMEWHAT contributing to the original conversation thread, I also agree with this idea.

[roxybisquaint]

Just so you know, I'm not ignoring your posts. They're just really long and require more thinking, so I have to save them for later. I'm looking forward to it, though,. You've got some interesting points.

[phantomwriter05]

Oh Rox the stories you tell ... ;)

I can acutally get on board with your theory where it relates to Derek's and Cameron's Timelines.

but once we get to Jesse and Riley I think we're getting into a Future!John who has spent twenty years with Cameron and has started the Resistance with her by his side. as well as given up on any attenable normal human relationship and has chosen to all but marry Cameron.

thus the comment "Telling me is the same as telling John."

notice how she doesn't say "General Connor or Connor" she says John.

but that's my theory since Strange thing happen at the 1,2 point.

[fig_aruna]

notice how she doesn't say "General Connor or Connor" she says John.

Hmm..! Never really thought about that before...

[schmacky0]

So because Cameron calls John John they're basically married? I don't buy it.

Like indiefic said way up there, they left things so vague that all of us can come to our own conclusions.

But outside of the married bit.. I'm not too sure about Cameron being with John for 20 years anyway. I don't think she was. I think the Jesse's future is where Cameron is from .. our Cameron. And I don't think she was with John for 20 years.

I do like Roxy's theory on why John has built this companionship with Cameron.. after he sent Kyle out.

[phantomwriter05]

I think you're right about the way things where written schmack