A Meta WIP Post

[rivlee]

I started this essay which I called In Defense of The Pacific back in Jan. pretty much a week before a) I got sick b) my grandmother died on my 27th birthday c) I then had to go to said grandmother's funeral d) my sister got sick e) my sister was in the hospital for a month most of that time spent in scarily bad health status we're not going to re-

Comments

[augustbird]

i cannot applaud this entry enough <3

[rivlee]

Aww, thank you, bb! And thank you for being the cool headed, calm person you are b/c I really couldn't have been that eloquent.

To be fair the most recent "incident" was just the straw that broke the camel's back for me. I'm just REALLY tired of people dismissing it out of hand. (Obvious exception for people who can't handle the subject matter or don't like historical mini-series.)

[skylilies]

i so, so agree with everything you've said here

[rivlee]

Feel free to ramble away, bb, the point of this post is for discussion.

I totally agree that The Pacific needs to percolate in the brain. You need to watch it through once, then re-watch at LEAST once more to start to get the full effect and expanse of what it's shown. It's not a show that can be taken for face value really, and some of the most amazing things are the subtle parts you don't pick up on until your third or fourth re-wathc.

BoB really does provide an instant connection b/c you meet these guys, and you're with them for 10 episodes, and it's hard not to connect with them and love them. As entertainment, I think BoB wins hands down, but idk, for me, personally, I appreciate what The Pacific does more. And like, there are parts of BoB that are really hard for me to watch, but by and large, I can re-watch and marathon all the episodes at once and be cool. No matter how often I re-watch The Pacific, when it comes to episode 9 there are cetain scenes I just have to watch through my fingers. Still

[skylilies]

first, gonna repaste something i just said to jenny on gchat

[rivlee]

IMO ALL OF THESE SERIES ARE BEAUTIFUL. AND REALLY DON'T NEED TO BE COMPARED, BECAUSE THEY'RE DIFFERENT SERIES, and really, in essence, even though the timeframe is the same, different wars.That is pretty much my mantra. B/c they are NOT the same things, one should not be held up to the other to judge what is better, even if people will do so by default. I love ALL of these series for very, very different reasons

[uniformly]

(Sorry I suddenly disappeared, I had surprise!consulate work to do :'D)

This! This everywhere and all over. I do hope that, one day, you'll have the time to iron everything out and post it. Or like, I grow the skills to organise my thoughts in a coherent manner like you can. But until then-

The Pacific is about the PTO. From the start to the end. There’s a reason why it’s called The Pacific and not Kitten Company or First Marines. As much as it is about the Marines who fought in the war, the mini-series is about the war from the bombing of Pearl Harbor to the problems with coming home after it’s all over.

This especially.

Thank you so, so much for posting this ♥

[rivlee]

You're welcome, bb! As I said, it's not done yet, I still need to do the flip side where I acknowledge the shows weaknesses on top of its strengths and go more into the historical argument. I just, I don't know if it's because I read Leckie and Sledge's memoirs before watching the miniseries, but it never felt all that disjointed or hard to follow to me, b/c I wasn't expecting it to be about the same group of Marines. :/

[uniformly]

Yeah, I mean, the show definitely has its weaknesses. The best example being, as Skew mentioned, with how they handled Basilone. Poor bloke.

I just, I don't know if it's because I read Leckie and Sledge's memoirs before watching the miniseries, but it never felt all that disjointed or hard to follow to me-

As someone who read the memoirs after (and has done a bit of reading on the Pacific in general since) viewing, I'd probably say that I've had a lot of holes filled afterward.

That's def an interesting point to bring up as well.

[rivlee]

Yes, The Pacific is far from being perfect, but then again, every show has its flaws.

BoB def. handles the passage of time (and I don't know if that's because we, as viewers, clearly see the changing of seasons on the screen), and the entertainment value much better. You don't have to read the book to get the story filled in (and, in fact, I wouldn't, but I have a ton of issues with Stephen Ambrose that belong in a whole other post).

As I told Skew, The Pacific could've def. been helped by either longer running times or a few more episodes to smooth things out

[legit]

SHANNON PLEASE LET ME JUST SAY, SINCE I HAVEN'T FINISHED READING THIS THAT I FUCKING LOVE YOU OK.

THIS, THIS IS EVERYTHING WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT AND OH GOD I JUST WANT TO PLASTER THIS ALL OVER MY LIFE AND THE INTERNET SO PEOPLE WILL STFU.

AS SOMEONE WHO IS SO SICK AND TIRED OF ARGUING THESE DIFFERENCES TILL I'VE BEEN LIKE READY TO SMASH MY FACE TO THE KEYBOARD--I AM MAKING THIS LIKE MY NEW FANDOM BIBLE OR SOMETHING.

[rivlee]

You are most welcome. And yeah, I'm a little tired of going, "You know, just because it's different doesn't mean it's crap." BoB/Gen Kill/The Pacific are all very great and valued works in their own rights and I don't know WHY people insist on that non-stop game of one unmanship.

[skew_whiff]

This is a great essay even in draft form, and very much worth saying

[rivlee]

Thanks for all your thoughts, Skew,

And yeah, I never did get to the part of the essay where I talk about the show's clear and obvious weaknesses (something that happens to all three of these shows in various forms, of course). I just never felt that disjointed in the watching of it the first time, b/c I'd already read the memoirs so I was expecting the broad approach to things, but I completely get that pretty much everyone else feels that way. And I do feel like Basilone was shoe-horned in, and you don't really get to connect to him until it's through the character of Lena, and the show could've def. benefitted from at least 2 or 3 episodes more (or longer episode run times) to clear out things which get fuddled along the way.

And re: the advertising. To me, even though it's clearly the flipside of BoB in terms of production, creation, etc, idk, I just never expected it to be the exact carbon copy. I think it actually really hurt them by trying to push the selling point of being the "continuation" of BoB.

It's different, that's